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Axe vs PolearmFollow

#1 Sep 25 2008 at 1:56 PM Rating: Decent
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231 posts
I have never used a polearm or even seen one in a quest loot offer, but see a lot of them in the AH that have really good dps numbers for that level. Seems to be better dps than same level 2H axes. Am I missing something? They seem to be left out of all the weapon discussions I have seen.
#2 Sep 25 2008 at 3:09 PM Rating: Decent
Good question, I wish someone would answer it....lol. I got a great Blue drop pole arm outta Ramps. DPS is better, stats are better, but attack time is like 1.5 secs longer, sooo, are they really better?
#3 Sep 25 2008 at 10:33 PM Rating: Excellent
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608 posts
When you're talking about a 2 handed weapon, DPS is Generally not the deciding number ... average damage is. with exceptions - DPS being considerably higher on the lower damage weapon

I'm going to take a guess or 2 here. 1) You're arms spec, and have Poleaxe specialisation. 2) You're MS (although I should have to mention that - it probably goes without saying)

The thing about Mortal strike, is that it does damage based on the weapon damage - which means the higher the damage indicated on the weapon, the better the damage with more strike. This may mean that a weapon with a higher DPS is not as good as a weapon with a lower DPS, but with a slower swing timer (and subsequently higher damage).

Let me see if I can find an example or 2.

ok, here are 2 weapons, one from BF, one from Ramps ... (seeing as though the poster above me mentioned the one from ramps).

Hellreaver is a Polearm with a DPS of 68.8 at a speed of 3.4, and a damage range of 187 - 281. Average damage is ((281 + 187) / 2 = 234

Warsong Howling Axe is a 2 handed axe with a DPS of 70.3 at a speed of 3.1, and a damage range of 174 - 262. Average Damage is ((174 + 262)/2) = 218

Which is better for an MS warrior? ... the Hellreaver. Why, it does more average damage per hit, and that's what MS is based on. It may be 2 or so dps lower, but it's better for MS.

Now, as far as polearms go, this is a bit of an exception, the general problem with polearms is that they are normally much faster weapons than Axes, maces or even swords. For this reason, you'll very seldom find a warrior with a Polearm. Don't get me wrong, there are some polearms out there which an MS warrior would do well with (Glaive of the pit comes to mind), but those are a lot less common than viable axes.

An illustration of this is the Arena Polearm vs the Arena Axe. Same DPS, but the polearm is much faster, and subsequently has a much lower damage range.

Aside from the DPS / Damage range differential, polearm stats also seem to be a lot more geared towards Hunters. They generally use their melee weapons purely as a stat buff, not so much as a damaging tool, so speed and damage of the weapon is inconsequential.

Hope this helps.

Edited, Sep 26th 2008 10:27pm by robertlofthouse
#4 Sep 26 2008 at 10:04 AM Rating: Decent
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231 posts
Great answer. Thanks a lot.
#5 Sep 26 2008 at 10:54 AM Rating: Good
Quote:
When you're talking about a 2 handed weapon, DPS is not the deciding number ... average damage is.


Not... really.

If you use MS and WW every 6 and 10 seconds respectively, a difference of 20 Weapon Damage (as per your example) works out to ~5.3 DPS. That means the Hellreaver is better than the Warsong Howling Axe, but if the speed difference was smaller even though the average damage is still lower the Warsong Howling Axe would work out better.
#6 Sep 26 2008 at 12:32 PM Rating: Excellent
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608 posts
RPZip wrote:
Quote:
When you're talking about a 2 handed weapon, DPS is not the deciding number ... average damage is.


Not... really.

If you use MS and WW every 6 and 10 seconds respectively, a difference of 20 Weapon Damage (as per your example) works out to ~5.3 DPS. That means the Hellreaver is better than the Warsong Howling Axe, but if the speed difference was smaller even though the average damage is still lower the Warsong Howling Axe would work out better.


Fair enough, if the Axe was 2.9 speed, it's DPS would be 75 ... at which point (75 dps vs 68 dps), I would probably choose the Axe ... but now, we're not really comparing similar level equipment are we ... I mean 75 dps axes are level 66-67 greens, or level 64 blues ... hardly a fair comparison against a level 60 blue.

Ok, adendum ... when comparing two weapons of similar level and similar DPS, as an MS warrior, you want the higher damaging weapon (very often the slower weapon) regardless of dps. If however, you have a weapon with a considerably higher DPS, but with lower damage, it might be worth taking it over the lower dps weapon, even if the damage is higher. Best to make use of all the info contained in this thread (from me and RPZ) and work on it from that perspective.
#7 Sep 27 2008 at 10:17 PM Rating: Decent
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1,912 posts
Ehm, doesn't attack power come into play for MS and WW?

Just saying, because then AP would make a lot of difference in the damage of the swing of a 3.4 and a 3.1 speed weapon. I think, I'm a bit too lazy to go with the normalization formulas, all I care to know is that slower is still better.

#8 Sep 27 2008 at 10:44 PM Rating: Good
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608 posts
xorq wrote:
Ehm, doesn't attack power come into play for MS and WW?

Just saying, because then AP would make a lot of difference in the damage of the swing of a 3.4 and a 3.1 speed weapon. I think, I'm a bit too lazy to go with the normalization formulas, all I care to know is that slower is still better.



DPS (and subsequently Damage) from AP is calculated using a standard weapon speed (3.4 for 2 handers iirc). So the same amount of damage is added regardless of weapon speed.

Slower is better is true in most situations, but you still need to factor in some other issues. But all things (DPS, Stats, etc) being equal .. yes slower is better.
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