If you are Holy specced and healing PvE, how about your comments regarding the changes now that the patch is live. Your likes, dislikes, work-arounds, rants, raves, etc. Anything and everything goes, but no QQing just for QQing's sake. The only Holy related threads I see since the patch went live is one for PvP healing and one for soloing.
Personally, I'm feeling a bit disheartened right now but I haven't given it enough time yet so I'm not making any rash decisions. I spent the first night leveling Inscription on an alt and last night trying to get my UI in place and speccing my Pally, then we went into ZA.
I was able to heal OK last night, but I have never had trouble with mana before and did last night. It has always been a running joke in my groups that Cyn will have extra mage food because if I have to stop and eat/drink once its been a lot, and I have always had extra mana pots because I rarely have to use them. It's not because I haven't pushed my healing (I've heard people say that if you finish a fight with any mana left you didn't heal all out) as lately I've been at the top and even surpassed our priest once or twice.
Last night I ran oom a few times and our Tankadin was crowing about how he only had to stop and drink once. He has in the past said he ran through up to four stacks of mage food in a three hour progression run.
So, I'd like to hear your experience healing so far, and don't feel bashful about coming back later and updating your thoughts.
Oh, and thanks!
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- Holy - can I get some input?
Holy - can I get some input?Follow
"the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same way in any country."
Hermann Goering, April 1946.
Hermann Goering, April 1946.
Sounds about right. Healers should be the ones who have to sit and drink more often, not tanks. I've been tanking and I like the new changes to it. I ran a heroic with a 4/8 T6 holy paladin who loved the new spec, though I can't really add anything myself.
mikelolol wrote:
Sounds about right. Healers should be the ones who have to sit and drink more often, not tanks.
I didn't mean to imply otherwise, I simply included that for contrast. I guess I wasn't clear in that I don't have a problem drinking, or even drinking after every fight. I have a problem with going oom on simple fights, but if your friend was not having such a problem then it's just a question of me figuring it out for myself.
I did like Bacon of Light, and so did the Rogue and Shammy in the group because now they can get higher priority from me for heals.
"the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same way in any country."
Hermann Goering, April 1946.
Hermann Goering, April 1946.
All I've really done so far is a few heroics with various holy pallies. I noticed they're tending to stay in melee range (to keep judgements up? not sure), that's all I really know =)
Just finished heroic BM with that T6 pally (3pc then badge gear) and she only drank like twice the whole instance. I'm still in mostly blues (good ones) with 2pc t4 so I was still taking pretty heavy damage but she seemed to manage fine.
Edited, Oct 16th 2008 9:08pm by mikelolol
Just finished heroic BM with that T6 pally (3pc then badge gear) and she only drank like twice the whole instance. I'm still in mostly blues (good ones) with 2pc t4 so I was still taking pretty heavy damage but she seemed to manage fine.
Edited, Oct 16th 2008 9:08pm by mikelolol
We are healing gods now!
Dominated Brutallus putting Beacon on burn victims and healing tanks, Twins I could put it on 1 tank and heal the other. FoL is critting for 4k, mana has to be watched but its not too much of an issue. Holy Shock is clutch and has been great (though more so in pvp). I was pretty burnt out on pally healing but I am pretty happy with how things are going so far.
If you stacked +healing and your mp5 or spell crit is low it is probably going to kill you in terms of mana, but only bad players stack 2k healing and with 50mp5 and 20% crit.
Dominated Brutallus putting Beacon on burn victims and healing tanks, Twins I could put it on 1 tank and heal the other. FoL is critting for 4k, mana has to be watched but its not too much of an issue. Holy Shock is clutch and has been great (though more so in pvp). I was pretty burnt out on pally healing but I am pretty happy with how things are going so far.
If you stacked +healing and your mp5 or spell crit is low it is probably going to kill you in terms of mana, but only bad players stack 2k healing and with 50mp5 and 20% crit.
Bode - 100 Holy Paladin - Lightbringer
bodhisattva wrote:
We are healing gods now!
Dominated Brutallus putting Beacon on burn victims and healing tanks, Twins I could put it on 1 tank and heal the other. FoL is critting for 4k, mana has to be watched but its not too much of an issue. Holy Shock is clutch and has been great (though more so in pvp). I was pretty burnt out on pally healing but I am pretty happy with how things are going so far.
If you stacked +healing and your mp5 or spell crit is low it is probably going to kill you in terms of mana, but only bad players stack 2k healing and with 50mp5 and 20% crit.
Dominated Brutallus putting Beacon on burn victims and healing tanks, Twins I could put it on 1 tank and heal the other. FoL is critting for 4k, mana has to be watched but its not too much of an issue. Holy Shock is clutch and has been great (though more so in pvp). I was pretty burnt out on pally healing but I am pretty happy with how things are going so far.
If you stacked +healing and your mp5 or spell crit is low it is probably going to kill you in terms of mana, but only bad players stack 2k healing and with 50mp5 and 20% crit.
I confess I let my crit slide for a bit, but began to pay more attention to it the last two weeks and wanted to wait for the patch before re-gemming. It was below 20% - well below at one point - because I made the mistake of losing track of it when I replaced some of my gear. I admit that was n00bish of me. But I always watched my mp5 and it was over 110 before the patch, I just don't recall what it is after the patch. My mana bar was well over 10k, all of these are unbuffed numbers.
So, Bodh, were you using downranked Holy Light before? If so, have you replaced it with FoL now? I tried spamming FoL last night, keeping Beacon on the tank and asking the priest to keep the casters healed. I also moved in closer so I could Beacon-heal the tank when I healed myself. Of course spamming FoL was not a problem, but when I needed to turn to HL it ate up my mana. I just feel there's something I'm missing but I haven't played around with things yet so I'm not jumping to conclusions.
I did not judge wisdom and melee, which is something I always tried to do to get the tankadin mana. I made sure I had wisdom blessed on myself. I did not use Holy Shock much, but do intend to work it in. Part of the problem was that all my add-ons were fubar'ed and I didn't have time to update and reorganize my UI. Grid and clique were working but not much else.
Edit: Before I forget, thanks Bodh and thanks Mike, your input is appreciated.
Edited, Oct 17th 2008 2:48am by cynyck
"the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same way in any country."
Hermann Goering, April 1946.
Hermann Goering, April 1946.
I ran Heroic BF on Tuesday, and Heroic SP and Kara last night. I have not had any mana issues at this point, but I've also got 120 mp5, and a holy crit of 25%. With talents HL and HS are critting around 30%. I did not yet spec into Beacon, but put 15 points in Ret up to Vindication, which gives me extra crit.
I think if you haven't used Holy Shock much in the past you should get in the habit of using it now -- it's a great tool for healing. One thing that worked great for me in SP, on bosses like Quagmirran, when he starts spitting around the party -- top off the tank with a HL, then throw Flash at two of the party, Shock the tank, Flash the rest of the party (including self, if need be) and then Shock the tank again and follow up with either an HL or a Flash. Also, invest in a Glyph of Holy Light. It's pretty awesome, though it does require people to be close together (tooltip says 100 yards, it's actually 10). The Glyph can crit separately from the main heal, and can also proc things like the Shattered Sun pendant.
I think the hardest thing I've found so far is keeping Judgments up on the target. On trash it's difficult because the mobs go down really fast, but are still capable of doing some decent damage. I was better able to drop Judgements on bosses.
I really don't have any rants or raves at this point. I do feel strange when in groups with more than three pallies, as I'm not necessarily buffing everyone anymore since there's no Light or Salv. I'm currently having a little difficulty managing things like Hand of Salvation, but I think that's a case of just working with it some more. Overall I'm pretty satisfied with things right now.
I think if you haven't used Holy Shock much in the past you should get in the habit of using it now -- it's a great tool for healing. One thing that worked great for me in SP, on bosses like Quagmirran, when he starts spitting around the party -- top off the tank with a HL, then throw Flash at two of the party, Shock the tank, Flash the rest of the party (including self, if need be) and then Shock the tank again and follow up with either an HL or a Flash. Also, invest in a Glyph of Holy Light. It's pretty awesome, though it does require people to be close together (tooltip says 100 yards, it's actually 10). The Glyph can crit separately from the main heal, and can also proc things like the Shattered Sun pendant.
I think the hardest thing I've found so far is keeping Judgments up on the target. On trash it's difficult because the mobs go down really fast, but are still capable of doing some decent damage. I was better able to drop Judgements on bosses.
I really don't have any rants or raves at this point. I do feel strange when in groups with more than three pallies, as I'm not necessarily buffing everyone anymore since there's no Light or Salv. I'm currently having a little difficulty managing things like Hand of Salvation, but I think that's a case of just working with it some more. Overall I'm pretty satisfied with things right now.
27% holy crit + 6% to HL from Sanctified light + 2 piece t6 (5% HL crit) = 38% Holy Light crit, raid buffed about 40-41%. That is a lot of 10k HL crits with 60% mana coming back. Not to mention 160 mp5 while casting, non buffed.
FoL is now on par with rank 8/9 HL.
Done all the fights enough that I can see spike damage coming in my sleep so a quick Divine Favor + Holy Shock = .7 second Holy Light (hurray for haste). But mostly hitting a 3-4k FoL + insta Holy Shock for 2-3k is enough to get through it as well.
FoL is now on par with rank 8/9 HL.
Done all the fights enough that I can see spike damage coming in my sleep so a quick Divine Favor + Holy Shock = .7 second Holy Light (hurray for haste). But mostly hitting a 3-4k FoL + insta Holy Shock for 2-3k is enough to get through it as well.
Bode - 100 Holy Paladin - Lightbringer
meagherly wrote:
I think if you haven't used Holy Shock much in the past you should get in the habit of using it now -- it's a great tool for healing. One thing that worked great for me in SP, on bosses like Quagmirran, when he starts spitting around the party -- top off the tank with a HL, then throw Flash at two of the party, Shock the tank, Flash the rest of the party (including self, if need be) and then Shock the tank again and follow up with either an HL or a Flash. Also, invest in a Glyph of Holy Light.
Thanks meagherly. I have used Holy Shock in the past but only for "emergencies." As I said, I am going to work it in to the rotation and your experience does validate that idea.
bodhisattva wrote:
27% holy crit + 6% to HL from Sanctified light + 2 piece t6 (5% HL crit) = 38% Holy Light crit, raid buffed about 40-41%. That is a lot of 10k HL crits with 60% mana coming back. Not to mention 160 mp5 while casting, non buffed.
FoL is now on par with rank 8/9 HL.
Done all the fights enough that I can see spike damage coming in my sleep so a quick Divine Favor + Holy Shock = .7 second Holy Light (hurray for haste). But mostly hitting a 3-4k FoL + insta Holy Shock for 2-3k is enough to get through it as well.
FoL is now on par with rank 8/9 HL.
Done all the fights enough that I can see spike damage coming in my sleep so a quick Divine Favor + Holy Shock = .7 second Holy Light (hurray for haste). But mostly hitting a 3-4k FoL + insta Holy Shock for 2-3k is enough to get through it as well.
Well, I don't have any T6 yet Bodh but I don't think that's the deal-breaker, not to infer you are claiming it is. And I'm getting it Bodh, I need to make sure I do that regemming right away and I also need to review my gear first and see if I can swap from the gear I've saved to trade +heal for crit. moar crit!
"the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same way in any country."
Hermann Goering, April 1946.
Hermann Goering, April 1946.
So what exactly happened when you went oom? Were you spamming Holy Light on the raid? I'm not sure I understand why you are going oom now vs. pre-patch. The removal of downranking should not have caused things to change that badly for you.
Like others have said, Holy Shock should now be included in your rotation as needed. It may be enough to prevent you from needing to use a Holy Light. However, when spike damage occurs - you still need to go the Illumination route to conserve mana.
Also, don't forget Lay on Hands. It's a free HUGE instant heal and mana every 16 mins. Use Glyph of Lay on Hands (minor - increases mana resto to target by 20% - total 1080 mana) and Glyph of Divinity (Major - sends LoH mana back to you too - meaning you also get 1080 mana). A HUGE instant heal that gives you mana. weeeeeeeee
As for Bacon - remember that it's not cheap. So spamming it every fight will suck your mana out like crazy. Try and use it only when you know you need to.
Well, you should also coordinate with the other healer so that you don't have to heal yourself. Spiritual Attunement only gives you mana back when others heal you (unless that changed).
meagherly - you should try speccing Bacon. You can do the rotation above, except you can remove every single "heal the tank" step in your process :) It's awesome!!
Edited, Oct 17th 2008 10:27am by YJMark
Like others have said, Holy Shock should now be included in your rotation as needed. It may be enough to prevent you from needing to use a Holy Light. However, when spike damage occurs - you still need to go the Illumination route to conserve mana.
Also, don't forget Lay on Hands. It's a free HUGE instant heal and mana every 16 mins. Use Glyph of Lay on Hands (minor - increases mana resto to target by 20% - total 1080 mana) and Glyph of Divinity (Major - sends LoH mana back to you too - meaning you also get 1080 mana). A HUGE instant heal that gives you mana. weeeeeeeee
As for Bacon - remember that it's not cheap. So spamming it every fight will suck your mana out like crazy. Try and use it only when you know you need to.
cynyck wrote:
I also moved in closer so I could Beacon-heal the tank when I healed myself.
Well, you should also coordinate with the other healer so that you don't have to heal yourself. Spiritual Attunement only gives you mana back when others heal you (unless that changed).
meagherly wrote:
I think if you haven't used Holy Shock much in the past you should get in the habit of using it now -- it's a great tool for healing. One thing that worked great for me in SP, on bosses like Quagmirran, when he starts spitting around the party -- top off the tank with a HL, then throw Flash at two of the party, Shock the tank, Flash the rest of the party (including self, if need be) and then Shock the tank again and follow up with either an HL or a Flash.
meagherly - you should try speccing Bacon. You can do the rotation above, except you can remove every single "heal the tank" step in your process :) It's awesome!!
Edited, Oct 17th 2008 10:27am by YJMark
The one I'm having trouble getting used to using again is lay on hands before it was something to avoid now it's on 16 minute c ooldown.
YJMark wrote:
cynyck wrote:
I also moved in closer so I could Beacon-heal the tank when I healed myself.
Well, you should also coordinate with the other healer so that you don't have to heal yourself. Spiritual Attunement only gives you mana back when others heal you (unless that changed).
I often run ZA with another Holy Paladin. Hypothetically speaking, if we were to Bacon each other for boss fights and then manage healing responsibilities wrt the tanks as per our usual, we should theoretically sustain a very nice rate of mana regeneration from Spiritual Attunement, right? I can't wait to try it out regardless!
Quote:
I often run ZA with another Holy Paladin. Hypothetically speaking, if we were to Bacon each other for boss fights and then manage healing responsibilities wrt the tanks as per our usual, we should theoretically sustain a very nice rate of mana regeneration from Spiritual Attunement, right? I can't wait to try it out regardless!
Interesting idea. I'd like to know how that turns out :) It should work...in theory.
Holy Paladin:
Better than the Wendy's Baconator! (registered trademarks implied).
The holy Pally in my guild is Bacon Spec. As a Paladin tank, I can attest that this is (insert your favorite ice-cream flavor here) with awesomesauce, whipped cream, and a cherry on top.
Better than the Wendy's Baconator! (registered trademarks implied).
The holy Pally in my guild is Bacon Spec. As a Paladin tank, I can attest that this is (insert your favorite ice-cream flavor here) with awesomesauce, whipped cream, and a cherry on top.
YJMark wrote:
So what exactly happened when you went oom? Were you spamming Holy Light on the raid? I'm not sure I understand why you are going oom now vs. pre-patch. The removal of downranking should not have caused things to change that badly for you.
Well, that's just it YJM, I don't know why myself. I have less mana now, and I had to spam HL a few times when in the past it's only been occasional. Also, I didn't intend this to be a thread about me, I really wanted to hear from everyone what their experiences have been. As I said somewhere above, it was only one run and there is no way I'm drawing conclusions from that. In fact, I've been thinking about it and it may just have been that I had a different healer in there with me. She was on her priest alt that she's been gearing up for healing and I didn't inspect her, but maybe my mana issues were simply due to having had to use HL too often because of the circumstances. We'll see.
YJMark wrote:
Like others have said, Holy Shock should now be included in your rotation as needed. It may be enough to prevent you from needing to use a Holy Light. However, when spike damage occurs - you still need to go the Illumination route to conserve mana.
Yes, as I said, I am working it in to my rotation. I have not used it much except for those "oh ****" moments when I needed a quick heal. Now things are different, it looks much tastier.
YJMark wrote:
Also, don't forget Lay on Hands. It's a free HUGE instant heal and mana every 16 mins. Use Glyph of Lay on Hands (minor - increases mana resto to target by 20% - total 1080 mana) and Glyph of Divinity (Major - sends LoH mana back to you too - meaning you also get 1080 mana). A HUGE instant heal that gives you mana. weeeeeeeee
Agreed, LoH will also get more of a workout. It was always saved for those moments when either I was going oom (last boss in ZA) or I had two tanks that were very low on health. Now it looks like it will get more use as it will not be so situational any longer and doesn't need to be saved.
YJMark wrote:
As for Bacon - remember that it's not cheap. So spamming it every fight will suck your mana out like crazy. Try and use it only when you know you need to.
I have to experiment more with it. It is expensive, but if it gives me two heals for the price of one, then it may be worth it. And also, if you crit on your target, you can also crit from that on the Bacon. So, using made up numbers, if you throw a 3k heal that crits to 5k, and all 5k is effective heal, then the Bacon will receive all 5k also, but that too can crit to over 8k.
Thanks everyone for your input, more relating of personal experiences and how you are putting these things to use though please.
"the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same way in any country."
Hermann Goering, April 1946.
Hermann Goering, April 1946.
Is any Holy Pally using the FoL glyph to make it a HoT and using HS as your quick top off heal? I'm wondering how effective the FoL glyph would be as 5 man/Kara healer when used with liberal HS's.
I used the Flash of Light glyph in beta for a run through Utgarde Keep. When we left the instance I ran into a second group that needed a healer, and I joined up with them -- after removing the Glyph. I found that the 50% up front reduction was a bit much, even with the 140% over 12 seconds that follows. It felt just a little too underpowered for me to be comfortable with it.
Now, I got my hands on a Glyph of Holy Light, and I'm really enjoying that sucker. Granted, a lot of it is overheals, but I think we're just going to have to learn to live with a much higher overheal these days. The Glyph hits everyone within 10 yards, including the target of the initial heal, can crit, and can proc my Shattered Sun pendant.
YJM: I did play around with Beacon on the Beta, and I liked it. I will probably respec before Lich comes out to Bacon to play with it some more, though when it's time for going through the levelling grind, I'll likely go back to the 15 points in Ret to make questing a bit easier.
Now, I got my hands on a Glyph of Holy Light, and I'm really enjoying that sucker. Granted, a lot of it is overheals, but I think we're just going to have to learn to live with a much higher overheal these days. The Glyph hits everyone within 10 yards, including the target of the initial heal, can crit, and can proc my Shattered Sun pendant.
YJM: I did play around with Beacon on the Beta, and I liked it. I will probably respec before Lich comes out to Bacon to play with it some more, though when it's time for going through the levelling grind, I'll likely go back to the 15 points in Ret to make questing a bit easier.
Update: well, it seems it may have been that one run, possibly because the priest was undergeared. I joined a Vashj run last night my guild was doing and I'm happy to say I didn't have any mana problems (although that's probably not the fight to test one's mana on - I didn't even need to drink afterwards) and I was still at the top in healing.
I agree on both counts meagherly. That Glyph of Holy Light really does overheal too; I was also top in overhealing last night and I never was higher than fifth in a 25-man before. But I'm liking it. And I agree with Bodh's earlier post, I felt pretty powerful healing with my FoL and backing it up with HL, and using Holy Wrath a lot more - both as a heal and last night to help kill the elementals. My entire outlook is back to positive again.
Yes, taking Bacon meant giving up that extra crit and I'm rethinking it, but I need to work with it a bit more. I did not use it much last night, but again that's one fight. I want to work with Bodh's idea of slapping the Bacon on one tank and being a double target healer. heh-heh. Bacon double heal burger. (I'm really sorry for that, but I just couldn't pass it up!)
meagherly wrote:
I used the Flash of Light glyph in beta for a run through Utgarde Keep. When we left the instance I ran into a second group that needed a healer, and I joined up with them -- after removing the Glyph. I found that the 50% up front reduction was a bit much, even with the 140% over 12 seconds that follows. It felt just a little too underpowered for me to be comfortable with it.
Now, I got my hands on a Glyph of Holy Light, and I'm really enjoying that sucker. Granted, a lot of it is overheals, but I think we're just going to have to learn to live with a much higher overheal these days. The Glyph hits everyone within 10 yards, including the target of the initial heal, can crit, and can proc my Shattered Sun pendant.
Now, I got my hands on a Glyph of Holy Light, and I'm really enjoying that sucker. Granted, a lot of it is overheals, but I think we're just going to have to learn to live with a much higher overheal these days. The Glyph hits everyone within 10 yards, including the target of the initial heal, can crit, and can proc my Shattered Sun pendant.
I agree on both counts meagherly. That Glyph of Holy Light really does overheal too; I was also top in overhealing last night and I never was higher than fifth in a 25-man before. But I'm liking it. And I agree with Bodh's earlier post, I felt pretty powerful healing with my FoL and backing it up with HL, and using Holy Wrath a lot more - both as a heal and last night to help kill the elementals. My entire outlook is back to positive again.
meagherly wrote:
YJM: I did play around with Beacon on the Beta, and I liked it. I will probably respec before Lich comes out to Bacon to play with it some more, though when it's time for going through the levelling grind, I'll likely go back to the 15 points in Ret to make questing a bit easier.
Yes, taking Bacon meant giving up that extra crit and I'm rethinking it, but I need to work with it a bit more. I did not use it much last night, but again that's one fight. I want to work with Bodh's idea of slapping the Bacon on one tank and being a double target healer. heh-heh. Bacon double heal burger. (I'm really sorry for that, but I just couldn't pass it up!)
"the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same way in any country."
Hermann Goering, April 1946.
Hermann Goering, April 1946.
Quote:
Bacon double heal burger.
lol - friggin awesome
As far as Bacon goes, I'm personally keeping it. I plan to run a lot of instances while leveling once WotLK drops. That skill is sweet for 5-mans. However, it is pretty hard to use effectively (except for a few situations). Understand who to put it on, when to use it, etc... A lot of people complain about it, but if they use it properly, it can be a very powerful tool.
For the Glyph of FoL - does the HoT stack (I haven't tried it yet)? If so, then I could see it being useful. If not - then it's pretty much useless.
2 posts
Quote:
For the Glyph of FoL - does the HoT stack
nope
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