Okay so we all know that dk's can turn hots into dots. But my question is, does that only work on the person who casts them. For example if a druid hots lets say a warrior, can the dk turn those hots on the warrior into dots.
So basically is it hots into dots or only the hots on the person who is giving out the hots.
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... what are you on about?
Am I just being ignorant or?
Am I just being ignorant or?
"Mozared wrote:
... what are you on about?
Am I just being ignorant or?
Am I just being ignorant or?
I assume the OP is talking about Degenerate:
"WotLK Wiki wrote:
Instantly attack the target, dealing 60% weapon damage and inflicting a disease dealing 98 over 21 sec. Any existing heal over time spells on the target become corrupted, dramatically increasing the damage done by the disease and removing the healing effect.
Now, as I understand it (I'm not in Beta), the current version doesn't necessarily turn HoTs into DoTs, but instead removes the HoTs and makes the default disease deal muhc more damage.
To answer the OP's question, yes, the bonus damage will apply to the warrior. So if a priest Renews a paladin, and the DK uses Degenerate on the Paladin, it will remove the Renew and cause the already-present disease DoT to cause much more damage.
It's be great if someone from Beta could confirm this.
Edited, Aug 22nd 2008 10:32pm by IDrownFish
29 posts
So assuming what you said IDrownFish, which sounds reasonable and is what I thought, this is what I fear will happen.
So have you ever been in a bg where you broke someones cc or did something to get them killed, I have done it. While some of the players I encountered are okay with this, the majority of the people that I end up killing, with all intentions of helping, whisper me nasty things that I don't wish to repeat. I'm sure that situation has happened to all of us. I personally don't like it when my own teammate gets me killed, but I understand that they are trying to help.
So assuming that the spell works the way we think it works, according to this thread, I can imagine that rest druids, and to a lesser extent holy priest will start to get flamed hardcore. And it might even get to the point where people are just like don't heal me or afk out I dont want you to end up killing me.
That is why I was hoping it would only affect the people who casts the hots. If it is as we understand in this forum so far, I am probably going to go to the suggestion forums and bring up this point. Thats why I would really like to know the answer for sure. I along with others hate resto druids, but no class or person deserves to get flamed and their class destroyed like this.
Am I the only one who sees this as a possibility of happening, or am I looking to much into it.
Edited, Aug 22nd 2008 10:50pm by Zcvar
So have you ever been in a bg where you broke someones cc or did something to get them killed, I have done it. While some of the players I encountered are okay with this, the majority of the people that I end up killing, with all intentions of helping, whisper me nasty things that I don't wish to repeat. I'm sure that situation has happened to all of us. I personally don't like it when my own teammate gets me killed, but I understand that they are trying to help.
So assuming that the spell works the way we think it works, according to this thread, I can imagine that rest druids, and to a lesser extent holy priest will start to get flamed hardcore. And it might even get to the point where people are just like don't heal me or afk out I dont want you to end up killing me.
That is why I was hoping it would only affect the people who casts the hots. If it is as we understand in this forum so far, I am probably going to go to the suggestion forums and bring up this point. Thats why I would really like to know the answer for sure. I along with others hate resto druids, but no class or person deserves to get flamed and their class destroyed like this.
Am I the only one who sees this as a possibility of happening, or am I looking to much into it.
Edited, Aug 22nd 2008 10:50pm by Zcvar
1. Druids are one of, if not THE best PvP healer, so having a class against them is good, especially as Lifebloom was a counter to those who could dispell Hots.
2. No one smart will complain about you healing them because "omg DK" because the alternative is no heals, of which they'd then complain about anyway.
3. Priests can cure disease anyway.
2. No one smart will complain about you healing them because "omg DK" because the alternative is no heals, of which they'd then complain about anyway.
3. Priests can cure disease anyway.
9 posts
Confirmed, Degenerate removes all exsisting HoTs and causes the disease of the initial attack cause more damage.
HyatoX wrote:
Confirmed, Degenerate removes all exsisting HoTs and causes the disease of the initial attack cause more damage.
Sounds like an absolute winner of a talent so far. I can't way to see how this plays out when DK's go live.
I'm wondering how effective (disc?) priests will be against Death Knights. (as far as I know) Death Knights have some anti-kiting skills but no real slowing skills; which means priests will be staying out of a DK's melee range as much as possible while having cure disease stuck to themselves like a wart plaster. And then I'm not even mentioning shackle vs lichborn and the fact that (again, as far as I know) a DK lacks CC or interruption. Even if stuff goes bad a priest could just go and cast a big heal. Which would heal for 100% as well, seeing as (again, as far as I know) DK's don't have a -X% heal ability.
The only bad thing is that a disc priest isn't going to kill a DK either; just switching to blood presence will probably outdamage anything the priest throws at them.
The only bad thing is that a disc priest isn't going to kill a DK either; just switching to blood presence will probably outdamage anything the priest throws at them.
29 posts
I'd rather get no heals, than heals that kill me. Its obvious that druids need to be toned down. Instead of nerfing them blizzard is going to completely destroy them.
If it is just the hots on a druid that a dk can turn into dots, then I would have no problem. But I think people are missing the point. Players dont like it when their own teammates get them killed, and that is what is going to happen with druids. The whole point is druids are going to end up killing their own teammates which no one likes. Thus destroying their class. Calling it right now, if this change goes as is, druids will be a destroyed class like the mages are in bc.
Whoever rated me down, man up and give a legit reason for it.
If it is just the hots on a druid that a dk can turn into dots, then I would have no problem. But I think people are missing the point. Players dont like it when their own teammates get them killed, and that is what is going to happen with druids. The whole point is druids are going to end up killing their own teammates which no one likes. Thus destroying their class. Calling it right now, if this change goes as is, druids will be a destroyed class like the mages are in bc.
Whoever rated me down, man up and give a legit reason for it.
Smart Priests simply won't use Renew on the people in melee with a deathknight. They have plenty of other options for healing, including Abolish Disease, which will be almost as hard on Deathknights as Druids' Abolish Poison is on Rogues.
Edited, Aug 27th 2008 6:32pm by emmitsvenson
Edited, Aug 27th 2008 6:32pm by emmitsvenson
kk 2 things. Firstly BG's and arenas aren't going to be filled with DK's so people will still be able to heal. Also the DoT effect is increased from 98dmg over 21 seconds to something much higher for each HoT effect. Now this might be rank 1 but 98 damage isn't a massive amount even if 1 HoT increase it by 100% to 196 damage over 21 seconds its not panic station. Priests will have no issue imo as they can just counter this by abolishing the disease. This ability costs runic power so can't be spammed, so HoT...abolish the new disease re-HoT spell.
However this is an amazing counter for druids which i am happy about. However resto druids can consume their HoTs for big heals. Idk how it will really pan out against druids and like an OP said i would love for a beta tester to confirm / deny how useful this is.
However this is an amazing counter for druids which i am happy about. However resto druids can consume their HoTs for big heals. Idk how it will really pan out against druids and like an OP said i would love for a beta tester to confirm / deny how useful this is.
yankytoon wrote:
kk 2 things. Firstly BG's and arenas aren't going to be filled with DK's so people will still be able to heal. Also the DoT effect is increased from 98dmg over 21 seconds to something much higher for each HoT effect. Now this might be rank 1 but 98 damage isn't a massive amount even if 1 HoT increase it by 100% to 196 damage over 21 seconds its not panic station.
Druids can have a max of 7 Hots (Lifebloom x4, Rejuv, Regrowth, Nourish) 8 if Innervate's counted. That's 794 base damage.
Still don't think it's that bad considering the amount of healing that guy would have been receiving in the first place.
Edited, Sep 10th 2008 4:14am by Micros
is innervate a HoT and does Lifebloom count as 4 or just 1? And nourish is a heal that does more healing if Rejuv. is on that target or is it actually a HoT itself?
Unless my information is outdated, which very well could be:
- Lifebloom stacks to 3, not 4. Whether it counts as multiple HoTs or just one for the purpose of DKs I have no idea though.
- Nourish heals more if the target has a HoT on it, but it does not provide a HoT.
- Flourish is a new HoT spell, so I'm sure that would contribute to the DK HoTs to DoTs thing.
- Innervate restores mana, not health, so would it really be considered a HoT (healing over time)?
- Lifebloom stacks to 3, not 4. Whether it counts as multiple HoTs or just one for the purpose of DKs I have no idea though.
- Nourish heals more if the target has a HoT on it, but it does not provide a HoT.
- Flourish is a new HoT spell, so I'm sure that would contribute to the DK HoTs to DoTs thing.
- Innervate restores mana, not health, so would it really be considered a HoT (healing over time)?
Maulgak wrote:
Unless my information is outdated, which very well could be:
- Lifebloom stacks to 3, not 4.
- Lifebloom stacks to 3, not 4.
My bad there, mistook Glyph of Lifebloom to allow an extra stack but just increases the duration by 1 sec.
Quote:
- Nourish heals more if the target has a HoT on it, but it does not provide a HoT.
- Flourish is a new HoT spell, so I'm sure that would contribute to the DK HoTs to DoTs thing.
- Flourish is a new HoT spell, so I'm sure that would contribute to the DK HoTs to DoTs thing.
Yep, my bad again, got names mixed up.
Quote:
- Innervate restores mana, not health, so would it really be considered a HoT (healing over time)?
Wether it'd be counted or not, I wasn't sure (as said above) but was just trying to work out a 'worst case scenario' to show it's not that bad.
Ok its been a while since this was talked about and hopefully someone will still read this post. I basically want to know how dramatic the increase in disease damage each HoT on the target will do. Eg, a DK attacks a priest with renew and the renew is removed in stead increasing the diseases damages by X%....anyone know this percent? or coefficient or however they are scaling....maybe its a druids nightmare and scales for the more HoTs on the target...wouldn't that be sweet
yankytoon wrote:
Ok its been a while since this was talked about and hopefully someone will still read this post. I basically want to know how dramatic the increase in disease damage each HoT on the target will do. Eg, a DK attacks a priest with renew and the renew is removed in stead increasing the diseases damages by X%....anyone know this percent? or coefficient or however they are scaling....maybe its a druids nightmare and scales for the more HoTs on the target...wouldn't that be sweet
I think this is all that is left of degen. I couldn't find it.
DK abilities seem a little too strong in their description. But I'm more into "wait and see" for now since this rune mechanic is new and the rune resource may limit them enough to make it require a choice of which ability to use rather than "boom boom boom pwnt without a chance to fight ******!".
If the class turns out overpowered then the game will be balanced because then everyone will reroll to DK.
Quote:
Plague Strike
A vicious strike that deals 30% weapon damage plus 30 and infects the target with Blood Plague, a disease dealing Shadow damage over time. The strike removes one heal over time effect from the target.
(Rank 6) (Instant, 5 yd range)
A vicious strike that deals 30% weapon damage plus 30 and infects the target with Blood Plague, a disease dealing Shadow damage over time. The strike removes one heal over time effect from the target.
(Rank 6) (Instant, 5 yd range)
Edited, Sep 22nd 2008 12:20am by xorq
Edited, Sep 22nd 2008 12:20am by xorq
Quote:
And then I'm not even mentioning shackle vs lichborn and the fact that (again, as far as I know) a DK lacks CC or interruption.
Can someone please confirm whether shackle actually works on DK's. Wouldn't they be classified into the humanoid category a la the Forsaken type of undead otherwise they'd be immune most CC apart from paladins and priests?
Or did I just read this wrong?
Edited, Sep 22nd 2008 9:32am by arthoriuss
Death Knights can be shackled while using Lichborn as it makes them count as undead. However, this also makes them immune to Fear, Polymorph, and Sap.
Cheers for the clarification there SomnusSleeper I thought Blizzard may have stuffed up like they did with the original 'undead' Forsaken!
Quote:
Death Knights can be shackled while using Lichborn as it makes them count as undead. However, this also makes them immune to Fear, Polymorph, and Sap.
I'm not sure about the latter anymore... Last I heard about sap was that it was going to get buffed to allow sapping of "more than humanoids; undead, beasts... pretty much anything with a brain". No idea where that went though.
On a sidenote; this ability would make any team with a DK a natural counter vs Restodruid+class X?
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