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spell damage or spell criticalFollow

#1 Mar 17 2008 at 7:39 AM Rating: Good
This questions is only for PvP mages. I am thinking switching to Chaotic Skyfire Diamond where you get +12 Spell Critical and +3% increased critical damage from the current one with +12 spell damage and minor run speed increase. I don't really care about minor run speed as you can get the same thing with ench to boots. For PVP, which meta gem is better? Thanks
#2 Mar 17 2008 at 9:57 AM Rating: Good
If you are going to get the boar's speed enchant on your boots I would either get the MSD or the one that you listed.

There are also a couple of others that are worth noting, one of which is the +12 stam + 5% stun resist, that can be very helpful.
#3 Mar 17 2008 at 6:51 PM Rating: Decent
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My "expert" opinion on this situation is that i believe MSD is best for pvp in general, but if you arent in the most incredible gear, i suggest 12 stam 5% stun. Me personally, i have 12 stam 5% stun, but thats just because im cheap and dont have to money for MSD. (if i had $$ i would have it)

Basically, if you have plenty o health and your resilliance is at or above average, than i suggest MSD.

Original Question Crit vs. MSD: Go for MSD, crit isnt the biggest worry, and 5% crit wont do much.

Edited, Mar 17th 2008 10:54pm by Loooopie
#4 Mar 20 2008 at 4:33 AM Rating: Decent
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You have to be CCing and doing damage in arenas, MSD works for both, and has gotten me out of a pinch on many occasions.

I suggest MSD over the CSD, which is a raiding gem, and the 12 damage/minor speed gem, which is for people who can't afford to gem their items properly.

The only viable alternative is the 18 stam 5% stun resist as Loopie mentioned.
#5 Mar 20 2008 at 7:58 AM Rating: Good
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MSD.

You're talking PvP, so I'm assuming you're frost. Your crits come from Shatter combos. Proportionally speaking, adding 5% to that huge crit chance--while negating a good bit of your target's resilience--isn't that much.

Also, iirc, Chaotic has some potentially weird gem requirements. Don't recall the details of all that as I haven't yet looked at meta gems that closely. Relying on Battlecast Hood at the moment until I can finally complete my 5/5 merc/veng glad gear with the hat.

ed's note: I realize saving the hat for last doesn't make alot of sense, since it has the meta, but it just worked out as my gear evolved that I had bigger fish to fry in other slots. My goodness, when I think back to the gear I was wearing when I started Arena'ing in S2...Netherweave Tunic and Gloves (for the stam and 2-set dmg bonus) and Evokers Helm. I'll just leave it at that. /scary

edit: clarity in punctuation

Edited, Mar 20th 2008 12:00pm by AynLoD
#6 Mar 20 2008 at 8:28 AM Rating: Good
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AynLoD wrote:
Also, iirc, Chaotic has some potentially weird gem requirements. Don't recall the details of all that as I haven't yet looked at meta gems that closely. Relying on Battlecast Hood at the moment until I can finally complete my 5/5 merc/veng glad gear with the hat.



Actually, Chaotic only requires at least 2 blue gems. MSD is kinda a pain with the "more blues than yellows", though.
#7 Mar 20 2008 at 8:32 AM Rating: Good
The One and Only Poldaran wrote:
AynLoD wrote:
Also, iirc, Chaotic has some potentially weird gem requirements. Don't recall the details of all that as I haven't yet looked at meta gems that closely. Relying on Battlecast Hood at the moment until I can finally complete my 5/5 merc/veng glad gear with the hat.



Actually, Chaotic only requires at least 2 blue gems. MSD is kinda a pain with the "more blues than yellows", though.


yeah, it means you can't gem for straight resilience.
#8 Mar 20 2008 at 8:34 AM Rating: Good
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Pol wrote:
Quote:
AynLoD wrote:
Also, iirc, Chaotic has some potentially weird gem requirements. Don't recall the details of all that as I haven't yet looked at meta gems that closely. Relying on Battlecast Hood at the moment until I can finally complete my 5/5 merc/veng glad gear with the hat.

Actually, Chaotic only requires at least 2 blue gems. MSD is kinda a pain with the "more blues than yellows", though.

Ah, thx Pol, this jogged my memory--I remember what it was now. I got it off an old EJ post; they said there was a bug such that Chaotic required exactly two blues, rather than at least two. May have been an old post (you know those long-*** EJ posts; no such thing as a necropost there), so perhaps the bug was fixed in one of the last few patches.

edit:
Anobix wrote:
yeah, it means you can't gem for straight resilience.

Yup, I'm looking forward to having this as an excuse to gem for a bit more dmg and a bit less resil. With Vengeful hat and wand finally in hand, so to speak, my resil with current gemming will be over 400. I never Arena w/o my Warlock buddy, so it's rare I get focus-fired (at least in our rating bracket), thus extra resil is kinda wasted. For some reason, people would rather sit through my sheep and/or CS than through 5 DoTs, a Deathcoil, and 2 fears. O.o lol

Edited, Mar 20th 2008 12:46pm by AynLoD
#9 Mar 20 2008 at 3:32 PM Rating: Good
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Actually, it wasn't bugged. They just changed it a while back.
#10 Mar 20 2008 at 8:44 PM Rating: Decent
Quote:

Actually, Chaotic only requires at least 2 blue gems. MSD is kinda a pain with the "more blues than yellows", though.


it's for this reason that a lot of people might prefer to just gem +hit and take the chaotic over mystical (since MSD is getting a little nerf again in 2.4?)

if you ask me, there aren't any marvelous caster metas aside from insightful earthstorm (more of a healer gem, but i guess it could help?)
#11 Mar 20 2008 at 9:21 PM Rating: Good
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LaFey wrote:
if you ask me, there aren't any marvelous caster metas aside from insightful earthstorm (more of a healer gem, but i guess it could help?)


You mean any "other" marvelous caster metas? Because MSD and Chaotic are both awesometacular.
#12 Mar 22 2008 at 4:02 PM Rating: Default
not as awesome as they used to be (should have remained). considering how few head pieces have a meta slot (all the ones worth keeping any length of time until late-end-game are pvp "welfare epics". nothing wrong with that. just that they aren't spectacular for pve), and then comparing those against the available head gear at appropriate "tiers" of progression... incantator's and mana etched are just such a farce and putting a meta in them still won't make them worth wearing when you could pvp for a few days and get season1 (or 2 once season 4 hits)which is far better and far easier to get. for starters you need decent gear to start approaching T4 or 5, and unfortunately, the pvp gear isn't ideal for pve progression. that means you'll be wearing the wicked witch's hat or the uni-mind headdress for quite a while. the uni-mind in particular i would say is quite worth the loss of a meta slot -- can anyone prove that the gain of +hit and crit isn't worth as much as a MSD? for pvp or mage-tanking for krosh, the pvp head is better (resilience for one, and stamina for the other) but then, the question is moot.

don't forget how much purge/dispel is floating around in pvp. that mystical could be gone before you even get the chance to use it during the few seconds the proc is active. the cooldown was just uncalled for: they could have adjusted the proc rate to be satisfactory instead of forcing it to a timeline.

i personally far prefer passive, constant effects rather than undependable procs and on-use items. my gut feeling tells me that the uni-mind's hit is at least as much more damage as a MSD is, and more generally useful. perhaps even in pvp (lolcloak rogues can be made to fear you once more...).

my main gripe about metas is that none of them really do much more than an ordinary gem, they cost far more, and require you to bend over backwards to take full advantage of them.

my point regarding the preference of chaotic over msd was that chaotic's only requirement is that you have at least two blue (or green/purple) gems. MSD requires that you have more blue than yellow.

and the best +hit gems are yellow, or half yellow.

not to mention that it's difficult to arrange the available slot colors of your gear. there's a few pieces in kara (most directly relevant) that have a lot of yellow slots and really should not be socketed with off-color gems (if you're gonna ignore socket bonuses, why use gems at all?).

and last but not least, there is the mitigating argument about resilience basically negating the effect of chaotic. on the other hand, you can very very easily find yourself unable to cast for the entire proc-duration of the MSD as well. at least with the chaotic you have neutralized that much more of their resilience. it just seems to me that chaotic is naturally more useful for pvp where you aren't planted in one spot spamming your bolt-of-choice waiting for a proc to add a tiny dps spike.
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