I am not sure I understand all this windfury being a buff fuzz. Isnt it meant like follows:
- Windfury weapon (the old self-weapon buff) will become a SELF-ONLY non-weapon buff, preferably physical which I would expect it to be
- Warriors and rogues must gain the buff through the totem, physical again would be logical. This buff cant be purged or whatever, but the totem can be destroyed to remove it.
This would mean that for the shaman him/herself nothing would change. For other melee dps classes it is a buff, being able to use poisons along with the WF buff. More viability for shamans in raids? I would think so, yes.
Edit: changed a word.
Edited, Jul 3rd 2008 5:33am by Immunios
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naromkid wrote:
Quote:
...I just noticed that it doesn't say anything about windfury weapon enchant getting changed. Only WF...
So this could mean that it only changes the way windfury totem works so that rogues and druids benefit from the totem too. This would be the best sollution since it leaves us unchanged. Maybe they change the other weapon totems too so druid caster forms also benefit from the changed weapon enchants for healing and damage.
So this could mean that it only changes the way windfury totem works so that rogues and druids benefit from the totem too. This would be the best sollution since it leaves us unchanged. Maybe they change the other weapon totems too so druid caster forms also benefit from the changed weapon enchants for healing and damage.
Currently we can't put sharpening stones, those SSO oils, anything like that on our weapons if we have an Imbue up correct? It would be really nice to be able to do so, and I think if they do change Windfury Totem so that Rogues can use their poisons etc.. that they should also make Windfury Weapon able to stack with other things you put on your weapons.
Immunios wrote:
I am not sure I understand all this windfury being a buff fuzz. Isnt it meant like follows:
- Windfury weapon (the old self-weapon buff) will become a SELF-ONLY non-weapon buff, preferably physical which I would expect it to be
- Warriors and rogues must gain the buff through the totem, physical again would be logical. This buff cant be purged or whatever, but the totem can be destroyed to remove it.
This would mean that for the shaman him/herself nothing would change. For other melee dps classes it is a buff, being able to use poisons along with the WF buff. More viability for shamans in raids? I would think so, yes.
Edit: changed a word.
Edited, Jul 3rd 2008 5:33am by Immunios
- Windfury weapon (the old self-weapon buff) will become a SELF-ONLY non-weapon buff, preferably physical which I would expect it to be
- Warriors and rogues must gain the buff through the totem, physical again would be logical. This buff cant be purged or whatever, but the totem can be destroyed to remove it.
This would mean that for the shaman him/herself nothing would change. For other melee dps classes it is a buff, being able to use poisons along with the WF buff. More viability for shamans in raids? I would think so, yes.
Edit: changed a word.
Edited, Jul 3rd 2008 5:33am by Immunios
It sounds like they meant 'a buff' as in 'castable on single target or groups, like Arcane Intelligence/Arcane Brilliance'.
Incidentally, you're still going to want three Shaman minimum per raid group, which is not exactly an unreasonably high number. The limited number of Air totems, even ignoring range issues that would make you want to have more than one, means you need two melee totems (Grace of Air + SoE combo, which is almost certainly going to be an Air totem + TA if it's made to work for non-tanks) and WoA + TA for the casters. *shrug* I don't see it as a huge problem right now.
RPZip wrote:
(Grace of Air + SoE combo, which is almost certainly going to be an Air totem...
Uh... do you have any basis for that belief? I mean, they are combining an earth and an air totem... but... it seems equally plausible that it could turn out to be an earth totem as easily as it could turn out to be an air totem. And their are already precious few earth totems that find use in raid. Right now it's pretty much Tremor and SoE, Stoneskin sees use so infrequently that it's not even worth mentioning. Seems like it would be much more useful for Shaman if it turned out to be an earth totem.
I dunno. This whole... complete re-tooling of totems-thing they're doing is really confusing, especially since we're pretty much running purely on speculation at this point, which just isn't cutting it. I think I'm just going to lay it to rest until we get to beta and get a first-hand look at what is really going on.
Gaudion wrote:
RPZip wrote:
(Grace of Air + SoE combo, which is almost certainly going to be an Air totem...
Uh... do you have any basis for that belief? I mean, they are combining an earth and an air totem... but... it seems equally plausible that it could turn out to be an earth totem as easily as it could turn out to be an air totem.
Because with three different air totems (now that WF isn't an air totem), you want to bring three Shaman to the raid. That fits into their general philosophy for buffing classes - see Paladins, where up to the third blessing is really nice but the fourth is almost always a meh addition (the one actual exception being Enhancement Shaman, and even then BoWis isn't exactly huge).
Without the third air totem requirement (mini-requirement, anyway) you could easily get away with bringing two for maximum benefit, and that just doesn't seem to fit their philosophy on buffers. It's the same reason when they made a threat reduction totem they put it in the Air category instead of something most people wouldn't have cared about, like Earth or Fire.
I agree with Zip, and Enhancement will always be needed. Losing out on UR is a HUGE DPS loss for pretty much all melee. Makes you wonder though if UR is going to be changed to raid-wide. My guess is no, but that would be hot.
Overlord Theophany wrote:
I agree with Zip, and Enhancement will always be needed. Losing out on UR is a HUGE DPS loss for pretty much all melee. Makes you wonder though if UR is going to be changed to raid-wide. My guess is no, but that would be hot.
That would be goddamm awesome - enhance shammies would be a must have for every raid if that were the case. If that were the case though, trueshot aura would have to be a raid buff so hunters would qq.
Taurrus wrote:
Overlord Theophany wrote:
I agree with Zip, and Enhancement will always be needed. Losing out on UR is a HUGE DPS loss for pretty much all melee. Makes you wonder though if UR is going to be changed to raid-wide. My guess is no, but that would be hot.
That would be goddamm awesome - enhance shammies would be a must have for every raid if that were the case. If that were the case though, trueshot aura would have to be a raid buff so hunters would qq.
No hunters are MM for raids anymore; if they are, they're awful.
Expose Weakness, BM, or GTFO.
Sad, but true. MM is the PvP spec now.
Well a poor example perhaps, but Blizzard would almost be obligated to make all group buffs into raid buffs for classes if they did that for shaman. I could see totems becoming a raid buff through talents perhaps, that would be fair.
But it would still be last tier in tree and require 5 points and some terrible quest line involving main tanking at least all of ZA. I quess my point is that it would be rather huge benefit for raid.
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Sad, but true. MM is the PvP spec now.
Shame there's still more BM hunters out there in PvP tho... I eat trough MM hunters.
Mozared wrote:
Quote:
Sad, but true. MM is the PvP spec now.
Shame there's still more BM hunters out there in PvP tho... I eat trough MM hunters.
MM is only the PvP spec when you can be reasonably sure that someone will peel attackers off you. BM is still king of the 1v1, just because the battles go so quickly if nothing else.
Just found this on the WoWwiki, confirming that the WF changes apply to only the totem
So I have a question, if only the totem is a buff, does that mean that a shaman has the potential for twice as many WF procs if they have the totem up, gettin the bonus from both the totem and the normal weapon enchant.
I also noticed (yes it has been mentioned) that flametongue now gives bonus spell power, so this basically makes one weapon enchant for each spec,
elemental-FT
enhance-WF
resto-EL(earthliving)
Quote:
The effect of the Windfury Totem won't be a weapon enchant anymore and will be changed to a buff. You will be able to use it in bear form or with poison.
I also noticed (yes it has been mentioned) that flametongue now gives bonus spell power, so this basically makes one weapon enchant for each spec,
elemental-FT
enhance-WF
resto-EL(earthliving)
Quote:
MM is only the PvP spec when you can be reasonably sure that someone will peel attackers off you. BM is still king of the 1v1, just because the battles go so quickly if nothing else.
Exactly, and nobody is going to peel me off any hunter =P
naromkid wrote:
Just found this on the WoWwiki, confirming that the WF changes apply to only the totem
So I have a question, if only the totem is a buff, does that mean that a shaman has the potential for twice as many WF procs if they have the totem up, gettin the bonus from both the totem and the normal weapon enchant.
Quote:
The effect of the Windfury Totem won't be a weapon enchant anymore and will be changed to a buff. You will be able to use it in bear form or with poison.
At this point we really don't have any idea how our imbues are going to work in WotLK. Are they all changing to buffs or are we receiving strictly party-oriented buffs in place of the old imbue totems? Are they magical or physical? In the same vein, can they be dispelled? We really won't know until the beta starts and the NDA is lifted. However, I can promise you that they absolutely, positively will not work like that. Blizzard is not going to let us stack any kind of double-imbue on ourselves, no way in hell.
Mozared wrote:
Quote:
MM is only the PvP spec when you can be reasonably sure that someone will peel attackers off you. BM is still king of the 1v1, just because the battles go so quickly if nothing else.
Exactly, and nobody is going to peel me off any hunter =P
Oh, with Imp Wing Clip and Entrapment, it's pretty easy for a hunter to peel you off themselves.
anyone else notice how elemental focus got a little buff? It now also affects HW and LHW so I am going to assume we may see many resto shammies go 11 points deep into elemental to help them heal a bit more efficient with HW and LHW. But I will assume in 25 man raids they will still be chain healing there **** off.
Notice that the 40% cost reduction doesn't just apply to the spells that trigger it. It says, "... next 2 damage and healing spells." That is huge. Huge huge. This could be so potentially huge for overall Resto Shaman efficiency that I don't even know where to begin explaining the scale of the possibly roll-changing impact it would have.
Well it's simple.
That makes Shamans almost as efficient as Paladins. The Paladin version refunds 60% mana on a critheal...ours gives you 40% reducation on the next two heals....I don't think I couldve imagined a better buff for resto. Mana efficiency was the one thing that continued to elude Resto, requiring immense mp5 stacking. With Mana Tide and that revised talent, I dont see a way to run out of mana anymore...just gear like a Paladin and stack spellcrit.
Awesome.
That makes Shamans almost as efficient as Paladins. The Paladin version refunds 60% mana on a critheal...ours gives you 40% reducation on the next two heals....I don't think I couldve imagined a better buff for resto. Mana efficiency was the one thing that continued to elude Resto, requiring immense mp5 stacking. With Mana Tide and that revised talent, I dont see a way to run out of mana anymore...just gear like a Paladin and stack spellcrit.
Awesome.
http://wotlk.wowhead.com/?talent=hMxhzZcZEc0uVeoxkrIRVo
I think this is the new shaman resto spec for pve raiding.
I can even see elemental shaman making good spot healers now when needed to in expansion when needed to be with these new talents.
I may start grabbing tidal focus for elemental instead of improved healing wave to pull of spamming lesser healing wave for just in case I need to back up heal.
If the change with crit is true to affect both melee and spells in WotLK then it may even be worth going 11 points in elemental as enhancement for it, will have to wait and see though. being able to make our shock spells 100% free every now and then sounds pretty kool and would allow enhancement to never really need water shield in raids possibly just relying on shamanistic rage when needed.
I think this is the new shaman resto spec for pve raiding.
I can even see elemental shaman making good spot healers now when needed to in expansion when needed to be with these new talents.
I may start grabbing tidal focus for elemental instead of improved healing wave to pull of spamming lesser healing wave for just in case I need to back up heal.
If the change with crit is true to affect both melee and spells in WotLK then it may even be worth going 11 points in elemental as enhancement for it, will have to wait and see though. being able to make our shock spells 100% free every now and then sounds pretty kool and would allow enhancement to never really need water shield in raids possibly just relying on shamanistic rage when needed.
Quote:
Oh, with Imp Wing Clip and Entrapment, it's pretty easy for a hunter to peel you off themselves. Smiley: tongue
Alright, point taken... That's why I bring my pallie ***** along with me *Malicious grin*
To stay on topic... Spirit links seems very interesting (Yay, another WC3 ability, I love those!). But in a raid, I can't really see it being used for anything else than binding 2 tanks together when you know there are damage spikes incoming... The positional requirement is a ***** though... If you mess it up while casting mid-combat you're going to bind the tank to a rogue.
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If you mess it up while casting mid-combat you're going to bind the tank to a rogue.
this is a good thing. it should teach your rogues not to stand in front of boss mobs where they dont belong.
Quor wrote:
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If you mess it up while casting mid-combat you're going to bind the tank to a rogue.
this is a good thing. it should teach your rogues not to stand in front of boss mobs where they dont belong.
We don't know how big the binding radius is going to be though. Right now it's sounding awfully risky to use in raids other than right before a pull and, I suspect, limited mostly to PvP and maybe some five-mans.
well, if its like the WC3 spirit link, itll utilize the closest targets to the targetted person. given that there is logic in chain heal that allows it to find lower hp allies when it jumps, its not unreasonable to think there will be an inverse application of that logic causing spirit link to find the highest hp targets in range.
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