Is **** too EZ to get now?Follow

While things are easier to get an epics certainly don't have the same meaning anymore...

I don't see that as a bad thing.

I don't understand the jealous mindset of 'Oh noes! Anybody can get my gear now!'.

Now I'm both a raider, and despite my class choice, I try to be a serious pvper as well.

In pvp, if anything, it has helped level to playing field.

In pve, it means you can't get into the interesting content faster and skip the 'gearing up' process.

The 'it creates' bad player argument is funny... don't recruit them in your guild/arena team. And if you're fighting them, just take the free points.

Edited, Feb 21st 2008 1:15pm by Tyrandor

Yes, well... you're a bad raider. I want you to turn in your membership card by the end of the day. EDIT: And really, it's been said before but "QQ, I'm a Rogue and everybody is means to me in PvP" has moved beyond 'trite' to 'boring' months ago.

More specifically, there used to be a real sense of loot progression. ZG and AQ20 had some gear that was better (or equal to) MC quality, but that was really as far as you got. You'd do level 60 instances to gear for UBRS to gear for MC (or 20-mans, once they came out) to gear for BWL to gear for AQ40 to gear for Naxxramas. There wasn't really a way to... I guess 'short-circuit' that progression. For better or for worse, people were still running Molten Core as a serious raid up until 1.12 came out.

1.12 (and most of TBC) changed everything. Whereas before you ran PvE content (and, by and large, didn't skip PvE content) to gear up for more PvE, now you can run PvP to short-circuit the PvE progression and skip up several levels. There's definitely some advantages to that... new players gear up considerably faster, as do alts, and people can progress more easily though some of the, uh, less well designed PvE instances. The march of the Badge gear serves much the same purpose as the easily-obtained PvP gear - giving people a significant 'leg up' for gearing and making the PvE progression chart more or less obsolete.

There's some disadvantages too, though. Seeing gear you worked extremely hard to acquire turn into something you can pick up for 30 badges and five gold can be frustrating. So, too, does feeling the compulsion to do both PvE and PvP even if it's not your forté; it's one thing to do both and mix and match to gear up faster, it's quite another to feel that even at the very end of PvE progression your gear is inferior unless you PvP (*cough* weapons *cough*).

I don't personally think the 'gear = obsolete/easy' question is as valid as needing high-end PvP gear to do high-end PvE, any more than if you needed high-end PvE gear to do high-end PvP. It's about as imbalanced as if they made the reward for killing Illidan a free belt enchant that gave you 100 resilience and a 25% chance to resist fears; it's a significant upgrade that requires you to invest in a different sphere of gameplay and to succeed in it to get back to what really interests you. That's something that's better solved by tweaking the weapons (103 DPS -> 100 DPS for S3, for example) than it is by just destroying the two systems, though.

Anyway... when Blizzard makes changes to help push progression along, the high-end raiders aren't really hurt that much. The people who are most 'hurt' (pissed off, more like) by the improvements to, say, PvE badge gear are people who are behind in progression but advancing. For a guild that's spent the time, effort and energy to complete the BT/Hyjal attunements just before the patch hits, their achievements are made somewhat worthless. They're the ones who will suffer most from equivalent gear being available from badges or PvP, and they're the ones who will be lashing out the most.

As for me, I'm just happy we don't have to bother attuning recruits anymore.

No! No... no, no... no... well, yes. What I was getting at more was that you're at the 'key point' in progression where your best option is to mix and match T5 and S3 options to gear up more quickly. You have the biggest benefit from this. It qualifies you to speak as someone on the dole, not someone who's moved off welfare. =p

Gryph, until you're sitting there in full epics at the edge of progression, you really can't talk about stuff being "easy".

No not easy for me particularly, I'm simply comparing what people at that level of epic-ness have stated that they have to do to get stuff now compared to what they had to do to get stuff pre-TBC.

You know good and well I ain't talking about me. You hear me complaining about having to BGs to get weapons dont cha? LOL. Hell I'm the guy whose to lazy to use the welfare that he's given. I just want blizzard to ask me for a monthly list of stuff that I want...and then bulk mail it to me!

Exalted with all factions...CHECK
Full S4 ahead of schedule...CHECK
Full T10 from soloing Sargeras naked with a fishing pole....ROTF! DEFINITELY CHECK


Do you disagree with the logic behind the question? Or simply the status of the questioner? Sounds like the latter...


That's why I asked the community and didn't get on here saying..."ZOMG!!!111!!1 WoW is EZMODE come get ur frEE PURPLZ and ORANGZ from teh ICE CREAM MAN!!!!!"


or something like that

Edited, Feb 21st 2008 4:29pm by shadowgryph

Edited, Feb 21st 2008 4:41pm by shadowgryph

Edited, Feb 21st 2008 4:41pm by shadowgryph

All the stuff that's worthwhile now isn't free.

Sure you can get 4/5 S3 and have S2 weapons, but that's not that good.

If it were still like S2 where there's no rating limit on weapons and shoulders, I'd say yeah, stuff is handed out too easily. Because most of the people last season that got S2 weapons didn't deserve them, because they could just save up a few points and boom, they had weapons.