So, I have a lvl 70 prot. warrior that is the MT for my raiding guild atm. Aside from an occational heroic and kara; I don't do much with my warrior.
So, I decide to roll another toon. I have tried all the classes and have leveled lock and rogue some. But, I was not sold that these would be my next lvl 70 toon.
So - I started to lvl shadow priest. I like it so far. I have two. One and level 10 and one at level 14. But, after reading the forums about how Spriest are not respected in BGs and that the raiding environment is spriest loot poor, I have began to rethink lvling.
I would like for an objective view of the pros and cons of spriest from ya'll. What is good and what is bad about shadow priest?
Thank you for your opinions.
B
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Well that really all depends on what exactly you would like to do with you spriest in the long term?
Are you a raiding nut and want to take him/her to the Sunwell and beyond? Would you rather go into BG's and swing the tide of battle wherever you go? Are you looking to arena? Would you rather just do some 5-mans and the occasional BG?
Depending on how you want to roll out with this guy in the long term will depend on the feasability of leveling him all the way to 70.
Just remeber that a spriest in raids and 5-mans is more sought after for the ability to return mana to your group rather than pumping out huge amounts of dps. Yes a spriest can melt faces, but people in a grouping enviornment love you more for your mana returning ability.
In BG's you will easily melt faces, but again as a priest I think youd be more effective healing the dps around you. nothing swings the war against the alli more than having great healers in BG's.
As for arena. 2v2 with a warlock would work and be fun, but if your looking to really do well in arenas then its all about surviveability and youd much rather want to spec discipline for this.
Gives us a bit more as to want exactly you want to do with this toon end-game wise.
Cheers!
Are you a raiding nut and want to take him/her to the Sunwell and beyond? Would you rather go into BG's and swing the tide of battle wherever you go? Are you looking to arena? Would you rather just do some 5-mans and the occasional BG?
Depending on how you want to roll out with this guy in the long term will depend on the feasability of leveling him all the way to 70.
Just remeber that a spriest in raids and 5-mans is more sought after for the ability to return mana to your group rather than pumping out huge amounts of dps. Yes a spriest can melt faces, but people in a grouping enviornment love you more for your mana returning ability.
In BG's you will easily melt faces, but again as a priest I think youd be more effective healing the dps around you. nothing swings the war against the alli more than having great healers in BG's.
As for arena. 2v2 with a warlock would work and be fun, but if your looking to really do well in arenas then its all about surviveability and youd much rather want to spec discipline for this.
Gives us a bit more as to want exactly you want to do with this toon end-game wise.
Cheers!
I believe my goal is primarily DPS with back up heals when possible.
My thoughts where raiding in shadowform with occational pvp (BG's) included. I like the thought (theory) of being able to DPS and back up heal when needed. But, mainly DPS. As for sunwell and beyond - that is up to my guild. I would LOVE to take my toon beyond and become an awesome s.priest.
Endgame wise - my initial thoughs were, prior to reading the loot poorness for s.priests of kara etc, was to be able to DPS as S.priest and assist my casters in the raid with healing and mana regen. But, still being able to rank 2 or 3 on the DPS charts (no. 1 would be awesome). But ranking no. 1 is probably out of the question since we have a mage hitting 1000-1200 dps on the meters regularly.
Is this all "pie-in-the-sky" thinking?
Thanks
B
My thoughts where raiding in shadowform with occational pvp (BG's) included. I like the thought (theory) of being able to DPS and back up heal when needed. But, mainly DPS. As for sunwell and beyond - that is up to my guild. I would LOVE to take my toon beyond and become an awesome s.priest.
Endgame wise - my initial thoughs were, prior to reading the loot poorness for s.priests of kara etc, was to be able to DPS as S.priest and assist my casters in the raid with healing and mana regen. But, still being able to rank 2 or 3 on the DPS charts (no. 1 would be awesome). But ranking no. 1 is probably out of the question since we have a mage hitting 1000-1200 dps on the meters regularly.
Is this all "pie-in-the-sky" thinking?
Thanks
B
Ok Im going to wait and see if any of our spriests will respond more to your questions as I am and always have been a disc/holy priest.
I figured by having you give some more info we could get others to respond more directly to your questions at hand.
I could be wrong here (like I said Ive always been holy/disc so im no expert on spriest gear) but I dont think that end game gear is lacking for a spriest, its more that you are fighting with pure dps types to get that gear. Many a raid leader will forgo gearing up their spriest to get their locks geared for max dps. I would think that an affliction lock is your main competition for gear. Again i could be wrong here.
I figured by having you give some more info we could get others to respond more directly to your questions at hand.
I could be wrong here (like I said Ive always been holy/disc so im no expert on spriest gear) but I dont think that end game gear is lacking for a spriest, its more that you are fighting with pure dps types to get that gear. Many a raid leader will forgo gearing up their spriest to get their locks geared for max dps. I would think that an affliction lock is your main competition for gear. Again i could be wrong here.
Shadowpriest DPS is incredible... at first. The class has always had an inherent characteristic of being heavily dependent on percentage modifiers while having poor scaling characteristics. What that means is that shadowpriests rock at low gear levels, but get less out of gear than other classes, and so fall behind over time.
Another component of this phenomenon is that some of the best shadowpriest gear is available as tailored gear in the form of the Frozen Shadowweave set. Nothing against the set; it's terrific. It's simply that those pieces don't get replaced for a LONG time, which plays a contributing factor in the stagnation of shadowpriest DPS. Heck, a shadowpriest in my guild just replaced his Frozen Shadowweave... with tier 6. There was literally nothing in between that was an upgrade for him.
Don't misunderstand. Shadowpriests are highly valued; they're given raid spots often, and loot favoritism doesn't happen if your guild has a good DKP system. The mana battery effect and damage boost debuffs are hugely desired. Just understand that once you get out of Kara/Gruul's/Mag, odds are high you won't be top-three DPS. Shadowpriests topped the meters frequently when that was the standard; past that, they fall off.
Another component of this phenomenon is that some of the best shadowpriest gear is available as tailored gear in the form of the Frozen Shadowweave set. Nothing against the set; it's terrific. It's simply that those pieces don't get replaced for a LONG time, which plays a contributing factor in the stagnation of shadowpriest DPS. Heck, a shadowpriest in my guild just replaced his Frozen Shadowweave... with tier 6. There was literally nothing in between that was an upgrade for him.
Don't misunderstand. Shadowpriests are highly valued; they're given raid spots often, and loot favoritism doesn't happen if your guild has a good DKP system. The mana battery effect and damage boost debuffs are hugely desired. Just understand that once you get out of Kara/Gruul's/Mag, odds are high you won't be top-three DPS. Shadowpriests topped the meters frequently when that was the standard; past that, they fall off.
Lately i have been doing battlegrounds alot with my shadow priest and i must say you they mess stuff up.
Not only that but i have a troll priest. so my hex of weakness tailors perfectly to pvp.
There is really never a time im not in the top 3 of damage dealers. Im not trying to brag but hell. if i can debunk the myth about shadow priest sucking in bg why not.
Here is a screeny i took after reading this thread on shadow preists to prove my point. Keep in mind i had just gotten outa kara so hence the buffs. God this one was a long battleground. but it should prove my point even better that the bg took almost an hour. and im not trying to show that im great or nothing.. just that we can do a ton of damage and we are good a pvp. just takes some getting used to. and they are definatly not a class that will let you glide by and do well. nope save that crap for the paladins. you have to work your *** off to do well.
also in raid environments most of the reason why a shadow priest gets out damaged is because of warlock and mage aoe. If you count single target dps. than i think a shadow priest is at or above the level of any other class in the game.
the loot info is absolutely correct thought, shadow priests get RichardED on drops. but not by raid leaders so much as by the game itself. you see we dont use spell crit anywhere near as effectively as other classes. we are straight up spell damage and hit rating players. once you hit cap you go for spelldamage. so most cloth spell dps gear is designed with spellcrit.. as such its a waste to give it to a shadow priest over a mage or lock.
How the hell do you link an image shack photo now?
Edited, Jun 5th 2008 12:06am by Slammerofkooter
http://img379.imageshack.us/my.php?image=wowscrnshot060108015131zo4.jpg
Edited, Jun 5th 2008 12:10am by Slammerofkooter
Edited, Jun 5th 2008 12:12am by Slammerofkooter
Edited, Jun 5th 2008 12:19am by Slammerofkooter
Edited, Jun 5th 2008 12:32am by Slammerofkooter
Not only that but i have a troll priest. so my hex of weakness tailors perfectly to pvp.
There is really never a time im not in the top 3 of damage dealers. Im not trying to brag but hell. if i can debunk the myth about shadow priest sucking in bg why not.
Here is a screeny i took after reading this thread on shadow preists to prove my point. Keep in mind i had just gotten outa kara so hence the buffs. God this one was a long battleground. but it should prove my point even better that the bg took almost an hour. and im not trying to show that im great or nothing.. just that we can do a ton of damage and we are good a pvp. just takes some getting used to. and they are definatly not a class that will let you glide by and do well. nope save that crap for the paladins. you have to work your *** off to do well.
also in raid environments most of the reason why a shadow priest gets out damaged is because of warlock and mage aoe. If you count single target dps. than i think a shadow priest is at or above the level of any other class in the game.
the loot info is absolutely correct thought, shadow priests get RichardED on drops. but not by raid leaders so much as by the game itself. you see we dont use spell crit anywhere near as effectively as other classes. we are straight up spell damage and hit rating players. once you hit cap you go for spelldamage. so most cloth spell dps gear is designed with spellcrit.. as such its a waste to give it to a shadow priest over a mage or lock.
How the hell do you link an image shack photo now?
Edited, Jun 5th 2008 12:06am by Slammerofkooter
http://img379.imageshack.us/my.php?image=wowscrnshot060108015131zo4.jpg
Edited, Jun 5th 2008 12:10am by Slammerofkooter
Edited, Jun 5th 2008 12:12am by Slammerofkooter
Edited, Jun 5th 2008 12:19am by Slammerofkooter
Edited, Jun 5th 2008 12:32am by Slammerofkooter
Scholar
34 posts
Just finished a ZA + kara tonight, so my mind is still fresh about being a priest. I used to be holy and it was fun, healing in raids, smite spamming in heroics because the tanks were overgeared, taking on 3 mobs at once during dailies, etc. Then my guild died and I joined a guild looking for a shadow priest.
I can sum it up in 4 words (no particular order):
Melt. Faces. Laser. Awesome.
Currently I put out respectable dps. Sometimes that is enough to top the meter, sometimes not. But I don't care because it's not just about that. I'm consistently out-damaged by destrolocks currently, but with the other spriest on holiday at the moment I take satisfaction in knowing that 10% + 5% of their damage is thanks to me.
Also, apparently I'm a hot commodity now, everyone wants to be in my group. The mod "Recount" currently has a meter that records mana recovering abilities, and when I check it usually the only thing that gives people in my group more mana than my vampiric touch is life tap, and even that's not too far ahead.
But yeah, the damage scaling is bad. VT and SW:P have good coefficients (100% and 146% [talented]), and account for a lot of damage, but the direct damage spells are not nearly as good. Blast and death, aside from having cooldowns, have a small coefficient (42.86%), and even our iconic face melting laser, mind flay, is 57% over its duration. No other casting class has coefficients this low on their direct damage spells. This means that as gear increases across the guild and across the raid, your damage will of course increase, but will fall behind the other dps-ers.
As for BG, I did do a couple while gearing up after I respecced, so I could get the s1 staff (looks awesome in shadowform btw). As long as nobody saw me I was fine, I dotted up everything with impunity. Definitely squishier than when discipline spec though, but I did have more fun, though that could be because my experience with heavy disc was basically me heal-tanking while everyone else did the damage.
Gear seems alright, I mainly went for mage/warlock stuff, probably gimped myself by getting spelldamage over shadow damage. However, there's this trinket that drops in heroic MgT, and it is godly (at least for me), shoots out baby shadowbolts when it procs.
But, if you are thinking about a shadowpriest, you should go for what is fun. Do you want to look scary and all shadowy and evil, and shoot blue lasers (yes I'm a laser freak :P) at stuff? Do you want to eat your enemies health and turn it into mana for your friends, so they can shoot more stuff at enemies? If so, then shadowpriest will be fun (and casters/healers will love you). But if you're after massive crits and being on top of damage meters in 25-man raids, then shadowpriest cannot deliver.
....also did I mention the lasers?
I can sum it up in 4 words (no particular order):
Melt. Faces. Laser. Awesome.
Currently I put out respectable dps. Sometimes that is enough to top the meter, sometimes not. But I don't care because it's not just about that. I'm consistently out-damaged by destrolocks currently, but with the other spriest on holiday at the moment I take satisfaction in knowing that 10% + 5% of their damage is thanks to me.
Also, apparently I'm a hot commodity now, everyone wants to be in my group. The mod "Recount" currently has a meter that records mana recovering abilities, and when I check it usually the only thing that gives people in my group more mana than my vampiric touch is life tap, and even that's not too far ahead.
But yeah, the damage scaling is bad. VT and SW:P have good coefficients (100% and 146% [talented]), and account for a lot of damage, but the direct damage spells are not nearly as good. Blast and death, aside from having cooldowns, have a small coefficient (42.86%), and even our iconic face melting laser, mind flay, is 57% over its duration. No other casting class has coefficients this low on their direct damage spells. This means that as gear increases across the guild and across the raid, your damage will of course increase, but will fall behind the other dps-ers.
As for BG, I did do a couple while gearing up after I respecced, so I could get the s1 staff (looks awesome in shadowform btw). As long as nobody saw me I was fine, I dotted up everything with impunity. Definitely squishier than when discipline spec though, but I did have more fun, though that could be because my experience with heavy disc was basically me heal-tanking while everyone else did the damage.
Gear seems alright, I mainly went for mage/warlock stuff, probably gimped myself by getting spelldamage over shadow damage. However, there's this trinket that drops in heroic MgT, and it is godly (at least for me), shoots out baby shadowbolts when it procs.
But, if you are thinking about a shadowpriest, you should go for what is fun. Do you want to look scary and all shadowy and evil, and shoot blue lasers (yes I'm a laser freak :P) at stuff? Do you want to eat your enemies health and turn it into mana for your friends, so they can shoot more stuff at enemies? If so, then shadowpriest will be fun (and casters/healers will love you). But if you're after massive crits and being on top of damage meters in 25-man raids, then shadowpriest cannot deliver.
....also did I mention the lasers?
Great information y'all. Thanks for taking the time to reply. I'll keep pluggin' along on my priest and see where it leads me.
B
B
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