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I was looking at deathfrost and wondering on your idea's about how good this would be as a pvp enchant, I'd imagine that it would be very nifty to have as a MH enchant for fighting healers? Anyone done any testing or have personal experience with this enchant, or for that matter does anyone know what the proc rate is on it...
This enchant doesn't seem to be nowhere near as good as mongoose. I personally love mongoose because it is versatile. You can use it on your S3 swords and pvp on it with your sub build, or you can spec combat and use the same swords to do nasty dps. I believe alot of people would agree with mongoose being the best enchant for rogues currently. The extra frost damage and casting time isn't that great when your fighting melee bosses in raids, or if your fighting a melee class in pvp. I'm sure Theo will come in and give you better input on the enchant.
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Sucks.
Hard.
Hard.
I figured as much... but ya never know how good an enchant is until you test it... I'd like to say that if you're fighting a dual caster team or a team with a warrior this 15% slower attack speed will their 3.6 speed weapon attacking at 4.14 speed or a 15% slower heal (2.875 second Holy Light or a 2.3 second Regrowth) could prove quite versitile, that being said wouldn't you say some testing should be done to see how this rolls out in the arena.
Edited, Jun 23rd 2008 6:33pm by imanohealu
Edited, Jun 23rd 2008 6:33pm by imanohealu
imanohealu wrote:
I figured as much... but ya never know how good an enchant is until you test it... I'd like to say that if you're fighting a dual caster team or a team with a warrior this 15% slower attack speed will their 3.6 speed weapon attacking at 4.14 speed or a 15% slower heal (2.875 second Holy Light or a 2.3 second Regrowth) could prove quite versitile, that being said wouldn't you say some testing should be done to see how this rolls out in the arena.
Edited, Jun 23rd 2008 6:33pm by imanohealu
Edited, Jun 23rd 2008 6:33pm by imanohealu
Or you could put Mind Numbing on a caster.
BUT HEY WHAT DO I KNOW.
Absolutely nothing.
You fail to mention it's possibilities against melee classes... I currently use this as an OH enchant and i personally love how it works against warriors, not only does the proc deal a little extra damage but gives me even more survivability which at my current arena level (1500-1600 bracket) I love, but hey whatever man I like it and will be testing it further when Season 4 comes out and I get my Merciless Swords...
Over the weekend I heard from a few friends who just got it that the proc rate is 4ppm (approx). But I haven't seen the actual WWS for it as yet. If I had to guess, 4 is a bit optimistic and I'd expect more like 1 or 2ppm. WowWiki has it at 10% (to which I have to ask "10% of WHAT!?"), but it's normalized, so...
Honestly, I can't see that the benefit is enough to displace Mongoose in either PvP or PvE environments. I mean, 120 AP (from Agi) and a bit of haste, not to mention the dodge, is pretty damn hard to lose on either weapon especially buffed (Kings anyone?). In my opinion, and it's just an opinion, 15% slow for 8 sec isn't worth the loss of the Mongoose proc.
But if anyone wants to show some WWS info, I'd love to see it. After all, it looks pretty damn cool ;)
Honestly, I can't see that the benefit is enough to displace Mongoose in either PvP or PvE environments. I mean, 120 AP (from Agi) and a bit of haste, not to mention the dodge, is pretty damn hard to lose on either weapon especially buffed (Kings anyone?). In my opinion, and it's just an opinion, 15% slow for 8 sec isn't worth the loss of the Mongoose proc.
But if anyone wants to show some WWS info, I'd love to see it. After all, it looks pretty damn cool ;)
Yeah, I'd imagine making them dead would improve your survivability even more. What does it look like though?
imanohealu wrote:
You fail to mention it's possibilities against melee classes... I currently use this as an OH enchant and i personally love how it works against warriors, not only does the proc deal a little extra damage but gives me even more survivability which at my current arena level (1500-1600 bracket) I love, but hey whatever man I like it and will be testing it further when Season 4 comes out and I get my Merciless Swords...
LOL.
Just...
LOL.
Warriors are NOT an issue if you're decently geared (i.e. 300+ resil, 10k HP and 1700+ AP).
You're a ******* moron and a scrub who will be permanently stuck in the 1500s.
TherionSaysWhat wrote:
Over the weekend I heard from a few friends who just got it that the proc rate is 4ppm (approx). But I haven't seen the actual WWS for it as yet. If I had to guess, 4 is a bit optimistic and I'd expect more like 1 or 2ppm. WowWiki has it at 10% (to which I have to ask "10% of WHAT!?"), but it's normalized, so...
Honestly, I can't see that the benefit is enough to displace Mongoose in either PvP or PvE environments. I mean, 120 AP (from Agi) and a bit of haste, not to mention the dodge, is pretty damn hard to lose on either weapon especially buffed (Kings anyone?). In my opinion, and it's just an opinion, 15% slow for 8 sec isn't worth the loss of the Mongoose proc.
But if anyone wants to show some WWS info, I'd love to see it. After all, it looks pretty damn cool ;)
Honestly, I can't see that the benefit is enough to displace Mongoose in either PvP or PvE environments. I mean, 120 AP (from Agi) and a bit of haste, not to mention the dodge, is pretty damn hard to lose on either weapon especially buffed (Kings anyone?). In my opinion, and it's just an opinion, 15% slow for 8 sec isn't worth the loss of the Mongoose proc.
But if anyone wants to show some WWS info, I'd love to see it. After all, it looks pretty damn cool ;)
Don't forget the near 7% crit.
Quote:
But I haven't seen the actual WWS for it as yet. If I had to guess, 4 is a bit optimistic and I'd expect more like 1 or 2ppm. WowWiki has it at 10% (to which I have to ask "10% of WHAT!?"), but it's normalized, so...
I've only done or watched testing by spells, but it's pretty much exactly every 20 seconds for us. Supposedly 20-second internal cooldown, but one cooldown for spells and one for melee, which what testing I did makes sense (minimum 20 seconds between spell procs, but can get spell proc -> melee proc within seconds of each other).
The only class it seems anywhere close to good for is enhance shammies, and purely for slowing boss spells down (supposedly it works on raid bosses).
Deathfrost is a 2 part enchant, as melee its ppm is a little above 2(2.2-2.3 last i checked on EJs and from my own testing in blasted lands), the casting component of the enchant has an aprox 25sec internal cooldown(which also = aprox 2ppm).
The problem with the enchant is that mindnumbing poison is better for slowing casting and should be up a much higher % of the time(although deathfrost can't be dispelled since its a physical debuff) and thunderclap is better for slowing attack spd if you have a warr in your team/raid.
The proc dam can crit but uses your spell crit%, so as a rogue that will be very rarely. The proc dam is also boosted by any talent for +% dam increase(for instance 2/2 in murder will increase its dam by 2%, not sure if find weakness effects it or not).
Situationally useful at best, its best use is that it'll make a great lvling enchant en route to lvl 80 because its really cheap compared to mongoose.
The problem with the enchant is that mindnumbing poison is better for slowing casting and should be up a much higher % of the time(although deathfrost can't be dispelled since its a physical debuff) and thunderclap is better for slowing attack spd if you have a warr in your team/raid.
The proc dam can crit but uses your spell crit%, so as a rogue that will be very rarely. The proc dam is also boosted by any talent for +% dam increase(for instance 2/2 in murder will increase its dam by 2%, not sure if find weakness effects it or not).
Situationally useful at best, its best use is that it'll make a great lvling enchant en route to lvl 80 because its really cheap compared to mongoose.
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