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Hybrid build, challenge to combat?Follow

#1 Feb 28 2008 at 11:49 AM Rating: Excellent
20 posts
Quick bio:
I am combat maces currently. I'd leave an armory link but 9.9 times out of 10 I log out in my PvP gear anyway.

Quick stats: Hit is about at 233, AP is about 1670, crit I think is 25% ish maybe a little under, 0 expertise.

I've been through Kara, to ZA a few times (downed the first couple bosses), just downed Gruul's for the first time last week. So, I am not a raiding expert.

OK to my point...

I've run the spreadsheet (version 2.327) with my build (11/26/24) and have found that to be the best dps for my gear. I ran the following builds:

 
             unbuffed   Raid buffed 
Build        DPS        DPS          optimal rotation 
11/26/24     715.74     1232.76      5s,5r 
20/00/41     709.12     1222.39      5r 
19/42/00     687.84     1201.60      3s,5r 
00/20/41     661.56     1182.20      3s,5s,5r 
 
I swapped out my maces for swords (both merc glad) and got this: 
11/26/24     733.79     1261.75     5s,5r 
19/42/00     711.97     1240.49     3s,5r


Conclusion seems to be:
unbuffed DPS, my build is slightly better than combat swords but well below my build with maces.
With optimal raid buff DPS, my build with swords is best with combat swords a good chunk below that and my build with maces being about 8dps below combat swords.

I know that conventional wisdom is combat swords pwns all. I'm sure there must be something that I am missing here and I'm looking for that input. It is perplexing to me that the spreadsheet comes out this way. I did use my gear, maybe when you get up to T5, T6 the combat swords exponentially get better??

Comments are appreciated. I have thick skin for a gnome, I can take it.

edit: clarification of the subject title.


Edited, Feb 28th 2008 2:53pm by Quintor
#2 Feb 28 2008 at 1:53 PM Rating: Decent
*****
13,048 posts
Can't compare. 2.3.2 killed the spec in comparison to straight combat.

With maces, you'd go 11/20/30 anyway.
#3 Feb 28 2008 at 2:43 PM Rating: Good
20 posts
I'll agree with you on 11/20/30 for straight PvE would be even better. (I like the mace spec portion for PvP so I can use this spec for both.)

But, on the 2.3 nerf to Hemo (which I'm assuming you refer to), that should be included in this spreadsheet that I used.

So, how does combat kill the Hemo spec with the numbers being displayed?
(craziest thing is full sub's numbers beating staight combat imo)


I guess what I'm looking for is the fault in this spreadsheet more so than "I am the best and you suxors!" if combat is truly king.
#4 Feb 28 2008 at 3:41 PM Rating: Default
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13,048 posts
There's definitely something off about your numbers if 20/0/41 is putting out better DPS than combat.
#5 Feb 28 2008 at 3:45 PM Rating: Decent
I respec back and forth from Combat and Sub for PVE and PVP respectively one day my guild was running Kara for some badges and I decided to just go full sub since it was just Kara.

To my surprise my dps was still amazing and my AP was much higher because of the Sub talent points. I just blew it off as luck but it still made me think...
My hemo's were hitting just as hard as my SS and were using much less energy and it seemed that my CP generation was much faster keeping my SND up longer..
#6 Feb 28 2008 at 4:02 PM Rating: Good
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2,029 posts
The spreadsheet assumed every tick of hemo is used and adds that damage into the total damage output, if I'm not mistaken.

And on another note, going 30 into Sub with a tri-spec hemo build isn't going to do more damage than picking up Swords and Weapon Expertise. That extra 200-ish AP is not going to outdo 10 expertise (~40 rating), the extra ability to pop with Bloodlust/trinkets, and a straight 5% damage increase from Swords.
EDIT: Realized you were talking maces, in which case I don't know what I'm talking about so won't say which is better.

Edited, Feb 28th 2008 6:06pm by lsfreak
#7 Feb 28 2008 at 4:36 PM Rating: Good
20 posts
Quote:
lsfreak wrote:
The spreadsheet assumed every tick of hemo is used and adds that damage into the total damage output, if I'm not mistaken.



Thank you, I can now rest easier!
I saw the option for "Include Hemo Debuff DPS Estimate?" and my thought was, of course I want to include that! I was not thinking it was actually including the damage from every tick onto my DPS. That drops the DPS by 100 and falls in line with what I assumed I would find.

Thanks

#8 Feb 28 2008 at 5:24 PM Rating: Decent
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169 posts
You also didn't do 20/41/0.
#9 Feb 28 2008 at 7:09 PM Rating: Default
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13,048 posts
lsfreak wrote:
And on another note, going 30 into Sub with a tri-spec hemo build isn't going to do more damage than picking up Swords and Weapon Expertise.

Hi, I said "with maces".

You're dumb.
#10 Feb 28 2008 at 11:13 PM Rating: Good
*
74 posts
Quote:
The spreadsheet assumed every tick of hemo is used and adds that damage into the total damage output, if I'm not mistaken.

And on another note, going 30 into Sub with a tri-spec hemo build isn't going to do more damage than picking up Swords and Weapon Expertise. That extra 200-ish AP is not going to outdo 10 expertise (~40 rating), the extra ability to pop with Bloodlust/trinkets, and a straight 5% damage increase from Swords.
EDIT: Realized you were talking maces, in which case I don't know what I'm talking about so won't say which is better.

Edited, Feb 28th 2008 6:06pm by lsfreak


Quote:
Edited, Feb 28th 2008 6:06pm by lsfreak


Quote:
Hi, I said "with maces".

You're dumb.

Posted: Feb 28th 2008 7:09pm


I know you've got an edgy reputation to maintain or whatever, but ignoring an edit is just pathetic. Rate down.
#11 Mar 01 2008 at 1:15 PM Rating: Excellent
beardownmanup wrote:
Quote:
The spreadsheet assumed every tick of hemo is used and adds that damage into the total damage output, if I'm not mistaken.

And on another note, going 30 into Sub with a tri-spec hemo build isn't going to do more damage than picking up Swords and Weapon Expertise. That extra 200-ish AP is not going to outdo 10 expertise (~40 rating), the extra ability to pop with Bloodlust/trinkets, and a straight 5% damage increase from Swords.
EDIT: Realized you were talking maces, in which case I don't know what I'm talking about so won't say which is better.

Edited, Feb 28th 2008 6:06pm by lsfreak


Quote:
Edited, Feb 28th 2008 6:06pm by lsfreak


Quote:
Hi, I said "with maces".

You're dumb.

Posted: Feb 28th 2008 7:09pm


I know you've got an edgy reputation to maintain or whatever, but ignoring an edit is just pathetic. Rate down.


Quoting and bumping for lolage.
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