So, you want to PvP as a DPS spec?Follow

I actually do think Quor is informative at times. As is Theo...on the rogue forums there are many great posts from him. I really could care less about my other thread, the only reason this one has lasted so long is because it was such an obvious troll attempt. My thread was rated down by Theo and trolled, yet most of the enhancement information was repeated here...

Anyway, it doesn't vex me at all, I could really care less if I get rated down by some people who like to trash other class forums. Whilst I will be chopping heads off and checking out bewbs in AoC, my shaman will be eating dust on the shelf until WoTK comes out...

Some scrub forum troll said

First off, damn you troll, for making me post again in here to retort to the 99% of your post that was garbage.

As for my back story: My gear is actually superb for pre SSC/TK which my guild is heading to in the next 2 weeks for Hydross farming. My enchants and gems done up properly, and I've played an Enhance Shaman from lvl 1 on my first day playing WoW.

I almost always trinket out of cheap shot. Make em waste combo points. And the rest of my statement was sarcasm which tends to be lost on the addlebrained, hence your confuzzlement. I don't die to stunlock everytime , of course, but lets say the rogue gets me to say 55-65% on the first stunlock. What possible option do I have if he successfully vanishes, resaps and preps? And a properly specced rogue does increased damage and takes less damage as you come closer to the finale of the fight. No rogue kills me with more than 50% life, but I'm still a corpse and all they have to do is bandage.

A shaman's "Oh ****" button is Reincarnation, which is straight bullsh!t, kinda like your trolling 12 post scrubness.

hey, i found a good video of a high-rated 3's enh shammy who has played in more than 95% of the games his team has done. i know *i* learned a lot from watching that video, so i naturally assumed other people could learn a lot from it too. the guy goes against some very good RMP teams (including one with neilyo on it), as well as double melee + druid and comes out on top. his team runs like a well-oiled machine, and he has a couple of nice mods that a shaman who wishes to pvp probably should have (one called shaman friend comes to mind, which was heretofore unknown to me). one of the best ways to get better at arena is to watch how other high-rated people of your class play. rooting is an issue for a shammy in his comp, so to compensate for that, the druid and the hunter/lock make an effort to drag targets to the shammy. its great to see the druid with a fel hunter on him run over to the shammy and watch the fel hunter get pwnt. now the SL/SL lock is way squisiher, and hes either forced to fel dom a new pet, or if thats down hes basically screwed.

you call it flamebait, i call it a learning experience. if you truly didnt give a damn about any of this then you wouldnt have posted. that goes for everyone else saying the same things too; if you really dont want to see this thread, then stop clicking on it. the people who want to see this thread will find it and use it. meanwhile, the rest of yall can just use the back button, or that little X in the upper right corner of your screen (for PC users, not so sure how macs close windows) and itll be like this thread doesnt even exist.

Now that one's just an unfair generalization. That's no basis to refute Quor's claim on something like that.

There are ways to counter Quor's suggestion on learning from PvP vids, but that's not one of them.

Seriously Taurrus, you complain about all of the trolling that you see in these threads but you know what? The biggest troll in this thread is you. Virtually all your posts in this thread is attempting to knock someone down with no valuable information at all. Sure you may have corrected a "oh there are some people in so and so bracket" or "shamans dual-wield in pvp." None of those posts give out any valuable info. Why don't you stop trolling and give us some real pvp info and strategies.

The major parts of your "debate" consists of:
"You don't even play a shaman, so don't try to help us"
"You have a shaman, but you don't seriously arena with it, so don't help us"
Broken record much?

Tell us this, what do you mean by a serious pvp shaman? Is it someone who spends hours upon hours in arena? What if that person is horrible in pvp with a 1000 ranking? Does that person still qualify to give out info on shaman pvp? Most likely, no.

I wonder whose information would you trust more? Someone who is horrible at pvp and gives out their experience from losing as a source? Or someone who has gotten a high ranking that has played with and against high ranking shamans? The latter, at least would have gotten a first hand view at the strategies that good shamans use. For me, I would not take the information of from someone whose source is from a losers point of view.

I wonder who was it that had their information from a losers point of view but still attempted to give out pvp advice? Oh thats right, it was you Taurrus. How do I know it's from a losers point of view? Simple, you even started a QQ thread about how much shamans, i.e. yourself, suck in pvp.

So according to you, since you don't play a shaman, then you shouldn't be giving out pvp advice right? As you stated before, you are scrapping your shaman until the WotLK expansion comes out. Since you are no longer playing a shaman, take your own advice and don't give out information you pulled out from that loser *** of yours.

ok...so dont respond to it. rate it down and move on. youre the one that bumped the whole post just to mention that. i posted what i did cause i knew theo (and a few other people) would get a bit of a chuckle out of it.

nothing is to say theo and i cant have a little laugh to ourselves within a thread.

besides, you act like no one has ever done anything like that ever. im sure you yourself are completely innocent of ever trying to do something like what i did, but for us normal, imperfect humans, we like to have a little fun every now and then.

I'm well aware of the Shaman's lack of options, and I'm not arguing that fact.


... Which bring us back to the point I was trying to make, and I don't really feel like I should have to repeat it. Rogues are the single strongest 1v1 class in the game. Saying DPS Shaman get slaughtered by Rogues in a duel isn't really saying much since just about everything gets slaughtered by a Rogue in a duel unless the Rogue just isn't that good or messes up. Focusing on this match-up is just baiting more trolling, and I wanted to avoid that.

A better way to get the point across would be to talk about the way that DPS Shaman get slaughtered 1v1 against just about everything and are advantages against almost nothing, because that's quite true. Case in point:

Not entirely true...An enhancement shaman can totally dominate a s-priest. There, we can consistently beat 1 spec out of a possible 24 for the the 8 other classes, there is hope! :)

This may come as a shock to you, but rogues actually work very well on melee train teams. What other class has a basically instant armor reduction?

I mean, you can whack away on 4k armor if you really want, but IMO, I'd rather whack away on 1k, which with my armor pen on my gear, is 0.

It's not that enhancement shamans pair well with rogues; it's that they pair well with warriors (WF totem, hi), and warriors pair well on focus targets with rogues.

I posted this thread to try and be helpful. I have a perspective of someone that's had a bit of success in PvP and has played against people that are good at every single class in each bracket (though I personally will freely admit to my relative lack of knowledge in 3v3; I haven't done much outside of RRD), which I think this forum lacks.

You and Sin are to this forum what I am to the Rogue forum, I gather, yet neither of you has any proof of where you are in this game. I put my armory link in my sig so people can see what I've done, what I've accomplished, and yes, even so they can laugh when I play on bad teams. I read this forum far more often than I post in it, and both of you seem to speak from on high that your opinion is right and there's little to no proof that you have the experience to back up what you're saying.

Just my perspective, of course.

Theo...why do you keep referencing your armory on your rogue like it matters? Just a FYI, Rogue does not = shaman.

Your resilience is about the same as my shammy, your ratings are sub-1800, your HK's are less than what most serious pvpers have...so why do you keep referencing it like it is something to be proud of?

Theo: "I have mad PvP skills...this backs up what I say"

Everyone else: "Um dude, you PvP with a Rogue not a shaman"

Theo: "My rogue pvp experience backs up what I say about shaman in PvP"

In short, how can you call anyone out that they have no proof what they've accomplished/where they are in the game when you pvp with a rogue, your own dam PvP rankings on a OP class are mediocre at best?

You're the biggest frigging hypocrite I've seen, anywhere.

Oh, and while we're at it, since you reference your armory so much - you have quite the history of trolling the shaman forums on the O-boards too. Troll.


Edited, Jun 3rd 2008 8:43pm by Taurrus

Look people I don't know about how any of you feel but this is just a ridiculous thread.

I am not gonna say shaman is completely broken yes we have our uses in PvP, we can bring a lot to a group in many ways and forms.

But what we have here is a failure to atleast agree that yes shaman has some deficiencies.

Yes shaman can bring great burst, buffs, purges, and even spot heals in to an arena, but that doesn't mean we are a very strong class, we can succeed we can do well but it means the shaman and his team must work hard to get over the shaman's deficiencies.

Theo I am sure you know a lot about PvP and I will go ahead and say thanks for coming in here and trying to help us regardless of intension at this point. I think you would have been a bit more successful with what your trying to do here if you acknowledge that that shaman have some problems in PvP and must work hard to over come this all.

Yes I will agree shaman class as a hole is more or less QQ I suck at PvP and the threads like that should stop (or atleast decrease) and I think you do wish to due away with that, but by implying a class that definitely does have some problems in PvP has none is just ignorant.

Try to strike a compromise at least if your intension is truly to help then why not do that, I am sure if you atleast compromised with the shaman community and stop basically telling us L2P then maybe something constructive can come out of all of this otherwise its an utter waste.

I will even go as far as saying had you not pissed off so many of us in your last thread then this may have been a great thread, but the fact of the matter is regardless if you wanted to help, it just seemed like you wanted to further argue and debate with Gaud and Sins to many of us.

How about everyone let this thread burn in oblivion and in a week or maybe two try again Theo, listen to some of what we have to say and offer and put in your own opinion/theory into all of this. I think you did an ok job in your original post but like I said it was too soon, and without atleast making a compromise with us how would you be heard if what you want to do is share your knowledge of PvP and also help us out.

There must be a reason why shaman are not so satisfied with our PvP, we don't all just need to L2P (maybe some do) but maybe you can help us overcome that by explaining our deficiencies and giving us tips and tricks on how to overcome them.

Besides how will we learn to PvP if we don't know what to do when put into a bad situation, things don't always go as planned.

BTW Taurrus I am gonna go ahead and say I know you mean well and really feel passionate about the shaman class but your not helping and have only made everything in this thread worse. You have done your share of keeping this thread alive without any real constructive posts. Many shaman are disappointed with shaman at 70 but we have to try. Anyhow I hope WotLK works out better for you when you come back to the game, but just because you hated BC doesn't mean everyone did.

anyhow thats just my thoughts on this entire mess, I am done in this thread.