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What am I missing here?Follow

#1 Nov 12 2008 at 6:50 PM Rating: Decent
Ok so I've been playing Dagger Sub Rogues for ages now cause I enjoy the play style I use with them and have also done most of the normal Specs. Now that WotLK is coming out I was considering sticking with a Combat spec cause I'm tired of getting shunned from groups for being sub. (Yes I know the reasons other specs are preferred and I do agree with them lol) However I think I am missing something here. Testing my DPS using unenchanted weapons and common rotations my Sub DPS was higher then my Combat Sword DPS @_@ Here's a bit of details about what I was using...

Sub

MH - Ceds Carver - Deadly Poison
OH - Retainer's Blade - Instant Poison

Tested multiple rotations but mainly it was..

Ambush Opener - 2cp
SnD
Shadow Dance
3 Ambush
SnD
Then run either BS or SS for a 3SnD/3Rup
Personally I prefered SS cause while BS does more damage, SS = faster CP generation which keeps SnD up more reliably

Combat

MH - Merciless Glad Slicer - Deadly Poison
OH - Can't recall... it's junk though but not horrible. - Instant Poison

Tested a few rotations as well... Various openers and then leading into a 3s/5r rotation.

Did all the tests over 10 minute windows to take subs opening burst damage out of the equation and was still reliably 50+ dps higher with the sub spec. At first I though maybe it was the crappy OH but the math doesn't work out cause my sub was using a similarly crappy MH while the sword I was using the pvp sword which is light years better lol. I honestly dunno what I'm missing here since I know that with all the testing done there's no way I should be getting higher DPS with sub and I'd really like to figure it out so I can get my Rogue up to par so I can get some good groups for some of the WotLK content. Any advice as to what I am overlooking would be greatly appreciated. @_@
#2 Nov 12 2008 at 7:19 PM Rating: Excellent
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13,048 posts
I couldn't follow all of your ****** (absent) math.

All I know is that you need to read the ENTIRE rogue sticky.

The ENTIRE THING.

Don't bother posting again until you've read and understood it all.
#3 Nov 12 2008 at 7:45 PM Rating: Decent
I've read your Rogue sticky (which was very well done btw) as well as read everything else I could find that was a decent source of information. (mainly EJ and Shadow Panther) I wouldn't have posted if I hadn't. The "math" I referred to was just the fact that the DPS lost on a slightly weaker OH was no where near as much as the DPS gained by having a MUCH better MH then the Ceds I was using with the Sub Spec. Basically I can't see what I was missing that was causing the Combat spec to have lower DPS and was hoping someone with more knowledge then me would see a hole in my testing and while your response suggests you did see something wrong you're apparently too good to give me a little adivce which is all I was really looking for.
#4 Nov 12 2008 at 7:53 PM Rating: Good
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13,048 posts
I need links to WWS parses or Recount screenshots of your damage breakdown if I'm to be able to judge anything.

If you need help with rotations or how to properly play a rogue, you should be reading, not asking questions.
#5 Nov 12 2008 at 8:04 PM Rating: Good
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2,680 posts
I think the question is basically "why am I doing better DPS with sub than with combat" to which I can only answer "it's probably your hit rating."

For heavy theorycraft and rotation analysis you will need hard data. Preferably WWS, but Recount can work. Anecdotal and unquantifiable info isn't really gonna help get to any useful analysis.

Best bet is to start with the spreadsheet, your answer is probably there.

As far as being "shunned", don't tell them what spec you are. When asked I usually just tell people what DPS I could reasonably be expected to output. That generally does the trick and if it doesn't, you don't want that PUG buddy... you don't want it.

Good luck
#6 Nov 12 2008 at 8:51 PM Rating: Decent
Thanks Therion... Hit rating is something I was considering as the possible cause I'll look into it a bit more. As far as PUGs go not mentioning my spec does work quite a bit but I prefer to tell people outright. I have less trouble now then I used to since with Shadow Dance added the DPS gap did close a bit but I still find it annoying when people go "ewww sub".
#7 Nov 13 2008 at 2:35 AM Rating: Decent
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4,684 posts
People actually shun you in PUG's for being sub? That's plain stupid, you could sub your way trough heroics with relative ease.
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