im at 20 and my dillema is, im already taking mobs down pretty fast, is seal of command's chance to deal more damage even worth getting?
my cycle on a normal mob is seal of the crusader -> judgement -> seal of righteousness and that does a good bit of damage, and the couple pally's ive talked to about seal of command arent impressed with it
so does it even proc enough to put a point into it and use it? or would it just be for holy immune mobs?
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Seal of Command (worth getting?)Follow
If you're ret, you won't be going for spell damage, which is what SoR scales with. SoC will get better quickly, might even be better now.
The slower your weapon is, the higher your chance is for it to proc, and the more damage it does. So find a big slow weapon somewhere.
The slower your weapon is, the higher your chance is for it to proc, and the more damage it does. So find a big slow weapon somewhere.
you're lvl 20, you can do whatever the hell you like. But if you intend to be ret, then yes, get it. with a 2 hander, which is what ret uses, it's the be all end all seal.
If you're horde, you wont get anything better until seal of blood in your 60s.
If you're alliance, it's the best damage seal in the game.
Seal of command's damage gets better with weapon damage, so as you get better 2-handed weapons it gets steadily more powerful. Will there be the odd very unlucky fight where it refuses to proc? Of course.
On the flipside, you'll see fights where it procs repeatedly, and hacks an enemy down before you get a chance to enjoy the gigantic crit numbers floating up the screen! It's a must-have, always cast ability.
(Judging it on a stunned or incapacitated target causes double damage, so using Hammer of Justice before judging cranks out some more big numbers. Also works on repentence when you get it)
If you're alliance, it's the best damage seal in the game.
Seal of command's damage gets better with weapon damage, so as you get better 2-handed weapons it gets steadily more powerful. Will there be the odd very unlucky fight where it refuses to proc? Of course.
On the flipside, you'll see fights where it procs repeatedly, and hacks an enemy down before you get a chance to enjoy the gigantic crit numbers floating up the screen! It's a must-have, always cast ability.
(Judging it on a stunned or incapacitated target causes double damage, so using Hammer of Justice before judging cranks out some more big numbers. Also works on repentence when you get it)
Answer to your question: if you want more damage, then YES IT IS WORTH IT! And: USE IT ALL THE TIME! And if you judge it, REFRESH IT BEFORE THE NEXT AUTOSWING! (so do not judge it just before one or you will get an autoswing without a proc chance)
As far as
arent impressed with it
Do not trust their opinion. Ever. Again.
Just to add a bit to the info already given: up until you get Crusader Strike as a retribution paladin you will not have any instant attacks nor will you probably have any haste ratings. The Seal of Command proc works with the "proc-per-minute"-system (look it up on www.wowwiki.com if you do not know what this is). Meaning that you will get on average 7 procs per minute, REGARDLESS of your weapon speed.
This means that a fast weapon with low min/max damage will get on average 7 procs per minute, doing 7 times 70% of its low min/max damage through Seal of Command. A slow weapon with high min/max damage will also get on average 7 procs per minute, doing 7 times 70% of its much higher min/max damage through Seal of Command. The conclusion of this is that you must use Seal of Command with an AS SLOW WEAPON AS POSSIBLE WITH AS HIGH MIN/MAX DAMAGE that you can find. Ergo: a two-hander.
Best example probably is the best 39 two hander for that level for paladins: The Pendulum of Doom.
As far as
couple pally's you've talked to about seal of command wrote:
arent impressed with it
Do not trust their opinion. Ever. Again.
Just to add a bit to the info already given: up until you get Crusader Strike as a retribution paladin you will not have any instant attacks nor will you probably have any haste ratings. The Seal of Command proc works with the "proc-per-minute"-system (look it up on www.wowwiki.com if you do not know what this is). Meaning that you will get on average 7 procs per minute, REGARDLESS of your weapon speed.
This means that a fast weapon with low min/max damage will get on average 7 procs per minute, doing 7 times 70% of its low min/max damage through Seal of Command. A slow weapon with high min/max damage will also get on average 7 procs per minute, doing 7 times 70% of its much higher min/max damage through Seal of Command. The conclusion of this is that you must use Seal of Command with an AS SLOW WEAPON AS POSSIBLE WITH AS HIGH MIN/MAX DAMAGE that you can find. Ergo: a two-hander.
Best example probably is the best 39 two hander for that level for paladins: The Pendulum of Doom.
Some very good info posted. Check the pally quests and you'll see some good weapon rewards to use at your level on both the Horde and Alliance side.
Also, SoC scales to the crit damage if it procs on a swing that scores a white damage critical hit, and can also crit on its own (presumably based on spell crit?). Critical strikes for my lvl 70, pre kara geared ret pally top 3k with a SoC proc and lionheart blade. Add an instant crusader strike and a judgement of command, and thats 4-5k damage in 2 seconds :) Of course, then I stand around staring blankly for 3-4 seconds more, but thats how ret pallys roll.
Quote:
Add an instant crusader strike and a judgement of command, and thats 4-5k damage in 2 seconds :) Of course, then I stand around staring blankly for 3-4 seconds more, but thats how ret pallys roll.
/nod
Seal of Casino. Its the worst thing about Alliance Paladins. It makes gearing an alliance ret pally that much harder as you have to avoid haste rating (which is on most of the epic plate dps and badge gear). Unfortunately it happens to be the highest dps seal for us too.
Edited, Aug 21st 2008 2:11am by arthoriuss
I have a macro set up that refreshes the SoC when I judge it, I think from memory it is:
/cast judgement
/cast seal of command
and tend to do something along the lines of judge, CS, autoattack, SoC Proc, judge etc.
you can burn things down really fast.
Tbh, if you are ret then SoC is essential, even though it is a chance, its a high chance and the damage is worth it.
If they both crit (normal + holy) then you can do awesome damage, my pally when ret geared and specced can crit for 5k-6k off of a double crit SoC.
/cast judgement
/cast seal of command
and tend to do something along the lines of judge, CS, autoattack, SoC Proc, judge etc.
you can burn things down really fast.
Tbh, if you are ret then SoC is essential, even though it is a chance, its a high chance and the damage is worth it.
If they both crit (normal + holy) then you can do awesome damage, my pally when ret geared and specced can crit for 5k-6k off of a double crit SoC.
arthoriuss wrote:
[quote]/nod
Seal of Casino. Its the worst thing about Alliance Paladins. It makes gearing an alliance ret pally that much harder as you have to avoid haste rating (which is on most of the epic plate dps and badge gear). Unfortunately it happens to be the highest dps seal for us too.
Edited, Aug 21st 2008 2:11am by arthoriuss
Seal of Casino. Its the worst thing about Alliance Paladins. It makes gearing an alliance ret pally that much harder as you have to avoid haste rating (which is on most of the epic plate dps and badge gear). Unfortunately it happens to be the highest dps seal for us too.
Edited, Aug 21st 2008 2:11am by arthoriuss
eh, its not that bad. people make it out to be such a lousy ability for dps. with a slow enough weapon you have over a 40% chance to proc this. would i PREFER something that wouldn't be based on chance? sure. does SoC fail bcause its chancy? no. gearing an alliance ret pally isn't as hard as it might seem. haste isn't bad. haste doesn't help most of our abilities, but it does boost white damage which is a large part of our dps. it just is worth a bit less than str/crit. the badge axe is one of the best weapons for us before Hyjal/BT/SWP despite the large amount of haste on it. 18 badges from it myself actually :) on that note though, i would still look for upgrades based on str/crit and just take whatever haste you happen to get.
One fun/annoying (take your pick) thing about the casino based damage of a ret pally is that sometimes you do fairly poor damage and other times you can unleash awesome burst damage.
At times (in BG's) you come across that tauren warrior, you put up a good skilled fight but the numbers dont come in and the tauren cracks you like an egg. you release and he is there thinking that he is 'Teh Pwn'.
A bit later he makes a beeline towards you as he sees you as an easy kill as he handed you your a55 earlier and now you are at 3/4 health due to whupping a mage (read 3/3 vengeance) he charges in and you start unloading and hit him sooo hard with the pain train that his character is not only dead in game but the player is blinded IRL.
I kind of like it and it is certainly more interesting than being a rogue and going:
Stun, lololololololololololololol
Stun, lololololololololololololol
Stun, lololololololololololololol
stun, lololololololololololololol
*dead*
*next victim*
Stun, lololololololololololololol
Stun, lololololololololololololol
*Bit of trouble from a decent skilled and geared player:(, blind/vanish/other skill button etc*(
Stun, lololololololololololololol
stun, lololololololololololololol
*dead*
*next victim* etc
At times (in BG's) you come across that tauren warrior, you put up a good skilled fight but the numbers dont come in and the tauren cracks you like an egg. you release and he is there thinking that he is 'Teh Pwn'.
A bit later he makes a beeline towards you as he sees you as an easy kill as he handed you your a55 earlier and now you are at 3/4 health due to whupping a mage (read 3/3 vengeance) he charges in and you start unloading and hit him sooo hard with the pain train that his character is not only dead in game but the player is blinded IRL.
I kind of like it and it is certainly more interesting than being a rogue and going:
Stun, lololololololololololololol
Stun, lololololololololololololol
Stun, lololololololololololololol
stun, lololololololololololololol
*dead*
*next victim*
Stun, lololololololololololololol
Stun, lololololololololololololol
*Bit of trouble from a decent skilled and geared player:(, blind/vanish/other skill button etc*(
Stun, lololololololololololololol
stun, lololololololololololololol
*dead*
*next victim* etc
When I respecced to ret at lvl 28ish, I was excited about SoC. I smacked down a same-level priest that attacked me while I was flagged within seconds. But once I got back into grinding, it seemed to go surprisingly slow unless I got lucky and got a lot of procs. So I decided to test SoC verses SoR. Guess what? Both with and without crusader judged (did a set of fights with judged light, and a set with crusader) SoR did BETTER damage. I even tried 1h, and SoR had a better margin, but regardless it was a noticeable difference in the DPS I was doing. Of course, I tested DPS (using Recount) and didn't worry about burst, but that same day I respecced back to holy and got improved SoR. Maybe when I get to level 51 I'll go back to ret, but right now I'm sticking with either holy or prot depending on my aoe and instance mood.
disclaimer: as you go down the ret tree, you gain other damage talents besides SoC, which makes it worth it for more than that one seal.
disclaimer: as you go down the ret tree, you gain other damage talents besides SoC, which makes it worth it for more than that one seal.
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