I was wondering, after kara. What sorta stats should a rogue have to be ready for the first two 25 mans? and the first 4 bosses of zul aman?
what sort of total raid dps should a 10 man be pushing for those 4 bosses in zul aman? 4k? 4.5k?
Edited, May 28th 2008 8:43am by Tenjen
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Rogue stat req after karaFollow
This should be an interesting thread!
For mean-average, group dps totals I'd say 4k might be a bit short. From my (admittedly limited) experience with ZA, our ~4.2k was ok, not great on Bear and Eagle. But both fights seemed to be a bit stressful with that. And we had longevity problems with Lynx. My current goal is to hold a steady 5k for ZA progression. I am not sure if that's realistic with a 10-man in Kara gear, but goals are like that sometimes. ;)
For my rogue, I was shooting for 250-300 hit (in my "boss gear"), ~1700-1800 ap and ~30% crit. Basically, I'm geared for what I planned on right now (more or less), so check my armory and remember that it's just my opinion, nothing more. The advice I've gotten is get t4/kara drop gear and you should be fine.
And not to jack the thread, but I'd love to see everyone's class-mix ideas as well.
For mean-average, group dps totals I'd say 4k might be a bit short. From my (admittedly limited) experience with ZA, our ~4.2k was ok, not great on Bear and Eagle. But both fights seemed to be a bit stressful with that. And we had longevity problems with Lynx. My current goal is to hold a steady 5k for ZA progression. I am not sure if that's realistic with a 10-man in Kara gear, but goals are like that sometimes. ;)
For my rogue, I was shooting for 250-300 hit (in my "boss gear"), ~1700-1800 ap and ~30% crit. Basically, I'm geared for what I planned on right now (more or less), so check my armory and remember that it's just my opinion, nothing more. The advice I've gotten is get t4/kara drop gear and you should be fine.
And not to jack the thread, but I'd love to see everyone's class-mix ideas as well.
The problem with kara is the lack of good swords for a rogue so if u can then get the arena swords as ure weapons. But the rest of the gear available is very good, your hit shud be bordering on 290 if u gem for it. 30% crit seems high but try cap off hit before u aim for solid crit gems (which u shud never do).
In terms of ZA best group for me would be, 2 tanks Pally and Druid. 3 Healers Druid Pally Shammy and then the 5 dps would be mage, hunter (for tranquil shot), moonkin (helps root those scouts), rogue (cuz we are imba), warlock. This group would be fine on the first 4 bosses last two might struggle.
Edited, May 28th 2008 7:51am by yankytoon
In terms of ZA best group for me would be, 2 tanks Pally and Druid. 3 Healers Druid Pally Shammy and then the 5 dps would be mage, hunter (for tranquil shot), moonkin (helps root those scouts), rogue (cuz we are imba), warlock. This group would be fine on the first 4 bosses last two might struggle.
Edited, May 28th 2008 7:51am by yankytoon
Check here.
If you scroll down about halfway there's a couple posts on gear after Kara.
Basic stats
HP: 9000
AP: 1600
Hit: 320
Crit: 25%
That's with a basic set of gear I had throw together. The AP/Crit numbers may be higher now due to the 2.4 badge gear being out. You'll also probably trade some hit for haste if you get the 2.4 badge gear.
Edited, May 28th 2008 8:28am by Bigdaddyjug
If you scroll down about halfway there's a couple posts on gear after Kara.
Basic stats
HP: 9000
AP: 1600
Hit: 320
Crit: 25%
That's with a basic set of gear I had throw together. The AP/Crit numbers may be higher now due to the 2.4 badge gear being out. You'll also probably trade some hit for haste if you get the 2.4 badge gear.
Edited, May 28th 2008 8:28am by Bigdaddyjug
I'm glad this came up, as I've got a question on post-Kara reqs as well.
Right now I'm mutilate, and barely pushing 680-700 dps. How fail is this for muti? Sig for armory. I can get to SSC but need to push my dps much higher, so I'm going to S1 combat swords. What kind of dps increase can I expect? I've plugged everything into the spreadsheet and it's giving me unrealistic numbers (1270dps, switching to swords says 1310). Anyone have a guess?
Edited, May 28th 2008 11:38am by ThomasMagnum
Right now I'm mutilate, and barely pushing 680-700 dps. How fail is this for muti? Sig for armory. I can get to SSC but need to push my dps much higher, so I'm going to S1 combat swords. What kind of dps increase can I expect? I've plugged everything into the spreadsheet and it's giving me unrealistic numbers (1270dps, switching to swords says 1310). Anyone have a guess?
Edited, May 28th 2008 11:38am by ThomasMagnum
48 posts
Switch to combat swords. I do about 900 dps average. From my experience, muti isn't that good for raids, all that time trying to get behind the target, you would be DPSing w/ swords...
aha! the pre kara list did indeed have a post-kara list at the bottom of the page.
Thanks for the indicator.
and thanks to those who answered the ZA dps push, lots of other people indicated around that general amount and higher.
Thanks for the indicator.
and thanks to those who answered the ZA dps push, lots of other people indicated around that general amount and higher.
Quote:
Right now I'm mutilate, and barely pushing 680-700 dps. How fail is this for muti? Sig for armory. I can get to SSC but need to push my dps much higher, so I'm going to S1 combat swords. What kind of dps increase can I expect? I've plugged everything into the spreadsheet and it's giving me unrealistic numbers (1270dps, switching to swords says 1310). Anyone have a guess?
That's the DPS you'll get hacking away at a target with no interruptions, following a perfect cycle. It probably factors in normal buffs too, which you may not have.
As for wether your dps is fail or not, it depends on the fight. 700 is just about OK on some and atrocious on others. It also depends on what support you are getting from your group - if you're grouped with 4 mages then you won't get good dps numbers.
Quote:
Switch to combat swords. I do about 900 dps average. From my experience, muti isn't that good for raids, all that time trying to get behind the target, you would be DPSing w/ swords...
Never attack from the front of a boss. You'll get parried and increase the boss' attack speed.
Edited, May 29th 2008 3:32am by Kavekk
This is a digression, but have you noticed how the badge items (and heroic MgT loot) made most of the early raid loot obsolete? To get an upgrade you need to go to Hyjal or even BT. SSC is a waste of time. TK offers too little for the effort. In ZA there are 2 items in the timed chests, small upgrades anyhow.
Wytryszek wrote:
This is a digression, but have you noticed how the badge items (and heroic MgT loot) made most of the early raid loot obsolete? To get an upgrade you need to go to Hyjal or even BT. SSC is a waste of time. TK offers too little for the effort. In ZA there are 2 items in the timed chests, small upgrades anyhow.
NO, I HAD NO IDEA.
WHY WOULD THEY DO THAT.
ITS LIKE THEYRE TRYING TO PUSH PROGRESSION ALONG TO ALL THE BAD GUILDS STILL IN T4 AND T5.
Well, that was sort of the point of the badge concept anyway, I thought? Raiding or badge gear would come out about equivalent, even though it doesn't*? Distinguish the raiders from the non while still giving them good gear?
*Though you would think with as mathematically precise as they are able to write a raid encounter, they could perfectly balance those items so they would be equivalent to eachother....
*Though you would think with as mathematically precise as they are able to write a raid encounter, they could perfectly balance those items so they would be equivalent to eachother....
With a mix of ZA/t5/t6 gear my unbuffed stats are:
1835 AP
299 hit
27.83% crit
expertise capped
around 300-400 passive armor ignore
Edited, May 29th 2008 2:15pm by Salwrathis
1835 AP
299 hit
27.83% crit
expertise capped
around 300-400 passive armor ignore
Edited, May 29th 2008 2:15pm by Salwrathis
theo wrote:
ITS LIKE THEYRE TRYING TO PUSH PROGRESSION ALONG TO ALL THE BAD GUILDS and people who came late to the game STILL IN T4 AND T5.
Fixed for ya. ;p
*edit: And I still can't seem to find any place in a progressive raid beyond ZA right now. There are just too many f'in rogues on my server in t5/6 content. UGH!!!
Edited, May 29th 2008 3:14pm by TherionSaysWhat
TherionSaysWhat wrote:
theo wrote:
ITS LIKE THEYRE TRYING TO PUSH PROGRESSION ALONG TO ALL THE BAD GUILDS and people who came late to the game STILL IN T4 AND T5.
Fixed for ya. ;p
*edit: And I still can't seem to find any place in a progressive raid beyond ZA right now. There are just too many f'in rogues on my server in t5/6 content. UGH!!!
Edited, May 29th 2008 3:14pm by TherionSaysWhat
No, but see...I wouldn't be me if I didn't make generic ******* comments at least once every day.
Overlord Theophany wrote:
NO, I HAD NO IDEA.
It feels good to bring enlightment to the unfortunate, hehe.
Anyhow, this is still relevant to the original question. What does it mean to be "after Karazhan" now? Does it mean only Karazhan gear, or Karazhan plus all the badge gear you can buy without ever going to 25man instances, just farming Karzhan for badges every week?
You should really know what you should be at for T5 and T6 content assuming you actually have been you know, playing and researching your class.
Use the spreadsheet, go for upgrades wherever you can find them, don't be a dumb ***. End of story.
Use the spreadsheet, go for upgrades wherever you can find them, don't be a dumb ***. End of story.
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