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Arena, Subtlety and Poison Use....Follow

#1 Aug 12 2008 at 7:38 AM Rating: Decent
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Haven't seen anything yet on Theo's PvP Rogue FAQ pertaining to Poison use in Arena, so just throwing this out there...

Being 20/0/41, I tend to go with the widely accepted Wounding-Mainhand/Crippling-Offhand.

But what about certain comps like a pair of Mages (Mind Numbing?) and/or Dual DPS?

Or what about certain Pally comps that call for you to FF on the pally, should Mindnumbing be used over Wounding to slow his Flash's down for kicks/gouges?

Just throwing this out there, feel free to give your input.
#2 Aug 12 2008 at 7:42 AM Rating: Decent
Well.. It seems kind of senseless to change your poisons just before fighting them, but thats just my opinion because I enjoy the element of surprise in arena, and not giving them time to plot out. I agree with your original set-up, and it's useful for any class because Wound poison does affect First Aid.. If I am correct? Crippling is always nice as well, no one can get away from you.. but that's just obvious.


#3 Aug 12 2008 at 7:45 AM Rating: Decent
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Juanhunglow wrote:
Well.. It seems kind of senseless to change your poisons just before fighting them, but thats just my opinion because I enjoy the element of surprise in arena...

You do know you can apply poisons while stealthed, right? And if your talking about a time issue, it takes roughly 3 seconds to swap out one poison for another.

Good point on bandaging, though im not sure if wounding affects that.

Rateup for your input!

Edited, Aug 12th 2008 11:46am by Zaknalfein
#4 Aug 12 2008 at 7:47 AM Rating: Decent
Yes, I do but it takes away the surprise factor. In my opinion, which is clearly what you're welcoming in this thread, it just takes too much time to analyze the class, and more than that, the spec. To decide which poison to use.
#5 Aug 12 2008 at 8:09 AM Rating: Good
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Have more than two weapons.

Start with Wounding/Crippling, have a macro to switch in a different off-hand to Shiv Mind-numbing if needed.

Theo could probably give alot more detailed explanation but thats the basic idea(I think).
#6 Aug 12 2008 at 8:13 AM Rating: Good
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Quote:
Yes, I do but it takes away the surprise factor. In my opinion, which is clearly what you're welcoming in this thread, it just takes too much time to analyze the class, and more than that, the spec.


If it can cast you would have mind-numbing basically period. It screws them over if they can heal, and it helps anyways with caster DPS.

I can see your point about the surprise factor, but(and no offense is intended with this) some people aim to do the best they can in PvP and so not having the right poisons could cause you to lose. But if you're not going for as high as you can go then it doesn't make much of a diff. I know I personally do PvP for fun and could care less how I do. I save my OCD about things for PvE.

EDIT: I'm in too much pain...this was meant to be an edit to my first post.

Edited, Aug 12th 2008 12:10pm by GodOfMoo
#7 Aug 12 2008 at 8:18 AM Rating: Default
GodofMoo,

I completely understand where you are coming from. As for myself, when I PvP I aim to just burst, and not in particular think twice about my weapons. But as everything goes, we all have our own opinions and ways to look at things.


And a PS: Kind of tough to tell, and if you have enough time to do this.. Maybe in a case to where it is down to you and another rogue, I would for sure go with Crippling on MH, and Deadly on OH.. Unless your opponents timing is PERFECT he cannot re-stealth with the dots on him.
#8 Aug 12 2008 at 8:32 AM Rating: Good
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Yea, but the chances of it being you and another Rogue as the only ones left isn't too high.
#9 Aug 12 2008 at 8:39 AM Rating: Good
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644 posts
I have two off-hand weapons. One has cripling, the second has mind-numbling. Against targets such as mage, priest, pally, shamy... start with a cripling Shiv, then switch* and Shiv mind-numbling and switch back to reapply Shiv frequently through proc... before mind-numbling is over, make another double weapon switch.

* in order to "switch" weapons, I use an addon such as weaponrack.

I rarely change the poisons I apply to my main weapons, but it happens. E.g. My priest partner dies and one of the two other guys dies. I remain solo against a mage: clearly, I will replace wound by mind-numbling (I find it more important to apply cripling for sure thanks to Shiv and just let mind-numbling be applied through normal proc). I do this only because wounding has little use against a mage, I obviously wouldn't do it against a priest, druid, shamy. Then, you just have to keep switching. Requires an extra amount of micro-management, but it's doable.

nostra
#10 Aug 12 2008 at 10:20 AM Rating: Good
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Quote:
But what about certain comps like a pair of Mages (Mind Numbing?) and/or Dual DPS?


Zak, just a quick piece of info from how I personally play my mage, and alot of others play. I personally use Ice Lance/Frost Nova/Cone of Cold/Fire Blast as much as possible. For the simple fact that all of those are instant cast abilities. Yes, they do use up more mana than normal casting abilities, but they make you unable to be interrupted. Ice lance with shatter crits does just as much as Frostbolt anyways. So, in this case the mind numbing poison wouldn't do too much good against a mage. There are times that I use the other abilities, but that mainly is when I am not being focused, or when I know that CD's have been blown(i.e. Shs, Deadly Throw..). We all know that poisons are hit or miss. I personally on my rogue just use the good old fashion Wound-MH Crippling-OH. Although, the multiple weapon idea is the best imo. I am just too lazy to get another OH or 2.
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#11 Aug 12 2008 at 11:05 AM Rating: Decent
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Feyras wrote:
Quote:
But what about certain comps like a pair of Mages (Mind Numbing?) and/or Dual DPS?


Zak, just a quick piece of info from how I personally play my mage, and alot of others play. I personally use Ice Lance/Frost Nova/Cone of Cold/Fire Blast as much as possible. For the simple fact that all of those are instant cast abilities. Yes, they do use up more mana than normal casting abilities, but they make you unable to be interrupted. Ice lance with shatter crits does just as much as Frostbolt anyways. So, in this case the mind numbing poison wouldn't do too much good against a mage. There are times that I use the other abilities, but that mainly is when I am not being focused, or when I know that CD's have been blown(i.e. Shs, Deadly Throw..). We all know that poisons are hit or miss. I personally on my rogue just use the good old fashion Wound-MH Crippling-OH. Although, the multiple weapon idea is the best imo. I am just too lazy to get another OH or 2.

Roger, I have noticed alot of mages using more instants over castable spells (with the exception of Poly of course, you mages just love that damned spell ;P").

Good stuff from all thusfar.
#12 Aug 12 2008 at 11:53 AM Rating: Default
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I have 3 OHs on me at all times in arena with Wound/Mind Numbing/Deadly on them, in addition to my main OH with Crip.

Your MH should always have Wound on it. Your main OH should always have Crip.

If you're too dumb to have an extra OH for Mind Numbing, you should be switching your MH poison to Mind Numbing on double DPS teams with a caster.
#13 Aug 12 2008 at 1:13 PM Rating: Decent
So theo, what other swords do you keep on you? S2 swords? I usually keep my s1 OH Mace on me that always has "mind" on it. But my 2 s2 swords have wound/crip.
#14 Aug 12 2008 at 1:16 PM Rating: Default
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Devilsslave wrote:
So theo, what other swords do you keep on you? S2 swords? I usually keep my s1 OH Mace on me that always has "mind" on it. But my 2 s2 swords have wound/crip.

S2, badge OH, and S2 shiv, in addition to my S3 OH.
#15 Aug 12 2008 at 1:27 PM Rating: Decent
Ahh nice. I wanna get the something as my other OH. But i dont do much raiding so... Idk about that. Hopefully i get lucky and get a better rating and get my s3 swords. My 2v2 partner is much better now then he was.
#16 Aug 12 2008 at 3:00 PM Rating: Default
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S2 OHs are 9k honor. Smiley: wink
#17 Aug 12 2008 at 3:15 PM Rating: Decent
Yeah, i have the S2 MH and OH. I really want the S3 MH AND OH tho. Just spent 1875 on my 3rd S4 piece tho. and we are only 1650...for now.
#18 Aug 12 2008 at 3:16 PM Rating: Default
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Yeah, and you can get multiple S2 OHs. I personally have every single S2 weapon barring fists, all enchanted.
#19 Aug 12 2008 at 3:22 PM Rating: Default
OOoo haha, hmm i didnt think about this. I will def get another s2. Prob a mace or fist. Thanks! Im more or less trying to master the mouse moving ATM. I used to be *Sigh* a WASD mover.... Haha no more tho! Do some PVE and BG's to master this way of the rogue.
#20 Aug 12 2008 at 5:11 PM Rating: Default
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If you don't have the shiv, pick that up. 1.4 OH > 1.5 OH.
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