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My DPS is LackingFollow

#1 May 29 2008 at 11:42 AM Rating: Decent
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First off I am a 70 BM/MM hunter here's my armory :

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Smolderthorn&n=Torra

The problem I seem to be running into is my dps doesn't seem to be quite on par with other hunters in my guild, when I look at them on the armory thier gear is just as good as mine or mine is a little better. But when it comes to being in a raid and looking at the dps meters i'm either neck to neck with them or i'm a couple below them, my DPS is good but I know it could be better, that's where you come in.

My shot rotation is: Auto shot, Steady shot, Steady shot, Multi shot (rinse and repeat) while adding a kill command in there every now and then. I had asked another hunter in my previous guild and this is the shot rotation he was using and his DPS was great but I try it and it still somewhat blows. I remember finding a shot rotation online and used it but it didn't seem to work as well as ppl said , i'm not sure but i believe it was auto / steady/ auto/ steady / arcane or something like that.

So what do you think I could do to improve my DPS?

I can provide WWS reports if needed also.


Edited, May 29th 2008 3:43pm by amayu
#2 May 29 2008 at 1:52 PM Rating: Excellent
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WWS + Dr Boom + lots of tests.

As well as WWS logs + Cheeky's Case Study on WWS or: how to analyze WWS data.

edit: lots of tests as in trying out different rotations at different weaponspeeds (if you have haste gear) to find what suits you the best.

also, get rid of the eye o/t stalker, its a piece of sh*t.
you'd be better off with most blue rings.
In fact, work your *** off for angelista's revenge... totally worth it and a thousand times better than what you have.

And stop gemming for socket bonuses.
gem hit till hitcap (wich you are 7 over...) after that pure Agility unless the socketbonus gives more agility (or other stats worth more than what you lose)
Except for the few offgems to get meta-requirements.

For example: shoulders, chest, belt, legs and weapon socketbonuses are all not worth it.
You just get them if it gets you the best stats while meeting your meta-requirements.

Also, you gemmed for a lot of stamina... for pve its not worth it.
You need to have about 10-11k HP fully raidbuffed by the time you start BT/MH, before that you'll be fine with 8.5-9.5k raidbuffed.

Edited, May 30th 2008 12:05am by Aethien
#3 May 29 2008 at 2:12 PM Rating: Good
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1,292 posts
You seem to be a serious player, enchants/augments on almost all of your gear, hit capped, smart gem selections, cookie-cutter Talent build, and at least 250 BoJ spent.

Hard to say why you'd be outperformed by a lesser geared Hunter. Perhaps they use better consumables in raids? Perhaps you run out of mana earlier, since you use Multi often? Possibly they are placed in better groups in your raids? Maybe you're shooting the adds while they are focusing on the Boss, or you're on Scorpid Sting and/or Mark duty while they are free to pew pew only DPS abilities?

Do you have a shot macro, and is it a decent one?

Here are a few suggestions:
Get a shoulder augment. Work on your Scryer rep. Running SSO dailies makes this more than free, as it's a money tree as it is. So use the rings/books and the cash to accelerate your Scryer rep farming;
Replace Savagery with +35 AGI;
Replace hand enchant with +15 AGI;
Replace leg augment with Nethercobra Leg Armor (50ap and 12 CSR);
Replace scope with crit scope;
Buy the SotS ring, it's better than your Eye of the Stalker, and you're eligible now. Upgrade as you improve your rep.

Bring drums to raids. Battle and/or Restoration. Use them on every cool down. Bring and use smart consumables. Flasks/Elixirs/mana pots/stat food/etc/etc. Don't scrimp, they matter.

Dunno what else to suggest. I'm sure you know that there are a few BoJ upgrades for you still, but that doesn't address the fact that you are already under performing lesser geared Hunters. Good luck.

Edited, May 29th 2008 6:14pm by Kompera

Edited, May 29th 2008 6:14pm by Kompera
#4 May 29 2008 at 4:23 PM Rating: Decent
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1,519 posts
amayu wrote:
while adding a kill command in there every now and then.


This. At 22% crit rating, you should have around a 75% chance for it to be available on every cooldown. If you're BM, and your pet is buffed in a raid, you have a pretty good chance of your pet getting a crit on KC for 800-1k+ damage! If you're not using it every single time, you're gimping yourself.

I suggest using a shot rotation macro with KC built in, so you don't even have to worry about watching it and hitting it when it's up.

Also make sure that you have the highest rank of damaging skills for pets. If you're using a ravager, make sure to have Gore 9 and Bite 9. They add a lot of DPS.
#5 May 29 2008 at 8:18 PM Rating: Decent
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83 posts
I do plan on replacing the ring , I had my eye on the ring that drops off of Hydros the Unstable but I'll work on getting another one to hold me till then. I am also working on fixing some of the gems, due to lack of money from repair bills and pots/elixirs/food's for raiding Kinda burns a whole in my pocket. I use Flask of Relentless Assault and Grilled Mudfish, also mana/health pots as well.

Thanks for your responses and I will be changing quite a few things enchant wise etc. I will also look at setting a shot rotation macro up as well cause I miss the Kill Command and if I do notice it I don't always get to clicking the button on time.



- if anyone else has anything to add please do, I'll be checking the posts out frequently


Edited, May 30th 2008 12:19am by amayu
#6 May 29 2008 at 10:43 PM Rating: Decent
If you're not going to go for the 3 set bonus on the ebon dragonscale set, then honestly I'd ditch the two pieces you have. There are better crafted bracers (namely the BT ones with haste), and there is better crafted belts (black eagle if you don't need hit, deep shadow if you do). I also would try to find a way to ditch the romulo trinket. It's a hit rating crutch that is taking away from your dps. Actually a lot of the T4 is kinda junk, you'd be better off using the new badge stuff. I also would reccomend using the 15 agi enchant to gloves over the ap. First off agi gives you crit, plus it can give you even more stats when coupled with a paladin's kings.

You also seem obsessed with getting socket bonuses. Most suck and aren't worth trying to get. Lets use your gear for an example. Shoulders: 3 int? you'd be better loading up agi gems, especially since the piece has no agi on it. Chest: If you stacked all agi gems you'd have the same exact attack power you do now, difference is, you'd have more crit. Boots: 16 agi as opposed to your... 11. Legs: again 16 agi, as opposed to your 11. Belt: wtf? mp5 gem?

On to enchants: 35 agi > Savagry for dps. 50AP/12crit > stam/agi leg armor. ***YOU HAVE A TERRIBLE SCOPE ON A GOOD RANGED WEAPON.*** 12 damage scope only applies to your auto-shot, while a crit scope applies to everything. You also have NO ENCHANT on your shoulders! That's huge!

Things you did well: everything about your helm is good, having hourglass is good, garona's signet is good, having a willingness to spend money on crafting gear is good, and your spec is good (though I prefer efficiency since it gives more dps over the longer fights).

I would replace your gear in this order: Bracer(crafted) > Belt(crafted) Trinket(badge) > Ring(badge) > Boots (get the leather badge ones, they have nearly double the AP, and more hit) > Gloves (badge) > Axe (badge). Then look at your hit. If you're well over hit cap, then go for dory's embrace. You might lose a bit of crit/AP, but the armor ignore will more than make up for that.
#7 May 29 2008 at 11:09 PM Rating: Good
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Dilbrt wrote:
(namely the BT ones with haste)
Cause those only cost like... 5k gold in mats.
#8 May 30 2008 at 6:01 AM Rating: Decent
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203 posts
Aethien wrote:
Dilbrt wrote:
(namely the BT ones with haste)
Cause those only cost like... 5k gold in mats.


The vindicator bracers would be decent if your strapped for cash and can't get ahold of anything else.
#9 May 30 2008 at 6:08 AM Rating: Decent
Aethien wrote:
Dilbrt wrote:
(namely the BT ones with haste)
Cause those only cost like... 5k gold in mats.


only cost me 1100 buying all the mats off the AH, and considering I won't replace them until I'm IN BT, its worth every gold. If you're not going to replace an item, why not throw some gold down. Gold is so easy to come by now that its almost worthless.
#10 May 30 2008 at 7:45 AM Rating: Decent
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27,272 posts
The thing requires 4(!) hearts of darkness... are those that cheap on your server? oO
#11 May 30 2008 at 8:07 AM Rating: Decent
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881 posts
amayu wrote:

My shot rotation is: Auto shot, Steady shot, Steady shot, Multi shot (rinse and repeat)
Edited, May 29th 2008 3:43pm by amayu


I'm not up to 70 and not using shot macros yet, so please someone who actually knows what they are talking about step in, but isn't this your problem. Wouldn't an auto, steady, auto, steady, auto, steady, arcane type of thing be better? I'm just starting to read up and learn more about shot rotations but this is the direction I was beginning to lean towards.
#12 May 30 2008 at 10:06 AM Rating: Good
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513 posts
From Aethien's Sticky - Shot Rotation Macros

Hunter Macro's
Note: to make a macro open chat and type /macro
You will then get a nice box where you can make new macro's, give them a nice picture and a name.
The most common shooting cycle macro's, you need to test for yourself wich works best as it differes greatly with weaponspeed and latency/fps.

/console Sound_EnableSFX 0
/castsequence reset=3/target !auto shot, steady shot
/castrandom arcane shot, multi-shot
/cast [exists,target=pettarget,nodead] kill command
/script UIErrorsFrame:Clear()
/console Sound_EnableSFX 1

No CC present, 1.5:1 shooting cycle
shooting cycle with Auto, steady, arcane and multishot.

/console Sound_EnableSFX 0
/castsequence reset=3/target !auto shot, steady shot
/castrandom arcane shot
/cast [exists,target=pettarget,nodead] kill command
/script UIErrorsFrame:Clear()
/console Sound_EnableSFX 1

CC Present, 1.5:1 shooting cycle
shooting cycle with only auto, steady and arcane shot.

#showtooltip Steady Shot
/script UIErrorsFrame:Hide()
/castsequence reset=3 Steady Shot, !Auto Shot
/cast [exists,target=pettarget,nodead] Kill Command
/script UIErrorsFrame:Clear(); UIErrorsFrame:Show()

BM Auto-steady with killcommand
basic BM shooting cycle.

#showtooltip Steady Shot
/cast !Auto shot
/cast [target=pettarget, exists] Kill command
/cast Steady shot
/script UIErrorsFrame:Clear()

3:2 Macro, no castsequence wich is better for dps.
Its a clobbering macro though and it will make you clip some stuff.

all 4 shooting cycle macro's work through spamming the button.
Add in the "/castrandom Lightning Breath" line if you are using a Windserpent.
#13 May 30 2008 at 12:44 PM Rating: Decent
I dunno about your servers but heart of darkness on mine go for 400 per. cost me 2400g just for the hearts for those two items.
#14 May 30 2008 at 12:54 PM Rating: Good
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400?? wow. 200 is getting ripped off on my server. Of course I get them from my guild for cheap (or free for the resist gear)
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#15 May 30 2008 at 2:12 PM Rating: Decent
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yeah, they're about 400g on my server, too. There are only about 10 guilds on my server that have downed Mother Shahraz, and about 30 that are in Hyjal. So most of the hearts of darkness are being saved for shadow resistence gear.
#16 Jun 01 2008 at 2:50 AM Rating: Decent
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they are 500-1k on my server :(
most guilds either need them for their own resist gear or they concentrate purely on SWP...
#17 Jun 01 2008 at 10:09 AM Rating: Good
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377 posts
HoD have been steady at about 500 on my server for a few months. The price doesn't seem to be budging one way or another.
#18 Jun 01 2008 at 11:54 AM Rating: Decent
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1,292 posts
They are 1k on my server, on the odd chance that there is one on the AH.

But we have a mere three Horde Guilds in T6 content, and only one which has it on farm. That doesn't leave much room for a market for Hearts of Darkness.
#19 Jun 02 2008 at 5:33 PM Rating: Decent
I have the common macros with a raiding hunter also, same gear as other Hunters or sometimes better and i seem to lack DPS on a huge level also, I have used guns, Bows, respecced Marks and then back to Beast. I frequently do Badge runs in Kara and our sister guild has a BE hunter that often comes in to raid. She is at times neck to neck with me, and more often than I'd like surpasses me. I am an Orc hunter and think they are unmatched except to Taurens with our racials. I use flasks, elixirs, pots, agility/ AP foods. What the Heck am I doing wrong? Someone please help.
#20 Jun 03 2008 at 3:43 AM Rating: Decent
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881 posts
vVannessa wrote:
I have the common macros with a raiding hunter also, same gear as other Hunters or sometimes better and i seem to lack DPS on a huge level also, I have used guns, Bows, respecced Marks and then back to Beast. I frequently do Badge runs in Kara and our sister guild has a BE hunter that often comes in to raid. She is at times neck to neck with me, and more often than I'd like surpasses me. I am an Orc hunter and think they are unmatched except to Taurens with our racials. I use flasks, elixirs, pots, agility/ AP foods. What the Heck am I doing wrong? Someone please help.



Posting your armory will help others help you.
#21 Jun 03 2008 at 5:41 AM Rating: Decent
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27,272 posts
zebug wrote:
Posting your armory will help others help you.
Posting WWS log(s) will help much more :)
#22 Jun 03 2008 at 7:51 AM Rating: Decent
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203 posts
vVannessa wrote:
I have the common macros with a raiding hunter also, same gear as other Hunters or sometimes better and i seem to lack DPS on a huge level also, I have used guns, Bows, respecced Marks and then back to Beast. I frequently do Badge runs in Kara and our sister guild has a BE hunter that often comes in to raid. She is at times neck to neck with me, and more often than I'd like surpasses me. I am an Orc hunter and think they are unmatched except to Taurens with our racials. I use flasks, elixirs, pots, agility/ AP foods. What the Heck am I doing wrong? Someone please help.


So tell me how do the orc or tauren racials gonna help your dps. Orcs are gonna get a little more out of their pets, but its not that much. From a dps standpoint, a troll using a bow has the better racial (and the beserk helps some as well :P).
#23 Jun 03 2008 at 8:43 AM Rating: Good
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27,272 posts
uzemaki wrote:
So tell me how do the orc racials gonna help your dps.
Like, 3rd trinket?
Blood Fury = 282 AP for 15 seconds every 2 minutes.
That's pretty damn impressive.



Enough to make me sort of wish i made an orc hunter to start with.
#24 Jun 03 2008 at 11:15 AM Rating: Decent
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881 posts
Aethien wrote:
zebug wrote:
Posting your armory will help others help you.
Posting WWS log(s) will help much more :)


This forum has no place for logical comments...boy we need another person asking about the most bestest pet ever.
#25REDACTED, Posted: Jun 04 2008 at 2:09 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Make sure you keep serpent sting up all the time and always use arcane shot once it is up. Also your steady shot does more damage when the target is dazed. So if the target is in a situation that you can afford it, use concussive shot and then steady shot.
#26 Jun 04 2008 at 2:30 AM Rating: Good
ararelin wrote:
Make sure you keep serpent sting up all the time and always use arcane shot once it is up. Also your steady shot does more damage when the target is dazed. So if the target is in a situation that you can afford it, use concussive shot and then steady shot.
For me the rotation looks like this:
Serpent sting/arcane shot/concussive shot/steady shot/steady shot/arcane shot/concussive shot/steady shot (rinse and repeat)


Please stop posting such non sense. That is the second post of yours in which I read that crap.
Serpent sting is a waste of a global cooldown. A steady shot will do more damage, cost less mana and you can fire a scorpid sting instead which helps you tank a lot.
Concussive shot is NOT used in a shot rotation. It is extremely useless, mana intensive and most mobs are immune to daze effects (most bosses are). Also concussive shot is a waste of a global cooldown which could be used to do damage.
A part of your "shot rotation" reads "steady shot/arcane shot/concussive shot/steady shot" that is a really stupid idea. There is no room for two special shot between your steadies. How mana autoshots are in between those shots? Usually you whole shot rotation revolves around your autoshot-timer and steady shot.
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