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0/47/11+3, where to put the 3?Follow

#1 Mar 25 2008 at 9:34 AM Rating: Decent
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I was planning out my build for my mage, and I know the basic 0/47/11+3 build, but I felt like taking the 3 out of imp fire blast for the moment (since 6.5 seconds would still mean dead time between casts), and for the extra 3 abilities (since I've got the requisites for all of them) getting dragon breath, pyroblast, and blast wave. My problem is what to do with the last 3 points.

The purpose of this build is for PvE DPS, although a little control in AoE situations or PvP situations is not unwelcome.
0/47/11 R3 is what I've come up with so far. I pick up what appear to me as the important talents for DPSing as fire, while also allowing me a tremendous amount of control over the battlefield should I be caught up in world PvP or oh sh* situations. But I have 3 talent points to spend...

Lower tier arcane looks all right, because even though I'll do my best to be spell-hit capped, if I'm only going for 13% (since I get 3% with elemental precision) I may want the extra 4% hit on polymorph. But that's 2 points, and none of the other talents in that set appeal to me. If I did that, I'd probably put the last point in imp fireblast, because at 7.5 second CD it's at least a multiple of the GCD.
I could also put 3 points back into imp Fireblast. It doesn't seem optimal to me, but would help with kiting.
The third option I see is imp flamestrike. While it doesn't appear to be too optimal for DPS, if I get enough mobs with it, and I get a regular amount of crits, I can probably spam flamestrike will relatively little mana cost. If I'm wrong on the mechanics of Master of Elements, please tell me.
The fourth option I see is to put points into Improved Blizzard. Sort of add to the AoE control I would have with dragon's breath, blast wave, cone of cold, and improved frost nova.
I could also do combinations of some.

So...where to put the points? Arcane Focus, Imp Fireblast, Imp Flamestrike, and Imp Blizzard are all up for grabs, which one should I get?

Edited, Mar 25th 2008 10:35am by skribs
#2 Mar 25 2008 at 9:45 AM Rating: Good
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I put 2 in Arcane Subtlety and 2 in Imp Fire blast and not use Dragon's Breath.

Just my personal opinion but I tend to stay away from the mobs so Dragon's breath is useless for me. Also I put 5/5 in Improved Frost Bolt and take 3 out of Permafrost.

#3 Mar 25 2008 at 9:53 AM Rating: Decent
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Permafrost is a must-have IMO, as it's 3% hit and 3% more mana efficiency. For me, dragon's breath would be another burst of AoE damage as well as the disorient effect should I pull aggro. Also, I'm on a PvP server, so if I get jumped while farming...
I also dont think arcane subtlety will help much, since IIRC mobs dont have resistance - just a much lower chance to hit if they're level 72 or 73.

I AM leaning toward the 2/2 arcane focus and 1/3 improved fire blast, though, but I wanted some advice.
#4 Mar 25 2008 at 10:07 AM Rating: Good
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I would put points in arcane subtlety (2) and in arcane focus (2). Just take out the point in Dragon's breath. I got the perfect example why you should put points in arcane focus even as a fire mage: Kael resisted one of our mage's counterspell and got boned right off the bat with a 15k fireball.

skribs wrote:
Permafrost is a must-have IMO, as it's 3% hit and 3% more mana efficiency.

I don't know where you found that, but permafrost doesnt add any + hit or mana efficiency. (Edit: you just got it mixed up with elemental precision, I just realised that.)

I've put 3 points in imp frostbolt for fire immune mobs (A'lar, Infernals on Anetheron). Also, imp frost nova is not all that usefull in PvE content; you rarely get to use it as it can be a danger to your melee raiders if the tank moves out of range while you freeze the mobs. I put the 2 points in Ice shards instead of imp frost nova.

Imp fireblast is not all that usefull; good on trash, but forget about it on most bosses.

Edited, Mar 25th 2008 2:08pm by Turbomart
#5 Mar 25 2008 at 1:47 PM Rating: Good
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Arcane Subtlety is taken more for the 40% reduction in threat than the 20 penetration.

Arcane Explosion, anyone?
#6 Mar 25 2008 at 4:23 PM Rating: Good
compgenius wrote:
I put 2 in Arcane Subtlety and 2 in Imp Fire blast and not use Dragon's Breath.

Just my personal opinion but I tend to stay away from the mobs so Dragon's breath is useless for me. Also I put 5/5 in Improved Frost Bolt and take 3 out of Permafrost.




dragon's breath is a great talent, for both grinding and all of those aoe fights.
#7 Mar 25 2008 at 8:34 PM Rating: Good
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Anobix wrote:
compgenius wrote:
I put 2 in Arcane Subtlety and 2 in Imp Fire blast and not use Dragon's Breath.

Just my personal opinion but I tend to stay away from the mobs so Dragon's breath is useless for me. Also I put 5/5 in Improved Frost Bolt and take 3 out of Permafrost.




dragon's breath is a great talent, for both grinding and all of those aoe fights.


Yep. And I'll agree with what others are saying about Arcane Subtlety for AoE fights. Basically, you should probably be at 2/47/11 +1. That +1 has multiple happy places to go. More hit for sheeping/CS, more crit for Flame Strike, Impact for happy stun procs, Imp Fireblast for faster mob tagging when you're out on the Isle of Quel'danas. Put that last point where you see the most usefulness in your daily life.
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