Someone on the main forums suggested that since Death Knights can start at 55 that Blizz should allow peeps to start any toon at 55.
In responding, it got me thinking to how incompitent DK players are going to be for the most part - yes, some of you will be able to play your DK just as skillfully starting at 55 as you would have starting at 1st, but I rather suspect that you guys will be the minority (I don't think I'll be part of said minority either, so its not like I'm trying to pretend I'm l33+ and everyone else sux0rz).
As such, I rather suspect that DKs will quickly replace hunters as the "that class is played by idiots" stereotype in the game simply due to peeps not being all that proficient from having 55 free levels under thier belts.
Huntards are dead - long live the Dumb Knights!
- Forums
- World of Warcraft
- Class Discussion
- Huntards to be replaced in expansion
Huntards to be replaced in expansionFollow
No, this won't be true because you will have to be an experienced player to have a DK in the first place. You have to have at least one level 70 toon to make a DK anyway, my guess is they won't be Dumb Knights because that person would have to have leveled a previous toon to 70.
There's a bunch of idiotic level 70's out there... who you would think would've learned something in those 70 levels but they still amaze you.
On a more serious note, the Hunter itself is a soloing machine. Even the most simple minded get pushed into the role of constantly having a pet out while you fight along side it. Some are confused by exactly how a hunter should play, typically meleeing mobs in the beginning levels, leaving growl on in instances, or even having their pets set to aggressive. Later on they realize they don't need groups to level up, and it becomes a grind session with mass quests involved to just reach level 70. Sure they might dabble in an occasional instance, where people may kick them from the group, but they don't learn from this experience because most people don't take the time to tell them what they're doing wrong.
Nor would the inexperienced hunter listen to what they have to say anyway. Typically speaking of course, there are always exceptions to the rules. Throughout their leveling experience, the hunter itself is dumbed down. Without any mana you can still cause damage through your pet and just arrows or even melee. Your pet can take a nice beating even without specific talents invested into stamina or armor. And unless you're completely brain dead, it wouldn't take you long to figure out that having your pet out, makes leveling and quests extremely faster.
One would assume that due to our talent tree's it would be obvious what our role is in fact Ranged DPS. Yet others still think we can melee just fine, and continue to do so, probably mostly due to the enjoyment and the fact it's not hurting anyone but themselves. Granted what you do while soloing makes no difference to me, it's the group play where the huntard experience comes from. You take a typical hunter who's done nothing but solo for 70 levels, and place him into a group, he's going to use the same tactics as he did while soloing.
Warlocks typically have this same dilemma but there's far fewer warlocks out there than there are hunters. It's not that the people playing the hunter itself are stupid in general, it's just that they haven't seen or been shown what a hunter does in a group setting. It's like the Warrior who constantly pulls mobs, even though the healer is out of mana. He's used to it from soloing, and mana means nothing to him. They don't realize until the healer, or some other person says something directly to them, that they're going to die, due to the fact they didn't let their healer get some mana back.
I still think the "Huntards" will be around for a long time, but it just makes us shine even more due to the fact we actually know how to play our classes. The DK in my opinion will play more like a warrior/rogue/enh shaman/feral druid (meaning melee dps). Other than the occasional Deathcoil mishap or a pet being sicked on the wrong target, they won't be given the DeeDeeDee Knight title as often as the "Huntard" title.
On a more serious note, the Hunter itself is a soloing machine. Even the most simple minded get pushed into the role of constantly having a pet out while you fight along side it. Some are confused by exactly how a hunter should play, typically meleeing mobs in the beginning levels, leaving growl on in instances, or even having their pets set to aggressive. Later on they realize they don't need groups to level up, and it becomes a grind session with mass quests involved to just reach level 70. Sure they might dabble in an occasional instance, where people may kick them from the group, but they don't learn from this experience because most people don't take the time to tell them what they're doing wrong.
Nor would the inexperienced hunter listen to what they have to say anyway. Typically speaking of course, there are always exceptions to the rules. Throughout their leveling experience, the hunter itself is dumbed down. Without any mana you can still cause damage through your pet and just arrows or even melee. Your pet can take a nice beating even without specific talents invested into stamina or armor. And unless you're completely brain dead, it wouldn't take you long to figure out that having your pet out, makes leveling and quests extremely faster.
One would assume that due to our talent tree's it would be obvious what our role is in fact Ranged DPS. Yet others still think we can melee just fine, and continue to do so, probably mostly due to the enjoyment and the fact it's not hurting anyone but themselves. Granted what you do while soloing makes no difference to me, it's the group play where the huntard experience comes from. You take a typical hunter who's done nothing but solo for 70 levels, and place him into a group, he's going to use the same tactics as he did while soloing.
Warlocks typically have this same dilemma but there's far fewer warlocks out there than there are hunters. It's not that the people playing the hunter itself are stupid in general, it's just that they haven't seen or been shown what a hunter does in a group setting. It's like the Warrior who constantly pulls mobs, even though the healer is out of mana. He's used to it from soloing, and mana means nothing to him. They don't realize until the healer, or some other person says something directly to them, that they're going to die, due to the fact they didn't let their healer get some mana back.
I still think the "Huntards" will be around for a long time, but it just makes us shine even more due to the fact we actually know how to play our classes. The DK in my opinion will play more like a warrior/rogue/enh shaman/feral druid (meaning melee dps). Other than the occasional Deathcoil mishap or a pet being sicked on the wrong target, they won't be given the DeeDeeDee Knight title as often as the "Huntard" title.
Personally I've given up on trying to teach newbie Hunters how to do an instance. I can't even keep count on how many times I've (politely and nicely) tried to educate a leveling Hunter as to how his class should be played while I've been on one of my countless alts. And he/she just refuses to listen to reason because "stfu n00b I no how 2 ply..." followed by a rather satisfying groupkick.
I am through blaming easy leveling for all the Huntards out there. I have started to face the reality in that respect. Our overabundance of retards isn't a result of that easy leveling. It's a result of our class. Somehow it attracts every fucktard in the known universe. I've spent countless hours trying to see our class in a better light, but I can't find the redeeming qualities.
Sure, there's good Hunters out there. Hell, I'm one of them. But we are enormously outnumbered.
Let's stop blaming it on easy leveling, because if that was the case Warlocks would be right up there with us. Hell, they have easier leveling than us at the moment since they won't have to work at all for their pets and petskills. But are they? Nope, mostly Warlocks are skilled people who know how their class works in instances. Our class? Most Hunters are retards who couldn't clear Steam Vaults without fucking it up repeatedly.
I am through blaming easy leveling for all the Huntards out there. I have started to face the reality in that respect. Our overabundance of retards isn't a result of that easy leveling. It's a result of our class. Somehow it attracts every fucktard in the known universe. I've spent countless hours trying to see our class in a better light, but I can't find the redeeming qualities.
Sure, there's good Hunters out there. Hell, I'm one of them. But we are enormously outnumbered.
Let's stop blaming it on easy leveling, because if that was the case Warlocks would be right up there with us. Hell, they have easier leveling than us at the moment since they won't have to work at all for their pets and petskills. But are they? Nope, mostly Warlocks are skilled people who know how their class works in instances. Our class? Most Hunters are retards who couldn't clear Steam Vaults without fucking it up repeatedly.
i have the feeling with the exotic pets in Wotlk the numbers would be increased a lot!
Quote:
No, this won't be true because you will have to be an experienced player to have a DK in the first place. You have to have at least one level 70 toon to make a DK anyway, my guess is they won't be Dumb Knights because that person would have to have leveled a previous toon to 70.
Hmm, you're right - I've never met a level 70 who totally and utterly lacked a clue, who couldn't play his class if his life depended on it in RL and that was a total and utter f-up - it never happens. ;-)
And of course we all know that once you've leveled one toon to 70 then that means that you can easily just walk into a 55 toon without any issues - just look at how little difference there is between playing, say, a shadow priest and a defense spec'd warrior, why, with the exception of thier armor, spells, weapons, tallents, primary stats and role in a group setting, they're practically the same.
Sorry friend, but any drooling idiot can get a toon to level 70 (that's why we have Huntards) and the DK is 'kewl' enough that it will attract said drooling idiots in droves.
Quote:
Our overabundance of retards isn't a result of that easy leveling. It's a result of our class. Somehow it attracts every ******** in the known universe.
Hunter attracts idiots not because its easy to level, it attacts idiots because its idiot proof.
Think about it - if something goes wrong then you've got your pet to hold the mob/mobs off while you run, you've got traps to slow the mobs down, you've got decent armor/dodge and you've eventually got FD.
So the reality is that you've gotta try REALLY hard to get yourself killed as a hunter.
Another issue with this class attracting idiots is that it isn't a case of it attracting idiots, its simply a case of the idiots being more highly visible.
A healer/tank that cant heal/tank worth crap inevitably switches over to the DPS version of thier class, thus allowing them to hide thier general incompitence in the crowd of other DPS.
Unlike other incompitent DPS though, the hunter has two things that make his ***** ups stand out like a sore thumb - his pet and hunter's mark.
When the stupid hunter screws up, his mistake is highly visible and out there for everyone to see - combine that with the inevitable "What do you mean lay a trap?" comment and TADDA! - instant huntard.
The huntard is also more highly visible due to it being a prefered DPS since it can also CC, thus making it more in demand for groups and again, making it more visible when it screws up.
So combine those two elements and hunters were pretty much doomed to be the perceived class of idiots.
its amazing in that something as simple as a chain trapping in an instance will completely wipe away any thoughts of you being a huntard with that group. Its not like it is a rubix cube.
And with the DK, the videos I've been watching appear that the DK is too powerful to fail so any noob will be able to take him at level 55 and coast to 70....er 80
And with the DK, the videos I've been watching appear that the DK is too powerful to fail so any noob will be able to take him at level 55 and coast to 70....er 80
I find that within the elitist emo community in my realm(Exodar) that gear = cool. When I was running around trying to gear up I would LFG, get selected for a group and get questioned about my gear immediatley. Didn't matter if it was a great green/blue I was undergeared for the instance. Now in shiny purple almost everywhere i get group invites running through shatt and can play like a complete idiot and noone will complain.(tested this many times playing in auto mode in non-heroics, pulling aggro on every skull, killing it without taking too much damage and pulling the next mob of the tank). Hell, I usually get zomfg you are awesome DPS when i do that crap.
i dont think it will be that bad. first of all, you will have to have leveled another character in order to play DK, which means at the very least you know about the game mechanics. as far as learning to play the specific class, i think thats something that blizz has taken into account, and there are obviously sets of quests to familiarize you with all the DK abilities. i dont think starting a DK is any different from any other class, it'll take a little play time to figure out how to not play like an idiot, but eventually you should get the hang of it. the only difference between rolling, lets say, a shammy and a DK is that the DK will start with more powerful abilities right away (but will also have to fight harder mobs), but the learning curve should be the same.
I beleive that noone REALLY learns to play thier class until heroics when the margin for error is removed. Unforgiving pulls where everyone has to do thier job is a great teacher.
Of course if you have well geared peeps pulling you through you can get by this as well I guess.
Of course if you have well geared peeps pulling you through you can get by this as well I guess.
North has it to a great extent but I think that it's easy to stay a Huntard but hard to be a real Hunter. If I'm a lazy twit, yes, I can do all those things already said with my Hunter and get to 70. I don't have any incentive to actually L2P.
If I am a person who is not satisfied with being an incompetant twit, then I start to look for resources to help me. Blizz is of no help. Their forums are little more than whinefests with the occasional witty comment and drowned out by those trying to be witty. So I start Googling things and get directed to a place like Thottbot, getting better but still a mess. Then I stumble across Allakhazam. Poof! Instant education from the get go. That leads me to TKAsomthing and Elitist Jerks. All of a sudden I have the tools to climb out of the morass of ignorance and rise above the common Huntard. It doesn't mean I will, but at least now I have a clue. I have to put the effort into actually applying the knowledge.
There are so many Huntard's because it takes effort not to be one. There are too many people who fail to make an effort at anything in this life beyond breathing.
A 'real' Hunter trainer NPC toon should be giving levelling Hunters advice how to play the role rather than just learn a new skill or talent. This issue is as much Blizzard's fault as it is lazy players IMO.
"Every weapon has an operating manual" -Korbin Dallas
If I am a person who is not satisfied with being an incompetant twit, then I start to look for resources to help me. Blizz is of no help. Their forums are little more than whinefests with the occasional witty comment and drowned out by those trying to be witty. So I start Googling things and get directed to a place like Thottbot, getting better but still a mess. Then I stumble across Allakhazam. Poof! Instant education from the get go. That leads me to TKAsomthing and Elitist Jerks. All of a sudden I have the tools to climb out of the morass of ignorance and rise above the common Huntard. It doesn't mean I will, but at least now I have a clue. I have to put the effort into actually applying the knowledge.
There are so many Huntard's because it takes effort not to be one. There are too many people who fail to make an effort at anything in this life beyond breathing.
A 'real' Hunter trainer NPC toon should be giving levelling Hunters advice how to play the role rather than just learn a new skill or talent. This issue is as much Blizzard's fault as it is lazy players IMO.
"Every weapon has an operating manual" -Korbin Dallas
"Death Knights" will rank right along side of "Elves in the Horde" in the list of the absurd.
Hunters, on the other hand, are just plain fun to play. It really doesn't matter what others think or say. Find a Group/Guild that knows you and that are about the same skill/gear level and have at it.
My "Hobby" is leveling Hunters. I tend to adopt a very aggressive play style that works for me but most other Classes can't keep up with. This, I think, tends to put people off big time.
Send the Pet into a group of 6-8 on level MOB's, kill most of them, scatter shot to pull in more, trap when you can, hope you don't go oom, feign death, rez the Pet and get right back in it. Make half a level in one fight. And they say Hunters don't have AoE Skills.
Edited, Jul 25th 2008 12:12pm by Nobic
Hunters, on the other hand, are just plain fun to play. It really doesn't matter what others think or say. Find a Group/Guild that knows you and that are about the same skill/gear level and have at it.
My "Hobby" is leveling Hunters. I tend to adopt a very aggressive play style that works for me but most other Classes can't keep up with. This, I think, tends to put people off big time.
Send the Pet into a group of 6-8 on level MOB's, kill most of them, scatter shot to pull in more, trap when you can, hope you don't go oom, feign death, rez the Pet and get right back in it. Make half a level in one fight. And they say Hunters don't have AoE Skills.
Edited, Jul 25th 2008 12:12pm by Nobic
Removed.
Edited, Jul 25th 2008 12:16pm by Sweathog
Edited, Jul 25th 2008 12:16pm by Sweathog
Dee Dee Dee Knights will be out there in droves, no doubt. Leveling up, instancing, and raiding are three *completely* different games.
Any idiot who has their drooling issues under control can level up a character to max, given enough time, and idiots seem to have time in abundance.
The real learning begins in instances, where you have to learn to play nice with the other children. Stupid little tricks you do to break up the monotony of soloing will wipe a group. A certain level of discipline is required, or nothing gets accomplished.
Raiding takes this to an entirely different level. You need to know your job, and do it well, or you could wipe the entire raid in a matter of seconds.
Time and merciless mocking will drive the Dee Dee Dee Knights from the light of day. Those that are left will be a nice addition to the game.
Shelor007
Any idiot who has their drooling issues under control can level up a character to max, given enough time, and idiots seem to have time in abundance.
The real learning begins in instances, where you have to learn to play nice with the other children. Stupid little tricks you do to break up the monotony of soloing will wipe a group. A certain level of discipline is required, or nothing gets accomplished.
Raiding takes this to an entirely different level. You need to know your job, and do it well, or you could wipe the entire raid in a matter of seconds.
Time and merciless mocking will drive the Dee Dee Dee Knights from the light of day. Those that are left will be a nice addition to the game.
Shelor007
Shelor007, thank you.
also, dont you only need to lvl another toon to 55 to get a DK?
I heard you had to have a lvl 70 before you can get the DK and then do a quest to unlock him
From the WoW site:
Unlocking and Creating the Death Knight
Simply have a character of at least level 55 on the World of Warcraft account you play, and you will be able to create a new level-55 death knight of any race (if on a PvP realm, the death knight must be the same faction as your existing character). Upon entering the world, your neophyte death knight will undertake a series of quests designed to teach you your new abilities. You will be able to create one death knight per realm, per account.
^ that is just stupid, you should accomplish something first before they give you something in return. Just a ploy to get more subscribers I bet.
DK's Look fun but....I will be taking my hunter all the way to 80 and get him geared for raids, then make a DK.
NorthAI the Hand wrote:
I am through blaming easy leveling for all the Huntards out there. I have started to face the reality in that respect. Our overabundance of retards isn't a result of that easy leveling. It's a result of our class. Somehow it attracts every fucktard in the known universe. I've spent countless hours trying to see our class in a better light, but I can't find the redeeming qualities.
Sure, there's good Hunters out there. Hell, I'm one of them. But we are enormously outnumbered.
Let's stop blaming it on easy leveling, because if that was the case Warlocks would be right up there with us. Hell, they have easier leveling than us at the moment since they won't have to work at all for their pets and petskills. But are they? Nope, mostly Warlocks are skilled people who know how their class works in instances. Our class? Most Hunters are retards who couldn't clear Steam Vaults without fucking it up repeatedly.
Sure, there's good Hunters out there. Hell, I'm one of them. But we are enormously outnumbered.
Let's stop blaming it on easy leveling, because if that was the case Warlocks would be right up there with us. Hell, they have easier leveling than us at the moment since they won't have to work at all for their pets and petskills. But are they? Nope, mostly Warlocks are skilled people who know how their class works in instances. Our class? Most Hunters are retards who couldn't clear Steam Vaults without fucking it up repeatedly.
100% right in my oppinion. Some people will suck no matter how many 70's they roll and others could ebay one and play like a pro after a week. Great players are great players because they have a natural grasp of the mechanics of a game and will take the time to study it further than just what is apparent on the screen. Good players probably have one or the other of those qualities but not both. The crappy players most often have neither and will remain that way.
KDenelor wrote:
100% right in my oppinion. Some people will suck no matter how many 70's they roll and others could ebay one and play like a pro after a week. Great players are great players because they have a natural grasp of the mechanics of a game and will take the time to study it further than just what is apparent on the screen. Good players probably have one or the other of those qualities but not both. The crappy players most often have neither and will remain that way.
Agree 100%. Some people are just bad and no matter what they do they stay bad. It's like a genetic flaw or something.
Quote:
Agree 100%. Some people are just bad and no matter what they do they stay bad. It's like a genetic flaw or something.
It actually is - worse yet is that whatever it is that causes them to be bad also causes them to be incapable of realizing that they've got issues - they're genuinely clueless about the fact that they're clueless.
That's what makes them so difficult to give advice to - they think they're doing fine so when the party wipes and someone starts giving them advice, they take the attitude that they're compitent and here's someone trying to blame them for the wipe and tell them how to play a toon they think they can play blindfolded.
So remember, not all idiots are kids with short attention spans - many of them genuinely are idiots and are simply incapable of realizing it.
Recent Visitors: 139
All times are in CST
Anonymous Guests (139)
- Forums
- World of Warcraft
- Class Discussion
- Huntards to be replaced in expansion
© 2024 Fanbyte LLC