this is my build for mace stun:
http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/rogue/talents.html?0040000000000000000003040550122005100020012005002530002301210000000
is it any good? or would it be better to just go with the usually Hemo/ShS
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ShS or Mace Stun for Arena's?Follow
HARP was nerfed hard in arena.
No good rogues use mace spec anymore.
No good rogues use mace spec anymore.
5 posts
so is mace spec any good anymore? and if so what build?
FULL combat maces might still be decent in the arena, but Shadowstep is better.
Shadowstep like this or with a few points to play with. Use maces, swords, or fists.
I don't know exactly how to spec combat maces, but i seem to remember 17/44/0 or something like that.
Edited, Mar 8th 2008 7:10pm by DrMayhem
Shadowstep like this or with a few points to play with. Use maces, swords, or fists.
I don't know exactly how to spec combat maces, but i seem to remember 17/44/0 or something like that.
Edited, Mar 8th 2008 7:10pm by DrMayhem
This is coming from a victim's view.
SS rogues are way deadlier imo than mace rogues. Way harder for me too kill or even get away from.
SS rogues are way deadlier imo than mace rogues. Way harder for me too kill or even get away from.
DrMayhem wrote:
FULL combat maces might still be decent in the arena, but Shadowstep is better.
Shadowstep like this
Shadowstep like this
Move the two points in imp EA to Lethality and you're good.
5/5 Lethality gives around a 2.3% damage increase over 0/5 lathality vs a 400 resilience target. Are you sure it's better than imp EA?
It's hardly as if you can burst with ShS anyway. Sustained damage is king, and imp EA really helps there, especially in S1 gear where you don't risk 'wasting' armour penetration.
It's hardly as if you can burst with ShS anyway. Sustained damage is king, and imp EA really helps there, especially in S1 gear where you don't risk 'wasting' armour penetration.
Kavekk wrote:
5/5 Lethality gives around a 2.3% damage increase over 0/5 lathality vs a 400 resilience target. Are you sure it's better than imp EA?
It's hardly as if you can burst with ShS anyway. Sustained damage is king, and imp EA really helps there, especially in S1 gear where you don't risk 'wasting' armour penetration.
It's hardly as if you can burst with ShS anyway. Sustained damage is king, and imp EA really helps there, especially in S1 gear where you don't risk 'wasting' armour penetration.
If sustained damage was king, we'd all be 0/20/41.
You're wrong.
There are extremely few times where Imp EA is going to matter; 2 points in Lethality helps you all the time.
Theophany the Sly wrote:
Kavekk wrote:
5/5 Lethality gives around a 2.3% damage increase over 0/5 lathality vs a 400 resilience target. Are you sure it's better than imp EA?
It's hardly as if you can burst with ShS anyway. Sustained damage is king, and imp EA really helps there, especially in S1 gear where you don't risk 'wasting' armour penetration.
It's hardly as if you can burst with ShS anyway. Sustained damage is king, and imp EA really helps there, especially in S1 gear where you don't risk 'wasting' armour penetration.
If sustained damage was king, we'd all be 0/20/41.
You're wrong.
There are extremely few times where Imp EA is going to matter; 2 points in Lethality helps you all the time.
The only reason people are not 0/20/41 is poison talents, so I find this point moot. Sustained is what you're doing as ShS, you just want 20/0/41 to keep up your healing debuff, just like Warrriors go MS over Fury for PvP.
2 in Lethality is a 0.9% boost which will occasionally amount in an extra 100 damage if you crit back to back. When used, IMP EA will give you around a 9% more total damage over someone without imp EA (but with regular EA) on a target with 4k armour. Anywhere between 3k and 4k and that number increases.
I think you need to use EA more.
Edited, Mar 10th 2008 1:19am by Kavekk
EA sucks donkey balls.
Kavekk wrote:
Theophany the Sly wrote:
Kavekk wrote:
5/5 Lethality gives around a 2.3% damage increase over 0/5 lathality vs a 400 resilience target. Are you sure it's better than imp EA?
It's hardly as if you can burst with ShS anyway. Sustained damage is king, and imp EA really helps there, especially in S1 gear where you don't risk 'wasting' armour penetration.
It's hardly as if you can burst with ShS anyway. Sustained damage is king, and imp EA really helps there, especially in S1 gear where you don't risk 'wasting' armour penetration.
If sustained damage was king, we'd all be 0/20/41.
You're wrong.
There are extremely few times where Imp EA is going to matter; 2 points in Lethality helps you all the time.
The only reason people are not 0/20/41 is poison talents, so I find this point moot. Sustained is what you're doing as ShS, you just want 20/0/41 to keep up your healing debuff, just like Warrriors go MS over Fury for PvP.
2 in Lethality is a 0.9% boost which will occasionally amount in an extra 100 damage if you crit back to back. When used, IMP EA will give you around a 9% more total damage over someone without imp EA (but with regular EA) on a target with 4k armour. Anywhere between 3k and 4k and that number increases.
I think you need to use EA more.
The only situation where EA is worth more than another finisher is when my feral druid and I are bursting on the same target. 90% of the time, that's not the case.
If you don't do s2 or 3s with another melee class, Imp EA is ****.
back to the Former,
harp is stil viable.
i know whats said but ive fought it and lost.
probably the best rogue on my server is harp.
in full s1 he got to 2k 2v2.
my BG may not be even close to the best but its still worth something.
/fire flames now.
Edited, Mar 10th 2008 5:18pm by Theolo
harp is stil viable.
i know whats said but ive fought it and lost.
probably the best rogue on my server is harp.
in full s1 he got to 2k 2v2.
my BG may not be even close to the best but its still worth something.
/fire flames now.
Edited, Mar 10th 2008 5:18pm by Theolo
Theolo wrote:
back to the Former,
harp is stil viable.
i know whats said but ive fought it and lost.
probably the best rogue on my server is harp.
in full s1 he got to 2k 2v2.
my BG may not be even close to the best but its still worth something.
/fire flames now.
Edited, Mar 10th 2008 5:18pm by Theolo
harp is stil viable.
i know whats said but ive fought it and lost.
probably the best rogue on my server is harp.
in full s1 he got to 2k 2v2.
my BG may not be even close to the best but its still worth something.
/fire flames now.
Edited, Mar 10th 2008 5:18pm by Theolo
No, no it's not.
http://www.sk-gaming.com/arena/all/us/rogue/all/all/
It's good for him that he got to 2k with s1 (which really isn't that hard in Cyclone), but it still doesn't prove anything about the viability of the spec, when a solid 50% of the rogues above 2k rating are using 20/0/41 and another 13.8% are using a ShS variant (17/0/44 or 18/0/43).
Mut is the only thing that comes close in numbers.
I think you're wildly underestimating EA.
Versus a target with 3 k armour, Imp EA will increase ALL damage (save bleeds and poison, poison is not used in PvP and Bleeds make up a tiny part of DPS if they area factor at all) by 28.42%. For ShS this is significantly superior to SnD in that it adds more damage (30% haste applies only to white damage), lasts longer (by 9 seconds) and yeah, it kicks ***. 3 k is a pretty standard number for a clothie after Serrated Blades. Ramp the persons armour up to 4k (after Serrated) and it's still a damage increase of over 25%.
For a full chart of armour penetration, check here.
(Imp EA removes 3075 armour for 5 combo points. Lazily I rounded it down to 3000 because the chart used set values).
Versus a target with 3 k armour, Imp EA will increase ALL damage (save bleeds and poison, poison is not used in PvP and Bleeds make up a tiny part of DPS if they area factor at all) by 28.42%. For ShS this is significantly superior to SnD in that it adds more damage (30% haste applies only to white damage), lasts longer (by 9 seconds) and yeah, it kicks ***. 3 k is a pretty standard number for a clothie after Serrated Blades. Ramp the persons armour up to 4k (after Serrated) and it's still a damage increase of over 25%.
For a full chart of armour penetration, check here.
(Imp EA removes 3075 armour for 5 combo points. Lazily I rounded it down to 3000 because the chart used set values).
in 2v2/rogue, your site even says that the spec of the top rogue is 33/28, Theophany.
Theolo wrote:
in 2v2/rogue, your site even says that the spec of the top rogue is 33/28, Theophany.
That's pretty old.
HARP is dead for the following very specific reason: AR is off prep. The 2nd AR represented thousands in damage in a few seconds. That fact alone was the only reason HARP did better damage than full combat. Without the second AR (since the nerf), Harp is no more than a gimped combat spec, since you are missing 10 of the strongest points in combat.
Shadowstep is stronger for reasons that I hope are obvious. Every top pvp rogue is shadowstep right, except for the few who are mutilate (some of them can't go shadowstep after bashing it so hard (Xasha called it failstep for months) if they did it would be embarrassing.)
edit: yes thats parenthesis inside parenthesis. My last English class was 12 years ago.
Edited, Mar 11th 2008 11:14pm by DrMayhem
Theolo wrote:
in 2v2/rogue, your site even says that the spec of the top rogue is 33/28, Theophany.
And then you look at the rest of the rogues, realize you're wrong, and shut the @#%^ up.
K?
He's #1 in 2v2 because he plays in Ruin and he runs with an spriest with 460 resilience, 11k hp, and 1k shadow damage.
Edited, Mar 12th 2008 12:17am by Theophany
Kavekk wrote:
poison is not used in PvP
wait.. what?
PsiChi the Fussy wrote:
Kavekk wrote:
poison is not used in PvP
wait.. what?
...
For DAMAGE poison is not used in PvP. I made that abundantly clear to anyone who has a concept of the word "context".
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