Hold on the flamethrowers please, its not what you think. I figured I'd try to compile a bit of info for an impromptu sticki (or at least a bumpable thread) with posts that answer the age old question.
So, here's where you're at. You've decided to take the fast track to 70 and have an enhancement spec. You're at, or just about to hit level 40 and now you ponder whether to keep your 2 hander or make the switch.
Here's what you need to do:
1) Read this, its the accepted guide to the DW/2H debate:
Elitist Jerks Shaman: Enhancement Guide - Two Handed Viability
2) Read these Alla posts on the (same) subject:
How much am I missing NOT DWing?
Whats the advantages of using a 2h weapon and DW
Regarding 2handed weapons
Can Shamans dual wield?
2h or dual wield for leveling?
2h or dual weild, that is the question
3) Post your question if it hasn't been covered in the extensive advice, conversations and debates above.
Keeping in mind that a generic 'Which is Better...' post made without any research may open you for a flaming.
Good luck and hope these links help.
Edited, Aug 14th 2008 6:43pm by OzoneSSX
- Forums
- World of Warcraft
- Class Discussion
- 2-Hand vs. Dual Wield Advice
2-Hand vs. Dual Wield AdviceFollow
Your post did not need to go past this point:
For those of you too lazy to read, here is the pertinent information:
2H weapons are strictly inferior for PvE DPS situations. Talents and mechanics of shaman DPS at lvl 70 are built around DW. 9% +Hit while DWing through a 0/42/19 build allows all special attacks to be hit capped through talents alone, while a 2H will only receive 3% of the hit benefit. DW also scales better with AP. 2h effectively gains (1.0 * 0.95 hit rate) = 0.95 from AP and DW gains (1.5 * 0.74 hit rate) = 1.11 from AP. The more +hit you have (until we reach cap) the greater the difference between the two is. At a certain point (easily reached when raid buffed), this difference in gain from AP will outweigh the bonus base DPS of a 2H weapon over similar ilevel 1H weapons.
The second largest benefit you bring to your group is Unleashed Rage, and your Flurry and UR uptime will take a large hit from using a 2H, as strings of dodge/miss/non crits become compounded by a single, slower swing time. Threat concerns are even more problematic with a 2H because of large WF procs, requiring that you heavily pad your threat against a tank.
And finally, as mentioned in the Windfury Proc section, DW with WF on both weapons results in an increased chance to proc WF off either hand (36%). 2H weapons will not benefit from that increased proc rate.
Not to most. To the uninformed.
Not to many. To the informed. Or the experienced, whichever you prefer.
Those would be the diehard 2H fans who love to use 2H's just for the sake of using a 2H, and you can't consider such blind devotion or biased preference in a discussion of what is more effective.
Playstyle based on fun can not be considered right or wrong. If someone says, "I like 2H's," you can't tell them, "You're wrong." That doesn't make any sense. But no one can say that a 2H is better than DW for any Shaman. That is wrong, and the opposite is right. You're just dragging this out unnecessarily by saying otherwise.
For those of you too lazy to read, here is the pertinent information:
2H weapons are strictly inferior for PvE DPS situations. Talents and mechanics of shaman DPS at lvl 70 are built around DW. 9% +Hit while DWing through a 0/42/19 build allows all special attacks to be hit capped through talents alone, while a 2H will only receive 3% of the hit benefit. DW also scales better with AP. 2h effectively gains (1.0 * 0.95 hit rate) = 0.95 from AP and DW gains (1.5 * 0.74 hit rate) = 1.11 from AP. The more +hit you have (until we reach cap) the greater the difference between the two is. At a certain point (easily reached when raid buffed), this difference in gain from AP will outweigh the bonus base DPS of a 2H weapon over similar ilevel 1H weapons.
The second largest benefit you bring to your group is Unleashed Rage, and your Flurry and UR uptime will take a large hit from using a 2H, as strings of dodge/miss/non crits become compounded by a single, slower swing time. Threat concerns are even more problematic with a 2H because of large WF procs, requiring that you heavily pad your threat against a tank.
And finally, as mentioned in the Windfury Proc section, DW with WF on both weapons results in an increased chance to proc WF off either hand (36%). 2H weapons will not benefit from that increased proc rate.
Quote:
To most, DW is for PvE, 2H is for PvP.
Not to most. To the uninformed.
Quote:
To many, DW is all there is.
Not to many. To the informed. Or the experienced, whichever you prefer.
Quote:
To some, 2H is all they use.
Those would be the diehard 2H fans who love to use 2H's just for the sake of using a 2H, and you can't consider such blind devotion or biased preference in a discussion of what is more effective.
Quote:
No-one is right or wrong. They play based on their playstyle and what they find fun.
Playstyle based on fun can not be considered right or wrong. If someone says, "I like 2H's," you can't tell them, "You're wrong." That doesn't make any sense. But no one can say that a 2H is better than DW for any Shaman. That is wrong, and the opposite is right. You're just dragging this out unnecessarily by saying otherwise.
Hiya Gaud,
Just going with the general consensus via the threads. I agree that there's no need to go past the Elitist Jerks link but for many it's not going to be personal enough, there will still be questions like, 'I read this but...'.
Thus all the links - so people can check out all sides of the debate and decide for themselves without repetitive posts.
And whether people are uninformed, informed or diehard, it all comes down to how they enjoy playing. Technically DW may be the better option, but if someone enjoys 2H then in their opinion they can't be wrong. This thread is simply meant to show them the different opinions of the community on the matter.
This isn't a debate or an argument, the post simply is what it is.
Cheers.
Edited, Aug 14th 2008 12:58am by OzoneSSX
Just going with the general consensus via the threads. I agree that there's no need to go past the Elitist Jerks link but for many it's not going to be personal enough, there will still be questions like, 'I read this but...'.
Thus all the links - so people can check out all sides of the debate and decide for themselves without repetitive posts.
And whether people are uninformed, informed or diehard, it all comes down to how they enjoy playing. Technically DW may be the better option, but if someone enjoys 2H then in their opinion they can't be wrong. This thread is simply meant to show them the different opinions of the community on the matter.
This isn't a debate or an argument, the post simply is what it is.
Cheers.
Edited, Aug 14th 2008 12:58am by OzoneSSX
I understand that, but what you've essentially done here with this post is... nothing at all. If anything, you're actually making matters worse by providing a very grey overview on what is, at its heart, a very black and white matter. If you want to clean up the matter with a single sticky-worthy post, then lay it out. Newcomers here will not know the sky is blue unless you tell them.
1. In terms of effectiveness in every aspect of the game, DW is superior to 2H. As soon as you get it. Through the end of the game. Always. Period. End of story.
2. 2H's are for people who like using 2H's. So use them for fun if you like them.
That's about as complicated as it needs to get.
1. In terms of effectiveness in every aspect of the game, DW is superior to 2H. As soon as you get it. Through the end of the game. Always. Period. End of story.
2. 2H's are for people who like using 2H's. So use them for fun if you like them.
That's about as complicated as it needs to get.
Heh, the only shamans 2hands are good for are resto shamans, cant use DW and it gives you chance at DPS with windfury. :) Otherwise all enchancement shamans should be using 2-Hand once they are able to spec for it.
Ok so the OP has displease Guadion by making statments that make is sound like it is ok to Dual Wield.
That is no reason to not clean up the first post, certify its goodness via a nod from all the Guru's around here and then get it stickied.
We really could use this blatant post as a sticky. I mean, we get a question about this at least once a week.
Lets clean it up and get it stickied.
That is no reason to not clean up the first post, certify its goodness via a nod from all the Guru's around here and then get it stickied.
We really could use this blatant post as a sticky. I mean, we get a question about this at least once a week.
Lets clean it up and get it stickied.
Moonkissed wrote:
Ok so the OP has displease Guadion by making statments that make is sound like it is ok to Dual Wield.
What? I'm sorry, did you even read the original post or my replies? Either that was a poorly-worded attempt at being a smartass or you missed the point entirely. Allow me to draw your attention to the following:
Quote:
You'll find a lot of differing opinions and advice.
To most, DW is for PvE, 2H is for PvP.
To many, DW is all there is.
To some, 2H is all they use.
No-one is right or wrong. They play based on their playstyle and what they find fun.
To most, DW is for PvE, 2H is for PvP.
To many, DW is all there is.
To some, 2H is all they use.
No-one is right or wrong. They play based on their playstyle and what they find fun.
This is what I was taking issue with. Outside of the links, this is the meat of his post, and it's... a summary of player preference? Where does that become relevant or answer the question at hand? That's the entire reason we keep getting all the misinformation in the Allakhazam posts in the first place, because too many people go on blind preference or unfounded opinion instead of data or experience.
Quote:
That is no reason to not clean up the first post, certify its goodness via a nod from all the Guru's around here and then get it stickied.
Which is entirely my point. If you want this post to answer a question, then make sure it answers the question at hand. Don't just make an open-ended summary.
He's got a lot of links up there to Allakhazam posts which are full of just as much unfounded opinions (2H rocks!) as they are solid advice (DW is better for everything), and the EJ post, which is always useful to the people who take time to read it (and understand it), but he doesn't make it a point to actually lay it out in his post. Like I said, if you don't tell the newcomers that the sky is blue, then they don't know. That's why these posts keep popping up even though we've already got countless FAQs across the internet and countless posts here.
Quote:
Lets clean it up and get it stickied.
I'm telling him how to do it.
Now was their any other reason for you to be a smartass or does it just make you feel more important here when you pick a bone with me?
Gaudion wrote:
[
This is what I was taking issue with. Outside of the links, this is the meat of his post, and it's... a summary of player preference? Where does that become relevant or answer the question at hand?
Quote:
You'll find a lot of differing opinions and advice.
To most, DW is for PvE, 2H is for PvP.
To many, DW is all there is.
To some, 2H is all they use.
No-one is right or wrong. They play based on their playstyle and what they find fun.
To most, DW is for PvE, 2H is for PvP.
To many, DW is all there is.
To some, 2H is all they use.
No-one is right or wrong. They play based on their playstyle and what they find fun.
This is what I was taking issue with. Outside of the links, this is the meat of his post, and it's... a summary of player preference? Where does that become relevant or answer the question at hand?
You should check out our Hunter forum.
I swear to god people are encouraging melee hunters.
Oh My God... dude crap.
I did not get any sleep last night. What I mean to say is that... look I am still tired and I will probably mess this one up. I honestly was not trying to start anything Gaudion. What I was trying to do is say, lets keep at it.
Meh... I am really sorry.
I did not get any sleep last night. What I mean to say is that... look I am still tired and I will probably mess this one up. I honestly was not trying to start anything Gaudion. What I was trying to do is say, lets keep at it.
Meh... I am really sorry.
OzoneSSX wrote:
Technically DW may be the better option, but if someone enjoys 2H then in their opinion they can't be wrong. This thread is simply meant to show them the different opinions of the community on the matter.
Why do people think that opinions can't be wrong. Yes, yes they can.
If the question is, "What is better 2H or DW?", then the answer is DW. Opinions that oppose the mechanics of the game are wrong. Plain and simply wrong. Argue it all you want. Opinions
Now if the question is "What is funner 2H or DW?", then the answer would vary and nobody's opinion would be wrong.
However we don't care about personal preferences. We care about what the best is and why.
OzoneSSX deserve props for the effort, but Gaudion and others raise good points. It may be worth sharpening this just by saying:
Dual-wield is superior for PvE. Some people argue that two-handers are better for PvP but that is questionable.
----
NB: I am one who will only PvP while dual-wielding however, unlike for PvE, you can't prove the superiority of the approach mathematically. So some ambiguity there is fine. But I do think that implying there's a grey zone in PvE is misleading. The compendium of links pretty well demonstrate that dual-wield is the way to go, but you can't count on everyone to click those links.
Edit: I totally agree with the sticky suggestion. Just make clear there is no real debate about which is better (dps-wise, not fun-wise) for PvE and it's there.
Edited, Aug 14th 2008 6:25pm by tuskerdu
Dual-wield is superior for PvE. Some people argue that two-handers are better for PvP but that is questionable.
----
NB: I am one who will only PvP while dual-wielding however, unlike for PvE, you can't prove the superiority of the approach mathematically. So some ambiguity there is fine. But I do think that implying there's a grey zone in PvE is misleading. The compendium of links pretty well demonstrate that dual-wield is the way to go, but you can't count on everyone to click those links.
Edit: I totally agree with the sticky suggestion. Just make clear there is no real debate about which is better (dps-wise, not fun-wise) for PvE and it's there.
Edited, Aug 14th 2008 6:25pm by tuskerdu
BAAAAHHHHAAAAAAAAAAA!
/ripping hair out
Yes. I agree. I have a shammy, was enhance DW, now elemental for time being. When I go back to enhance, guess what, I'm going DW. Why, cuz I agree with most and know its the best option.
THUS! The initial link to Elitist Jerks, which says Dual wield is the nuts (and is noted as the 'accepted guide').
THEN! I posted some extra links for those who either couldn't be bothered to read the EJ stuff or wanted a more personal opinion from the community on their thoughts in order to help give them a wider basis of opinion. Which some people like.
Geeze! Hold on... /takes Valium downed by shot of scotch...
KK, better now.
The thread shows the ipso-facto in the first link, which I agree with and follow.
Then shows debate and opinions in the following links, for those wanting more info from those who have experienced it.
Then sums up the overall opinions from the threads (in that bit of text I wrote) - as I spent a while digging things out and reading through all of the posts. Maybe I should remove that? (EDIT: Removed)
Then says, if you haven't read all this and still post a question not answered, expect to get flamed.
Personally i didn't expect to get flamed (its up and down) for trying to help out on a topic we all say we've heard enough of.
Bah, just finished med finals after a stressful couple of weeks. Not to mention getting married next week which hasn't helped stressors during exams. OK, I'm going to log out of here, log into WoW, and try desperately to take out my frustrations by killing that little jerk in SW who stole the dollie. May actually make a hordie to do it and make numerous suicide runs.
/calm
KK, I'm better now, really...
where's that little sh&t in SW...
Edited, Aug 14th 2008 6:44pm by OzoneSSX
/ripping hair out
Yes. I agree. I have a shammy, was enhance DW, now elemental for time being. When I go back to enhance, guess what, I'm going DW. Why, cuz I agree with most and know its the best option.
THUS! The initial link to Elitist Jerks, which says Dual wield is the nuts (and is noted as the 'accepted guide').
THEN! I posted some extra links for those who either couldn't be bothered to read the EJ stuff or wanted a more personal opinion from the community on their thoughts in order to help give them a wider basis of opinion. Which some people like.
Geeze! Hold on... /takes Valium downed by shot of scotch...
KK, better now.
The thread shows the ipso-facto in the first link, which I agree with and follow.
Then shows debate and opinions in the following links, for those wanting more info from those who have experienced it.
Then sums up the overall opinions from the threads (in that bit of text I wrote) - as I spent a while digging things out and reading through all of the posts. Maybe I should remove that? (EDIT: Removed)
Then says, if you haven't read all this and still post a question not answered, expect to get flamed.
Personally i didn't expect to get flamed (its up and down) for trying to help out on a topic we all say we've heard enough of.
Bah, just finished med finals after a stressful couple of weeks. Not to mention getting married next week which hasn't helped stressors during exams. OK, I'm going to log out of here, log into WoW, and try desperately to take out my frustrations by killing that little jerk in SW who stole the dollie. May actually make a hordie to do it and make numerous suicide runs.
/calm
KK, I'm better now, really...
where's that little sh&t in SW...
Edited, Aug 14th 2008 6:44pm by OzoneSSX
Moonkissed: No problem, and I apologize for going so far down your throat.
OzoneSSX: Elephant tranquilizer.
While I've not actually seen a mathematical reasoning as to why DW is better the PvP, this is the area where I believe experience trumps all. If you look at all of the higher-rated Enhancement Shaman in the arena, they all DW. And as someone who plays a healer in PvP, I can say that, without a doubt, the DW Shaman do more damage over time and are harder to heal through, which is what PvP is all about for a melee DPS class.
DW is better for everything.
Edited, Aug 14th 2008 7:07pm by Gaudion
OzoneSSX: Elephant tranquilizer.
tuskerdu wrote:
NB: I am one who will only PvP while dual-wielding however, unlike for PvE, you can't prove the superiority of the approach mathematically. So some ambiguity there is fine. But I do think that implying there's a grey zone in PvE is misleading. The compendium of links pretty well demonstrate that dual-wield is the way to go, but you can't count on everyone to click those links.
While I've not actually seen a mathematical reasoning as to why DW is better the PvP, this is the area where I believe experience trumps all. If you look at all of the higher-rated Enhancement Shaman in the arena, they all DW. And as someone who plays a healer in PvP, I can say that, without a doubt, the DW Shaman do more damage over time and are harder to heal through, which is what PvP is all about for a melee DPS class.
DW is better for everything.
Edited, Aug 14th 2008 7:07pm by Gaudion
Gaudion, I completely agree on the PvP front, a little part of me dies every time I see an enhancer with a 2-hander in PvP. But it is more subjective than PvE and I think we can let it slide in a sticky. Perhaps noting that all top-ranked enhancement shamans are dual-wield (I haven't checked this, but keep hearing it and believe it) would take care of that issue.
Moonkissed wrote:
Oh My God... dude crap.
I did not get any sleep last night. What I mean to say is that... look I am still tired and I will probably mess this one up. I honestly was not trying to start anything Gaudion. What I was trying to do is say, lets keep at it.
Meh... I am really sorry.
I did not get any sleep last night. What I mean to say is that... look I am still tired and I will probably mess this one up. I honestly was not trying to start anything Gaudion. What I was trying to do is say, lets keep at it.
Meh... I am really sorry.
Mmm...this post really got to me. Moon, there's no reason to suck up to Gaud or to apologize for your opinion. Initially I found many of his posts pricklike and condescending, I still don't agree (in the most part) with his attitude, but overall he does offer some great advice (see: rouge forums). Confront him on issues you have and stand your ground. He'll argue, be a prick, and tell you he knows best...but, he may not always be right (though most often, there's loads of good stuff in there to take note of). In my opinion, I would think Gaud appreciates and respects an argument (with a basis), as opposed to a blind following showing weakness and subserviance. Stick up for your opinions and thoughts!
I still, for the moment, think he's a prick, but I respect his opinion, even though I may not agree with it sometimes.
And I have followed his Rogue advice implicitly to my benefit.
And Gaud! If you read this, which I'm sure you have, pretend the respect part was never mentioned ;)
Edit: Why am I getting so worked up about this? I've linked what I think to be helpful shaman related threads in a shaman related forum with opinions from shaman who play the shaman class on a regular basis. Nuff said.
Edited, Aug 14th 2008 11:45pm by OzoneSSX
Lets keep things simple this his how you got Mr. Gaudion all worked up, Gaudion is a jerk but he knows stuff =P
I must say getting this stickied is a great idea would keep the regulars on this piece of the forum from going nuts and help out the lazy new guys that don't want to read through different threads to find out there answers.
Anyhow thanks for the thread hope it gets tacked up there quick!
p.s. who here is down for guadions intervention i think guadion could use some anger management classes, what you guys think? "HUGS"
Edited, Aug 15th 2008 12:22am by jmfmb
I must say getting this stickied is a great idea would keep the regulars on this piece of the forum from going nuts and help out the lazy new guys that don't want to read through different threads to find out there answers.
Anyhow thanks for the thread hope it gets tacked up there quick!
p.s. who here is down for guadions intervention i think guadion could use some anger management classes, what you guys think? "HUGS"
Edited, Aug 15th 2008 12:22am by jmfmb
Moonkissed wrote:
Ok so the OP has displease Guadion by making statments that make is sound like it is ok to Dual Wield.
It's comments like this that get me worked up. Ozone, I don't expect anyone to suck up to me, but I would appreciate the same level or respect that everyone else does. If it looks like someone is being a smartass about something I say, yeah, I'm gonna respond a little harshly. People act like it's such a big deal any time I post something. Any time I argue or disagree with someone... Honestly, I don't really get it. I'm just one more guy on the forums here.
Gaudion wrote:
I understand that, but what you've essentially done here with this post is... nothing at all. If anything, you're actually making matters worse by providing a very grey overview on what is, at its heart, a very black and white matter. If you want to clean up the matter with a single sticky-worthy post, then lay it out. Newcomers here will not know the sky is blue unless you tell them.
1. In terms of effectiveness in every aspect of the game, DW is superior to 2H. As soon as you get it. Through the end of the game. Always. Period. End of story.
2. 2H's are for people who like using 2H's. So use them for fun if you like them.
That's about as complicated as it needs to get.
1. In terms of effectiveness in every aspect of the game, DW is superior to 2H. As soon as you get it. Through the end of the game. Always. Period. End of story.
2. 2H's are for people who like using 2H's. So use them for fun if you like them.
That's about as complicated as it needs to get.
This.
If you use 2H's post the ability to train Dual Wield. You fail at Shaman, Enhancement.
Gaudion is exactly correct in his two points, I would like to add a third:
3. Quit @#$%ing asking this question.
Gaudion: Yeah I totally meant that statement to be more of a silly little thing. The idea that DW and 2-Hand were up for debate as far as superiority was a bad idea, and I totally agreed with ya. What I should have said is: Although the OP has disagreed with what we have proven again and again to be common knowledge thereby irritating the forum gurus.
Problem is I was retarded that day.
OzoneSSX: I don't suck up to Gaudion, actually I have butted heads with him more than once. The main problem is that I love humor and silliness, and Gaudion likes to stay to the point. So while I am off metaphorically slamming my head into a wall, he is giving good advice. That is the problem with the internet, one of us could be trying to give brotherly or sisterly advice while the other assumes we are flaming them.
Well happy Sunday!
Problem is I was retarded that day.
OzoneSSX: I don't suck up to Gaudion, actually I have butted heads with him more than once. The main problem is that I love humor and silliness, and Gaudion likes to stay to the point. So while I am off metaphorically slamming my head into a wall, he is giving good advice. That is the problem with the internet, one of us could be trying to give brotherly or sisterly advice while the other assumes we are flaming them.
Well happy Sunday!
I haven't touched 2hander after 40 but one thing has been on my mind ever since:
How much difference there must be between weapons to use a 2hander? I mean that if you have lvl40 1handers and first 2hander from outland, which is better choice? Or 2 daggers vs nice 2hander? Also when EJ think about raid issues and such it means nothing when ur soloing while leveling and gear is what it is.
Now don't get me wrong, I wouldn't go in 2hander easily but still I have never seen this kinda depate or answer.
And to reply about healer using 2hander for WF, I don't know was it a joke but if it was now... I always use shield & 1hander with flametongue and "stand my ground". I don't kite mobs but instead I pull'em with CL/LB + FireShock combo and keep healing stream and searing totem down (also WoA and stoneskin). Depending about situation I swich between earth shield and water shield. Am I doing right or not?
How much difference there must be between weapons to use a 2hander? I mean that if you have lvl40 1handers and first 2hander from outland, which is better choice? Or 2 daggers vs nice 2hander? Also when EJ think about raid issues and such it means nothing when ur soloing while leveling and gear is what it is.
Now don't get me wrong, I wouldn't go in 2hander easily but still I have never seen this kinda depate or answer.
And to reply about healer using 2hander for WF, I don't know was it a joke but if it was now... I always use shield & 1hander with flametongue and "stand my ground". I don't kite mobs but instead I pull'em with CL/LB + FireShock combo and keep healing stream and searing totem down (also WoA and stoneskin). Depending about situation I swich between earth shield and water shield. Am I doing right or not?
Causa wrote:
I haven't touched 2hander after 40 but one thing has been on my mind ever since:
How much difference there must be between weapons to use a 2hander? I mean that if you have lvl40 1handers and first 2hander from outland, which is better choice? Or 2 daggers vs nice 2hander? Also when EJ think about raid issues and such it means nothing when ur soloing while leveling and gear is what it is.
Now don't get me wrong, I wouldn't go in 2hander easily but still I have never seen this kinda depate or answer.
And to reply about healer using 2hander for WF, I don't know was it a joke but if it was now... I always use shield & 1hander with flametongue and "stand my ground". I don't kite mobs but instead I pull'em with CL/LB + FireShock combo and keep healing stream and searing totem down (also WoA and stoneskin). Depending about situation I swich between earth shield and water shield. Am I doing right or not?
How much difference there must be between weapons to use a 2hander? I mean that if you have lvl40 1handers and first 2hander from outland, which is better choice? Or 2 daggers vs nice 2hander? Also when EJ think about raid issues and such it means nothing when ur soloing while leveling and gear is what it is.
Now don't get me wrong, I wouldn't go in 2hander easily but still I have never seen this kinda depate or answer.
And to reply about healer using 2hander for WF, I don't know was it a joke but if it was now... I always use shield & 1hander with flametongue and "stand my ground". I don't kite mobs but instead I pull'em with CL/LB + FireShock combo and keep healing stream and searing totem down (also WoA and stoneskin). Depending about situation I swich between earth shield and water shield. Am I doing right or not?
Soloing as resto is probably difficult and irritating and as I've never even considered it, moving on.
As far the when is it ok to use a 2H > DW portion of your question. The answer is: Only when you don't care about being the best you can be.
Dead horse meet stick.
How much help or information I had from your answer? None!
If I would have levelled as resto from 45 to 65 and want to change now to enha, should I take those lvl40 1handers from bank or that 2hander from next quest which is quite nice (probably warr or pala weapon) and use it until I get two nice 1handers. That is just a scenario but ur answer is saying that I should go for 25levels old 1handers (AH is out of question in this scenario, maybe there is nothing).
Of cource you could take that 2hander and test it with those 1handers but this is why I pointed this question. Sure there is a point when 2hander makes more dmg than weak and older 1handers. How big that difference really is? I don't expect any maths done here or really accurate answers but I do expect more than 30s of your time to make few lines meaning nothing.
And about levelling as resto, trust me it's not difficult. It's a lot slower yes but also I find it safe way to grind mobs since I'm not in any point losing my hp too much. lvl66/67 and with shield and a totem ticking 80+ hp it's really not hard. When u get adds or are low on life u change water shield to earth and get 500+ per tick. Difficult, hardly. Slow, probably.
-Edit. Just to make sure that you get the idea here. I'm talking about leveling and not raiding doing instances as 70. When it comes to 70+ there is no questions about this. It's always DW and nothing else. ( why I see so many enha shammies, a lot in pvp, using DW but fast 1,5 in offhand?)
Edited, Aug 18th 2008 1:50pm by Causa
If I would have levelled as resto from 45 to 65 and want to change now to enha, should I take those lvl40 1handers from bank or that 2hander from next quest which is quite nice (probably warr or pala weapon) and use it until I get two nice 1handers. That is just a scenario but ur answer is saying that I should go for 25levels old 1handers (AH is out of question in this scenario, maybe there is nothing).
Of cource you could take that 2hander and test it with those 1handers but this is why I pointed this question. Sure there is a point when 2hander makes more dmg than weak and older 1handers. How big that difference really is? I don't expect any maths done here or really accurate answers but I do expect more than 30s of your time to make few lines meaning nothing.
And about levelling as resto, trust me it's not difficult. It's a lot slower yes but also I find it safe way to grind mobs since I'm not in any point losing my hp too much. lvl66/67 and with shield and a totem ticking 80+ hp it's really not hard. When u get adds or are low on life u change water shield to earth and get 500+ per tick. Difficult, hardly. Slow, probably.
-Edit. Just to make sure that you get the idea here. I'm talking about leveling and not raiding doing instances as 70. When it comes to 70+ there is no questions about this. It's always DW and nothing else. ( why I see so many enha shammies, a lot in pvp, using DW but fast 1,5 in offhand?)
Edited, Aug 18th 2008 1:50pm by Causa
Causa wrote:
How much help or information I had from your answer? None!
If I would have levelled as resto from 45 to 65 and want to change now to enha, should I take those lvl40 1handers from bank or that 2hander from next quest which is quite nice (probably warr or pala weapon) and use it until I get two nice 1handers. That is just a scenario but ur answer is saying that I should go for 25levels old 1handers (AH is out of question in this scenario, maybe there is nothing).
If I would have levelled as resto from 45 to 65 and want to change now to enha, should I take those lvl40 1handers from bank or that 2hander from next quest which is quite nice (probably warr or pala weapon) and use it until I get two nice 1handers. That is just a scenario but ur answer is saying that I should go for 25levels old 1handers (AH is out of question in this scenario, maybe there is nothing).
Really....
A few things wrong with this "scenario".
If you have 2 level 40 1 handers sitting in your bank at level 65, you might not be an idiot but you're definitely not maximizing your storage space.
If you consider using a level 40 weapon at level 65 you are completely inept. No discussion.
If your AH doesn't have 1 handers you can use over level 40 then the server as a whole = fail.
Sure a level 65 2-hander is gonna put out more dps than 2 level 40 1-handers. Ummm...what does that really prove?
This scenario should, could and will never happen unless your server is 2 days old and has 3 people on it.
Why even waste your time originally posting this, and then getting upset when someone tells you it's pointless?
*Takes stick from DarkRein and beats horse till it's soul is crushed*
Heres the bottom line:
DW for succes
2h for fun
End thread.
DW for succes
2h for fun
End thread.
Hikuu wrote:
Heres the bottom line:
DW for succes
2h for fun
End thread.
DW for succes
2h for fun
End thread.
Nah, that implies dual-wielding isn't fun (the old "We're pro-life because anti-abortion sounds negative" idea, or it's opposite of course). More like.
DW for success and fast leveling
2-hander for a slower change of pace or roleplaying.
Either can be fun, but one is an objectively better choice for leveling.
C'mon Galenmoon. Anonymity + audience is not a solid reason for acting like that. I have asked twice the same and simple thing and still you ignore my question and point some stupid scenario I made to clear what I mean. It was totally far out scenario in purpose to point my question and that this has never been answered here, as far as I know.
Can you now read this line and answer to this without pointing some irrelevant issues about some not so important side story? How big difference there has to be in weapons to use 2hander instead of DW?
That is not big problem but maybe in some case someone is respeccing to enha and he has 2hander in gbank and some lousy 1handers or what ever. I'm asking this only out of curiosity. Nothing else. Please take the pea out of your nose and dont think that I'm even succesting to use 2hander as melee. (or in any other specc).
-Edit. Just for fun I needed to make this edit =)
Consider this scenario and question as same category as "If batman and superman would fight, who would win?" kind of question. It will never happen and we dont have to know the answer. Now I wait for 5min and come back here to read that someone has answered this question about batman and superman ;)
Edited, Aug 19th 2008 11:23am by Causa
Can you now read this line and answer to this without pointing some irrelevant issues about some not so important side story? How big difference there has to be in weapons to use 2hander instead of DW?
That is not big problem but maybe in some case someone is respeccing to enha and he has 2hander in gbank and some lousy 1handers or what ever. I'm asking this only out of curiosity. Nothing else. Please take the pea out of your nose and dont think that I'm even succesting to use 2hander as melee. (or in any other specc).
-Edit. Just for fun I needed to make this edit =)
Consider this scenario and question as same category as "If batman and superman would fight, who would win?" kind of question. It will never happen and we dont have to know the answer. Now I wait for 5min and come back here to read that someone has answered this question about batman and superman ;)
Edited, Aug 19th 2008 11:23am by Causa
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