Ok so i got into the eighth best raiding guild on my server, Andorhal, on my spriest, and I was helping the guild, attending raids (even unscheduled ones), and then we ran BT for the third night that week, and i get an invite.
We were doing Gurtogg Bloodboil and we had yet to have downed him... We were going good and then I told them I had to log off so my brother could get on and do his statistics homework so as to not fail the course.
So I log out and then he calls me like an hour later and tells me that my friend says i got kicked from the guild for "Ninja Logging", so at this moment I am PISSED and so I log back on and and whisper the guild master saying that, apparently now raiding BT>passing statistics, and he says that if you sign up for a raid you MUST stay for the whole thing and if you have to log and do something during it, you get gkicked. So he just replies with "guild policy" and no matter how I tell him the situation/reasons for logging or why it was total bull that someone get kicked for prioritizing RL over WoW he just replied the same....guild policy
Who else thinks that raiding BT>RL?
/end rant
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Amazingly, when you're in a guild that likes to raid people expect you to be available to, I don't know, raid.
Besides, I've kicked people out of the guild for "my brother has to" or "my parents say I have to". It means they're usually 15 and going to miss a lot of raids or stealth AFK to deal with family issues, which is fine, but it means they're sure as hell not someone I'm going to count on to come to raids.
Besides, I've kicked people out of the guild for "my brother has to" or "my parents say I have to". It means they're usually 15 and going to miss a lot of raids or stealth AFK to deal with family issues, which is fine, but it means they're sure as hell not someone I'm going to count on to come to raids.
Real life pwns all. But you should have alerted the raid leader that you would possibly/probably need to log off before the end of raid-time. It's just common courtesy.
Over-reaction, yes. But partially understandable.
Over-reaction, yes. But partially understandable.
Understandable indeed, but not justified if you ask me. I'd say, be glad you got kicked. At least you're out of that "We so hardcore" guild. Get into the 7th best raiding guild on your server and laugh at your old GM.
Edit: Why in the rogue forums?
Edit 2: Never mind I suppose, I recall Therion making a lot of threads that didn't specifically had to do with rogues. Guess it doesn't matter.
Edited, Sep 30th 2008 9:46pm by Mozared
Edited, Sep 30th 2008 9:46pm by Mozared
Edit: Why in the rogue forums?
Edit 2: Never mind I suppose, I recall Therion making a lot of threads that didn't specifically had to do with rogues. Guess it doesn't matter.
Edited, Sep 30th 2008 9:46pm by Mozared
Edited, Sep 30th 2008 9:46pm by Mozared
I would have stayed in the raid.
But than again, my Stats teacher was horrible and I hated the class so I may be biased.
Honest answer: I would have planned it out ahead of time when to do my HW and when to raid. If I know for a fact that the raid is going to be roughly from 7PM-11PM than I know that I can't do anything else during that time. I would have done my HW before hand or after the raid at the expense of sleep.
I do think its kind of strict that you got kicked for it, but its understandable. Raid time is raid time.
You wouldn't leave in the middle of class and say, "Well, I have to go raid now." Its pretty much the same thing. You have that block of time set out for doing that specific thing, you can't just leave in the middle when you've made a commitment.
But than again, my Stats teacher was horrible and I hated the class so I may be biased.
Honest answer: I would have planned it out ahead of time when to do my HW and when to raid. If I know for a fact that the raid is going to be roughly from 7PM-11PM than I know that I can't do anything else during that time. I would have done my HW before hand or after the raid at the expense of sleep.
I do think its kind of strict that you got kicked for it, but its understandable. Raid time is raid time.
You wouldn't leave in the middle of class and say, "Well, I have to go raid now." Its pretty much the same thing. You have that block of time set out for doing that specific thing, you can't just leave in the middle when you've made a commitment.
Quote:
Real life pwns all. But you should have alerted the raid leader that you would possibly/probably need to log off before the end of raid-time. It's just common courtesy.
Over-reaction, yes. But partially understandable.
Over-reaction, yes. But partially understandable.
I would have alerted him if I had known, but I had no idea until the moment I had to log, as he needed it right then, but the main reason this made no sense to me is that we had had people leaving before me, not getting kicked, and he says try and attend as many raids as you can, preferably 3/4 a week, and I attended that many so I don't understand where his policies stand.
*EDIT*
Quote:
Understandable indeed, but not justified if you ask me. I'd say, be glad you got kicked. At least you're out of that "We so hardcore" guild. Get into the 7th best raiding guild on your server and laugh at your old GM.
I should proly mention that if you go to wowjutsu, the 7th, 6th, 5th, and 2nd guilds are all currently disbanded...
Quote:
Honest answer: I would have planned it out ahead of time when to do my HW and when to raid. If I know for a fact that the raid is going to be roughly from 7PM-11PM than I know that I can't do anything else during that time. I would have done my HW before hand or after the raid at the expense of sleep.
I would have if it were my homework, it was my brother, not me, that needed to do the stats homework
Edited, Sep 30th 2008 3:55pm by imanohealu
Whoops! Sorry mis-read your post.
EDIT: In that case I think you need to more clearly establish within your family when each person gets to use the computer.
If he didn't know that you would be using the computer during that time than you should have let him know so he could use it at a different time.
If he did know, then he's just an ***.
Edited, Sep 30th 2008 4:00pm by GodOfMoo
EDIT: In that case I think you need to more clearly establish within your family when each person gets to use the computer.
If he didn't know that you would be using the computer during that time than you should have let him know so he could use it at a different time.
If he did know, then he's just an ***.
Edited, Sep 30th 2008 4:00pm by GodOfMoo
He did...and yes, I know he's an ***
Quote:
I should proly mention that if you go to wowjutsu, the 7th, 6th, 5th, and 2nd guilds are all currently disbanded...
That leaves you with a bit of a problem =P Ofcourse it depends per person, but still, I'd rather not rate than with people of which I disagree with their ideas of how a guild should be ran.
Quote:
You wouldn't leave in the middle of class and say, "Well, I have to go raid now." Its pretty much the same thing. You have that block of time set out for doing that specific thing, you can't just leave in the middle when you've made a commitment.
Good point, but it's a bit of a thin line... After all, WoW is something you do for fun, classes are something you're doing for 'the greater good' to put it that way. That said, I'd be a filthy hypocrite if I disagreed with you here, so I won't. I'll just say it depends on what you have to leave for.
I sympathize with your situation and agree that your brothers needs were more important at that moment. Of course RL > raiding.
But from the other side, a raid is a group of people and it's their time your tying up. Progression raiding is a time-commitment and if you can't commit the time (for whatever reason no matter how noble or important), then you can't. Nothing negative about, just a practical consideration.
Personally, I wouldn't gkick someone for the situation in the OP. But it's important to know in serious raiding which players have connection issues, other commitments, etc that might slow down the progression of 24 other people. Again, not a negative thing, just practicality.
As noted above, you're probably lucky to be out of the guild. Getting gkicked for that without any discussion sounds like a jerk move to me. You're better off rid of 'em, imo.
I try to keep my posts on topic and my threads relatively rogue-related or posted to general. Might have gone off-topic once or twice, but I don't recall anything specific. /shrug
*edit: L2quote & spell
Edited, Sep 30th 2008 1:58pm by TherionSaysWhat
But from the other side, a raid is a group of people and it's their time your tying up. Progression raiding is a time-commitment and if you can't commit the time (for whatever reason no matter how noble or important), then you can't. Nothing negative about, just a practical consideration.
Personally, I wouldn't gkick someone for the situation in the OP. But it's important to know in serious raiding which players have connection issues, other commitments, etc that might slow down the progression of 24 other people. Again, not a negative thing, just practicality.
As noted above, you're probably lucky to be out of the guild. Getting gkicked for that without any discussion sounds like a jerk move to me. You're better off rid of 'em, imo.
Quote:
Never mind I suppose, I recall Therion making a lot of threads that didn't specifically had to do with rogues.
I try to keep my posts on topic and my threads relatively rogue-related or posted to general. Might have gone off-topic once or twice, but I don't recall anything specific. /shrug
*edit: L2quote & spell
Edited, Sep 30th 2008 1:58pm by TherionSaysWhat
imanohealu wrote:
Ok so i got into the eighth best raiding guild on my server, Andorhal, on my spriest, and I was helping the guild, attending raids (even unscheduled ones), and then we ran BT for the third night that week, and i get an invite.
We were doing Gurtogg Bloodboil and we had yet to have downed him... We were going good and then I told them I had to log off so my brother could get on and do his statistics homework so as to not fail the course.
So I log out and then he calls me like an hour later and tells me that my friend says i got kicked from the guild for "Ninja Logging", so at this moment I am PISSED and so I log back on and and whisper the guild master saying that, apparently now raiding BT>passing statistics, and he says that if you sign up for a raid you MUST stay for the whole thing and if you have to log and do something during it, you get gkicked. So he just replies with "guild policy" and no matter how I tell him the situation/reasons for logging or why it was total bull that someone get kicked for prioritizing RL over WoW he just replied the same....guild policy
Who else thinks that raiding BT>RL?
/end rant
We were doing Gurtogg Bloodboil and we had yet to have downed him... We were going good and then I told them I had to log off so my brother could get on and do his statistics homework so as to not fail the course.
So I log out and then he calls me like an hour later and tells me that my friend says i got kicked from the guild for "Ninja Logging", so at this moment I am PISSED and so I log back on and and whisper the guild master saying that, apparently now raiding BT>passing statistics, and he says that if you sign up for a raid you MUST stay for the whole thing and if you have to log and do something during it, you get gkicked. So he just replies with "guild policy" and no matter how I tell him the situation/reasons for logging or why it was total bull that someone get kicked for prioritizing RL over WoW he just replied the same....guild policy
Who else thinks that raiding BT>RL?
/end rant
Raiding BT isn't > RL.
Being accountable and reliable is, however, critical. It's up to you to take reasonable precautions to ensure that if you're attending a raid, you're able to be there for the full duration. It's not the raid leader's job to consult with your family to make sure that you'll have uninterrupted access to the PC...that's up to you. Ideally, you would have approached the folks in your home before joining the raid group (assuming it was a spur-of-the-moment invite and not something you signed up for) and confirmed that nobody else needed the PC for the duration of the raid. You made the assumption that you'd be able to go and when you found out otherwise, you left the raid hanging while they brought in a replacement for you.
If you were /gkicked because your house caught on fire and you had to exit, that would be bad. If you were /gkicked because you or someone in the family had a medical emergency and you had to log out, that would be bad. You got /gkicked because you agreed to go on a raid without first making sure that you'd be able to see it through to the end. Doesn't seem all that unreasonable to me. I don't know that I'd /gkick someone over it if I were in the raid leader's position, but nor would I fault him for doing so.
Let's put it this way;
You gathered 24 other people to spend time together and take down a boss or do an instance.
Now please explain how 24 other peoples time is less important than yours. That's 24 hours versus your 1.
You gathered 24 other people to spend time together and take down a boss or do an instance.
Now please explain how 24 other peoples time is less important than yours. That's 24 hours versus your 1.
I agree with Moo and Mental here.
You did waste other peoples time, and your brother could have done the homework after. Yes, I agree that RL overcomes a video game any second of the day, but don't think your RL decisions won't affect your game life and vise versa.
Ranting about it isn't going to change the fact that you were gkicked.
You did waste other peoples time, and your brother could have done the homework after. Yes, I agree that RL overcomes a video game any second of the day, but don't think your RL decisions won't affect your game life and vise versa.
Ranting about it isn't going to change the fact that you were gkicked.
It's not that I'm so smart, it's just that I stay with problems longer. -Albert Einstein
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Feyras, ****** Superhero wrote:
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Just piping in because I had a similar situation come up this last Friday during Kara.
We were on a roll and kicking *** and taking names. We got to Nightbane and just before we summoned my daughter came in with sunscreen on her face and in her eye. She's two years old and found a bottle somewhere. I immediately told the guild that I had to go help my wife with that. 20 minutes later she was calmed down and in bed, but they had already PUGged out the filler and moved on. Guess it is my loss in terms of badges, but when it comes down to it, 20 minutes comforting my daughter is infinitely more important to me than whatever the other 9/24/39 people are doing. Everyone in my guild understood and there was no ill will.
Now, having said that...I think it probably would have been best if you had told the raid leader ahead of time you would have to bail at such and such point, since your situation seems to be a bit more predictable.
We were on a roll and kicking *** and taking names. We got to Nightbane and just before we summoned my daughter came in with sunscreen on her face and in her eye. She's two years old and found a bottle somewhere. I immediately told the guild that I had to go help my wife with that. 20 minutes later she was calmed down and in bed, but they had already PUGged out the filler and moved on. Guess it is my loss in terms of badges, but when it comes down to it, 20 minutes comforting my daughter is infinitely more important to me than whatever the other 9/24/39 people are doing. Everyone in my guild understood and there was no ill will.
Now, having said that...I think it probably would have been best if you had told the raid leader ahead of time you would have to bail at such and such point, since your situation seems to be a bit more predictable.
Well yes, the guild leader does have a point, but kicking without discussion or anything is too harsh if you ask me. I'd say there's a 70/30 division of wrongdoing for respectively the leader and the OP.
Aye, should've rephrased that but I couldn't be bothered with editing my post yet again. It's not that you exactly spam the forum, but I recalled specifically your "What do you expect from fellow raiders" topic in the rogue forums, which didn't really have anything specifically to do with rogues. No worries =P
Quote:
I try to keep my posts on topic and my threads relatively rogue-related or posted to general. Might have gone off-topic once or twice, but I don't recall anything specific. /shrug
Aye, should've rephrased that but I couldn't be bothered with editing my post yet again. It's not that you exactly spam the forum, but I recalled specifically your "What do you expect from fellow raiders" topic in the rogue forums, which didn't really have anything specifically to do with rogues. No worries =P
Unless you let a raid leader know ahead of time that you need to leave before the end of the raid, they're completely justified in gkicking you.
You're effectively making them cancel the rest of the raid; if it's easy farm content to your guild, then I can understand, but if you're in MH/BT/SWP and you duck out?
Don't whine about being kicked when you deserve it, honestly.
You're effectively making them cancel the rest of the raid; if it's easy farm content to your guild, then I can understand, but if you're in MH/BT/SWP and you duck out?
Don't whine about being kicked when you deserve it, honestly.
The only reason I go to a raid if I know I'm going to have to leave early is if I'm going to be the only Rogue going and we're doing something like Naj or Anetheron. Something where we need Wound Poison, in which case I say, "I'll stay as long as I can for the bosses you need me for."
Granted, if I ever have to leave early its due to medical reason, it really sucks to have to raid with a migraine.
EDIT: I have a question for the OP actually.
When you say:
Do you mean, you said, "My brother has to do his HW, I have to log." And insta log?
Or did you say the above and than wait for a response before logging? If you insta logged that would be more reason for the Gkick. If you waiting for a response than I'm curious as to what the response was.
Edited, Sep 30th 2008 11:28pm by GodOfMoo
Granted, if I ever have to leave early its due to medical reason, it really sucks to have to raid with a migraine.
EDIT: I have a question for the OP actually.
When you say:
Quote:
We were going good and then I told them I had to log off so my brother could get on and do his statistics homework so as to not fail the course.
So I log out
So I log out
Do you mean, you said, "My brother has to do his HW, I have to log." And insta log?
Or did you say the above and than wait for a response before logging? If you insta logged that would be more reason for the Gkick. If you waiting for a response than I'm curious as to what the response was.
Edited, Sep 30th 2008 11:28pm by GodOfMoo
I wouldn't want to be in a guild like that. I mean, I have other people in the house. It's hard to free up 3-4 hours even one night a week.
we did 4 nights a week and only got to bloodboil, 4th best on my realm ya! andorhal
One time i saw someone get hit by a car outside my house and i thought "Dude i hope i hit Lurker Below like that car hit that person" would have helped him but can't go afk for more than 6 seconds and the dude was totally 7 seconds away.
Overlord Theophany wrote:
Unless you let a raid leader know ahead of time that you need to leave before the end of the raid, they're completely justified in gkicking you.
You're effectively making them cancel the rest of the raid; if it's easy farm content to your guild, then I can understand, but if you're in MH/BT/SWP and you duck out?
Don't whine about being kicked when you deserve it, honestly.
You're effectively making them cancel the rest of the raid; if it's easy farm content to your guild, then I can understand, but if you're in MH/BT/SWP and you duck out?
Don't whine about being kicked when you deserve it, honestly.
And I would have done the same thing if I were the raid/guild leader.
If you're new in my guild, and in one of the first serious raids you enter you leave halfway without saying that you might have to leave early you bet your *** that you'll be out of the guild before you log on again.
I once had something similar happen to me, I promised my boss I would do a conference call with him and a bunch of clients, the call took longer than expected and I was 15 minutes late for a raid so I told them "I gotta go raid, I'll talk to you tomorrow" and hung-up the phone. Needless to say I was fired the next morning.
Do I hold a grudge and go job-to-job complaining about my boss that un-justifiably fired me even though I explained my situation before hanging up? No.
If 4/7 guilds on your server /gdisband you should be thinking about a server transfer.
Do I hold a grudge and go job-to-job complaining about my boss that un-justifiably fired me even though I explained my situation before hanging up? No.
If 4/7 guilds on your server /gdisband you should be thinking about a server transfer.
Imo you should be aware and respect the guild policy, even if you do not necessarily agree with it. Plus, it's kind of breaching etiquette leaving a group (let alone a raid) halfway the trip. If your cat was dying or you need to get your gf to a hospital, sure: then RL > BT.
But you could have known about that brother of yours wanting to use your comp. Better still, if you do not own your own comp and share it with your family - make sure the comp is yours for the entire raid. It's one of the basic rules of any raiding guild and even the proper etiquette for a 5-man.
You could think "yeah, RL > BT" which is true of course, but also remember you left the other members in the raid, who are also RL people, might have kept their evenings free, might have canceled RL events or whatever to attend. If the raid then is canceled half way because you think you can drop out at any time - sure, they're pissed. There's a guild rule for it for a reason!
RL > any game, but do realize that once you sign up for the raid you're expected to sit it out and BT > RL. RL trivialities are not an excuse, only emergencies. The gkick was unnecessarily harsh, but if that's what their rules are - you should have been aware of it. Every guild has rules set out of their sites, read them before you apply.
I back the guild on this one. The only thing that I can blame them for is their harsh policy.
Is not a good reason to let your guildies down.
But you could have known about that brother of yours wanting to use your comp. Better still, if you do not own your own comp and share it with your family - make sure the comp is yours for the entire raid. It's one of the basic rules of any raiding guild and even the proper etiquette for a 5-man.
You could think "yeah, RL > BT" which is true of course, but also remember you left the other members in the raid, who are also RL people, might have kept their evenings free, might have canceled RL events or whatever to attend. If the raid then is canceled half way because you think you can drop out at any time - sure, they're pissed. There's a guild rule for it for a reason!
RL > any game, but do realize that once you sign up for the raid you're expected to sit it out and BT > RL. RL trivialities are not an excuse, only emergencies. The gkick was unnecessarily harsh, but if that's what their rules are - you should have been aware of it. Every guild has rules set out of their sites, read them before you apply.
I back the guild on this one. The only thing that I can blame them for is their harsh policy.
Quote:
my brother could get on and do his statistics homework so as to not fail the course.
Is not a good reason to let your guildies down.
i was confused by the title and the OP.
Please edit title to display content.
Ancient definition of "ninja logger" works for me.
Please edit title to display content.
Ancient definition of "ninja logger" works for me.
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