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#27 Sep 18 2008 at 12:51 PM Rating: Good
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Soljourner wrote:
By oppinion I meant for people to stop saying that skill sucks. Thats completely oppinion based.

It's spelled "opinion".

Ambush hasn't scaled well since.... damn, I don't even recall when. 1.2? The math, the actual game mechanics prove this. It's not an opinion. There are better ways to burst damage in PvP than with Ambush (even when talented for). Learn to research before posting and it'll save you a ton of hassle. Start with Elitist Jerks. Hell, even the WoWWiki page shows symbiotic talents and the output calculations and it's stupid-easy to find with a simple search.

And, for the record, I posted a build for you based on pure Ambush burst. Seems I was wasting my time.
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#28 Sep 18 2008 at 12:58 PM Rating: Default
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Nah, you haven't wasted your time, I've been raid based on gear so far and am using sub/*** maces at the moment. So i'm pvping for my daggers first. Only 1k left to go. So I greatly appreciate your build and its the first on my list to try. And yeah, I've done my research. Like I said, I know ambush isnt the best 1 shot dps, I prefer mutilate if thats what I wanted to take seriously. Again, for fun is the key role. And yes, I know elitist jerks very well, some of them in person. The only problems i see with your build that you posted is that its too far stretched out. To many dif talents taken, example would be your 1 in expose armor or cheat death. Heres a build I"m kinda playing around with. http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=fGxZZEMxcMGocxot Still trying to work out the last 8 points. The only reason i took remorseless is because i'm aiming for the 1 shot kills. but its sacrificial if i need to move points around.

Edited, Sep 18th 2008 4:58pm by Soljourner
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#29 Sep 18 2008 at 12:59 PM Rating: Decent
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Soljourner wrote:
Then Theo, let me reiterate this for you so you can get off the tit. By oppinion I meant for people to stop saying that skill sucks. Thats completely oppinion based. I never asked for that. I asked for any known ambush builds that people may have seen or known about that gives the largest crit % possible, the best synergy with any other skill and the highest 1-shot damage output. Thats facts, not oppinions.

No, it's a fact. Ambush sucks in the current game build. It's not like if my opinion were to change to thinking, "Ambush is awesome" that it suddenly gains a whole metric ton of viability.

Your OP was:

Soljourner wrote:
Anyone know of any good ambush builds? I can't seem to find any for the life of me.

And people answered. Ambush is not good at 70. The damage to energy cost ratio (also known as DPE) is poor, it provides you with little to no control of a target (which is what rogues need at 70, with the larger health pools), and it requires daggers, which--unless you're mutilate--are also very poor in the current build of the game.

So get the **** out of the forums until you can get your head out of your *** and realize that your wording was ******* terrible.
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#30 Sep 18 2008 at 1:07 PM Rating: Default
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Well, I apologize for my wording, I'm in a hurry typing this as I'm in the bgs at the moment. And again, ambush sucking is a personal opinion (thanks for the correct spelling). The word "sucks" is what makes it so. Mathmaticaly speaking or not. And again, for a 1 shot kill, ambush still provides the largest number in the rogue's ******** Mutilate does close, but not quite. And thats the whole goal of this post. So, if your not willing to add in constructive help, get the hell out of my thread. Personally, I dont care as I'm not likely to remember you nor anything you say. Oh and as for wording, thats different cultures. Not sure where your from at all, dont care. People have different phrases and apply their words differently.

Edited, Sep 18th 2008 5:02pm by Soljourner
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#31 Sep 18 2008 at 1:10 PM Rating: Good
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Soljourner wrote:
Like I said, I know ambush isnt the best 1 shot dps, I prefer mutilate if thats what I wanted to take seriously.

In your OP you were basically asking for the best possible build around a mediocre talent. Which is, well, kinda a dumb thing to ask in a mostly-serious-player forum. Theo has a point, the way you posted was iffy. If it's just casual, what's the point of asking advice? If it's even semi-serious, stick to Muti. "Fun" is of course subjective. But you should have stressed that in your OP.

And, trust me, you aren't going to 1-shot anybody at 70 unless it's their first BG weekend. And even then..... doubtful. ;)
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#32 Sep 18 2008 at 1:16 PM Rating: Default
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No probs. I believe I posted the 1 shots being targetted to clothies at around 60% life. Not full, no way I'd be able to one shot anyone at full. But to me, the OP was simple, I asked if anyone knew of any good ambush builds. That doesn't imply the perfect build, or the most damaging cookie cutter builds. Simply if anyone knew of any. The second line has no effect on the post at all, simply stating that I couldn't find any. So if I asked if anyone knew of any builds at all, that does not imply that I'm looking to hear ambush sucks, or get off the forums or anything else. Simply that I'm looking for any links to threads/forums or build suggestions. Seems pretty simple to me is all. Something that small started the whole thing, which is quite funny, but I dont feed off of the stuff, so I have no interest in arguing personal semantics with anyone that doesn't want to apply any knowledge of the OP to the thread.
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#33 Sep 18 2008 at 1:19 PM Rating: Default
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And on that note, sorry for the double post, again, in Eots at the moment. I've gotten two builds to look at. I'll be trying both here shortly. Anymore out there?
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#34 Sep 18 2008 at 1:24 PM Rating: Decent
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This will be the best Ambush build if you're not going 30/0/31.
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#35 Sep 18 2008 at 1:37 PM Rating: Default
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Mind if I ask why the 3 points in vile poisons? For the dispel resists? What do you think bout changing them over to Serrated blades?
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#36 Sep 18 2008 at 1:39 PM Rating: Decent
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You could do that, but I honestly don't know what to do without Vile Poisons in PvP. If I run into a group with a shaman or paladin I'm *******
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#37 Sep 18 2008 at 1:52 PM Rating: Decent
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Soljourner wrote:
Not sure where your from at all, dont care


FYI

I think it says "Posting from Draka (aka Seattle)" in his Location. I might be wrong, but I am guessing Seattle is where he is from.

Edit: Edited for punctuation and spacing.

Edited, Sep 18th 2008 5:47pm by Feyras
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#38 Sep 18 2008 at 1:56 PM Rating: Excellent
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You could do that, but I honestly don't know what to do without Vile Poisons in PvP. If I run into a group with a shaman or paladin I'm @#%^ed.

Stop nubbing it up in front of everyone. It's bad for your image. The OP asked about BURST damage talents for Ambush, not logical or useful talents that might save your a$$ in actual game-play!

Duh.

Smiley: tongue
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#39 Sep 18 2008 at 2:00 PM Rating: Decent
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No, i know the purpose of VP in a serious build, I use it in my maces, but I'm not likely to ambush mail wearing wearers either. I dont normally have problems with resto shammies anyway, resto druids on the other hand are another matter. I just tend to keep em busy while someone else kills em.
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#40 Sep 18 2008 at 2:02 PM Rating: Default
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For my two cents here, this is what I'm rolling with at the moment. A lot is based on preferrence even there though; I can live without vile poisons (at this point at least), though I somewhat regret having lost imp ambush. You could probably swap Initiative for Imp Ambush, I suppose. 'Maxing' it out you'd probably end up with this. It's not horrible to play with, really, it's just... well... Ambush.
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#41 Sep 18 2008 at 2:30 PM Rating: Default
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not a bad build at all. I like the idea of trying to improve sub combo points. Sub isnt' exactly known for its large amount of Cp like assassination builds are. Only thing I'd miss is step, which you trade out for Seal Fate. Which would mean we need camo, which you included. I'd definately like to try this one out.
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#42 Sep 18 2008 at 2:37 PM Rating: Default
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I like the idea of trying to improve sub combo points. Sub isnt' exactly known for its large amount of Cp like assassination builds are.


That's exactly the reason I switched to it =P. I figured that backstab+prep+seal fate would give me a playstyle quite alike mutilate, aside from the fact that I'm less reliant on poisons and pick up some more of the subtlety stuff I can no longer live without (MoD, Camo, Dirty Tricks)*. I've so far managed to live with the lack of ShS (I think I lose 1 or 2 out of ~30 arena games specifically because of that), it's mostly the fact that backstab is still too much of an energy sink and the lack of pure statboosters that mess it up.

Edit: I just noticed the * part doesn't make sense... I'm off to bed now.

Edited, Sep 19th 2008 12:32am by Mozared
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