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Prot DPS in a 5 manFollow
I was going along on a 5 man heroic Violet Hold last night and didnt want to respec so I stayed Prot for somem minor DPS and offtanking. Was I ever pleasantly surprised. While I did not top the DPS charts by any means I ended the 5 man almost tied for #2 in DPS overall with a Death Knight in the group. The top spot was a Warlock and #4 was another warlock who came and had just recently hit 80 so his gear was still subpar. It made me rethink respeccing to run heroics when a tank is not needed. My tanking abilities that use my shield were doing what I thought was decent damage and the group was still getting the benefit of my BoK and imp juddgements. Just wondering if anyone else has had a similar experience or if I just happened to be in the right situation at the right time? I was also wondering what if any modifications I could make to an offset of gear that might maximize my DPS while still staying Prot spec. Just somethin Im kicking around maybe for fun or a laugh or 2.
I am a Prot Paladin and my guild also has a Prot Warrior that is pretty well geared. There are a lot of times that we will run dungeons or heroics together. I do not respec for these.
I usually let the Warrior tank the instance because he can keep his rage up better this way, so I just leave RF off and let him tank. There are plenty of times we come out #1 and #2 on the damage meters, and if something goes haywire and the healer or DPS get threat, we can get the mobs off of them before anyone dies with very little difficulty.
We have a hunter and a mage in guild that REALLY know what they are doing, so if we are running with them, they will ususally top the damage meters, but with run-of-the-mill dps, prot paladin as a DPS in a run can compete nicely.
IF you have a really nice Ret set, you can certainly do more damage as Ret, but if your Ret gear is meh, save the 100g and just stay Prot and have fun being a DPS/offtank. The best part about going to a run as a Prot-specced DPS is you don't have to focus as much on what is going on since you aren't the one trying to hold threat and take all of the hits. You can just leave RF off, and spam all of your highest damage abilities while still doing important things like keeping the mob judged and keeping the party buffed. You also have more freedom to throw a FoL, Holy Light, or even an LoH if you see the healer is struggling. Sure, your heals are pretty weak, but even a 1000 hp FoL can be a big help in just giving the healer a second or two to get things back under control.
Some instances this actually works out fabulously. The last boss in Heroic UK is hell on melee DPS. Rogues don't have enough armor/mitigation, and even DPS warriors and paladins can die in that fight. If you have a Prot Warrior, a Prot Paladin, and 2 ranged DPS, he goes down without any issues. You know how it is lately... melee DPS just refuse to back up out of the smash or whatever it is that he does, and they die. Prot Paladins and Warriors can stand in through whatever that boss does and still be at around 1/2 health.
IMO DPS'ing in Prot spec is great fun.
Edited, Dec 19th 2008 1:38pm by jeromesimina
I usually let the Warrior tank the instance because he can keep his rage up better this way, so I just leave RF off and let him tank. There are plenty of times we come out #1 and #2 on the damage meters, and if something goes haywire and the healer or DPS get threat, we can get the mobs off of them before anyone dies with very little difficulty.
We have a hunter and a mage in guild that REALLY know what they are doing, so if we are running with them, they will ususally top the damage meters, but with run-of-the-mill dps, prot paladin as a DPS in a run can compete nicely.
IF you have a really nice Ret set, you can certainly do more damage as Ret, but if your Ret gear is meh, save the 100g and just stay Prot and have fun being a DPS/offtank. The best part about going to a run as a Prot-specced DPS is you don't have to focus as much on what is going on since you aren't the one trying to hold threat and take all of the hits. You can just leave RF off, and spam all of your highest damage abilities while still doing important things like keeping the mob judged and keeping the party buffed. You also have more freedom to throw a FoL, Holy Light, or even an LoH if you see the healer is struggling. Sure, your heals are pretty weak, but even a 1000 hp FoL can be a big help in just giving the healer a second or two to get things back under control.
Some instances this actually works out fabulously. The last boss in Heroic UK is hell on melee DPS. Rogues don't have enough armor/mitigation, and even DPS warriors and paladins can die in that fight. If you have a Prot Warrior, a Prot Paladin, and 2 ranged DPS, he goes down without any issues. You know how it is lately... melee DPS just refuse to back up out of the smash or whatever it is that he does, and they die. Prot Paladins and Warriors can stand in through whatever that boss does and still be at around 1/2 health.
IMO DPS'ing in Prot spec is great fun.
Edited, Dec 19th 2008 1:38pm by jeromesimina
jeromesimina wrote:
Some instances this actually works out fabulously. The last boss in Heroic UK is hell on melee DPS. Rogues don't have enough armor/mitigation, and even DPS warriors and paladins can die in that fight. If you have a Prot Warrior, a Prot Paladin, and 2 ranged DPS, he goes down without any issues. You know how it is lately... melee DPS just refuse to back up out of the smash or whatever it is that he does, and they die. Prot Paladins and Warriors can stand in through whatever that boss does and still be at around 1/2 health.
Smash/Dark Smash are forward facing attacks...I'd be leary of any melee dps standing in front of the boss such that they'd be hit by it. (I've been tagged by Dark Smash when I was sure I was well behind the boss, but I'm pretty sure it's shadow damage anyways so I took about as much as any semi-intelligent dps hugging the boss' butt would have taken...2-3k tops).
I've hit upwards of 2k dps as a prot pally...the only difficulty I have is mana efficiency when I'm not taking any hits. Even as OT in Naxx, I find I'm stopping to drink between every pull while the warrior MT runs off towards the next group. I'd think it rude of me to RD 3 mobs off of him in a trash pull just so I could get some BoSanc mana procs, but my mana pool is so puny that Mana Strudel makes for a quick top-up. The only other option is to hold back on my standard rotation, but that defeats the purpose of an OT on those pulls...I'm there in case one of the tanks goes down by some freakish act of Gawd...if I'm not pouring on the threat, a dead tank will send trash after the squishies and that would be less than ideal.
Our last Naxx25 run kinda borked my overall dps because I was designated to work the back of the room with a feral druid on Four Horsemen. Excluding events like that, I'm often astounded by how much dps tanks are putting out these days. It's rather nice. I finally started in on my Sons of Hodir dailies today after neglecting them for far too long. Even solo as a prot pally post-expansion is so much better than it was in TBC.
Edited, Dec 19th 2008 7:43pm by AureliusSir
I think it's pretty well accepted that off-tanking can be harder than main-tanking due to mana/rage starvation issues.
Go try tanking The Culling of Stratholme. I ran dps as ret in there shortly after dinging 80 and was *barely* ahead of the tankadin at about 2100 dps.
Go try tanking The Culling of Stratholme. I ran dps as ret in there shortly after dinging 80 and was *barely* ahead of the tankadin at about 2100 dps.
Quote:
Smash/Dark Smash are forward facing attacks...
I'm pretty sure they're not, and I feel the same way with Anub'Arak's Pound.
Every single time I do those fights, someone is DPSing him from behind and dies the instant it goes off. I tell them to move away the next time, and then they don't die.
Just to clear this up: Smash is a "frontal cone" type attack, but Dark Smash is AE :)
Maulgak wrote:
Just to clear this up: Smash is a "frontal cone" type attack, but Dark Smash is AE :)
From WoWWiki:
WoWWiki wrote:
Dark Smash: Deals 8750-11250 Shadow damage to all enemies within a 10 yard cone in front of the caster. In addition, deals 1750 to 2250 Shadow damage to all enemies, knocking them down for 2 seconds. 3s cast, 2s cooldown. See "Smash" to avoid it's damage.
If you're melee behind him, you'll take token damage. It's only if you're standing in front of him that you're going to get gibbed.
Yeah, confirmed Smash and Dark Smash are frontal cone attacks. I've run heroic UK over 10 times as melee dps trying to get a guildie hunter that xbow.
Edited, Dec 21st 2008 4:30pm by ArtemisEnteri
Edited, Dec 21st 2008 4:30pm by ArtemisEnteri
yeah, prot pallies can certainly do some great dps. i've actually found quite a few times where i've been prot for a day or 2 rather than respec between raids... i've quested a bit as prot and found I could easily still do 1200 dps easily and more if I can aoe a group down.
as far as a dps set for prot, I actually have played around with this a bit. thanks to outfitter, I now have my normal ret outfit, my prot outfit and a hybrid prot soloing outfit made up of my ret gear + tanking sword and shield (heavy amounts of str help with higher weapon dps for HotR and higher shield block value than my tanking gear for SoR). using SotM for trash instead of SoV I can actually manage nearly 2k dps on a single target (less than my ret spec, but far from terrible. only downside is groups are harder and mana isn't as efficient. for most questing I find I do a lot of single target killing and find this very helpful if I happen to be prot spec questing. haven't tried this for an instance though, but I could imagine it could possibly be a valid option for those that choose to stay prot.
as far as a dps set for prot, I actually have played around with this a bit. thanks to outfitter, I now have my normal ret outfit, my prot outfit and a hybrid prot soloing outfit made up of my ret gear + tanking sword and shield (heavy amounts of str help with higher weapon dps for HotR and higher shield block value than my tanking gear for SoR). using SotM for trash instead of SoV I can actually manage nearly 2k dps on a single target (less than my ret spec, but far from terrible. only downside is groups are harder and mana isn't as efficient. for most questing I find I do a lot of single target killing and find this very helpful if I happen to be prot spec questing. haven't tried this for an instance though, but I could imagine it could possibly be a valid option for those that choose to stay prot.
AureliusSir wrote:
WoWWiki wrote:
Dark Smash: Deals 8750-11250 Shadow damage to all enemies within a 10 yard cone in front of the caster. In addition, deals 1750 to 2250 Shadow damage to all enemies, knocking them down for 2 seconds. 3s cast, 2s cooldown. See "Smash" to avoid it's damage.
The bold is what I was referring to. Since the damage comes from the same attack I didn't really see a need to differentiate ...
Maulgak wrote:
AureliusSir wrote:
WoWWiki wrote:
Dark Smash: Deals 8750-11250 Shadow damage to all enemies within a 10 yard cone in front of the caster. In addition, deals 1750 to 2250 Shadow damage to all enemies, knocking them down for 2 seconds. 3s cast, 2s cooldown. See "Smash" to avoid it's damage.
The bold is what I was referring to. Since the damage comes from the same attack I didn't really see a need to differentiate ...
I differentiate because 2k damage is trivial, but 10k can create serious issues, especially if you've got his dancing weapon up smacking on someone.
Much to my dismay I have never been the bottom of any DPS meter, even when tanking or OT as a prot pally. ShoR hits too hard, especially when you can use it twice in 2 GCD. I know it's getting nerfed, but MAN I love it's current status.
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