Plate or Hex?Follow

so a 5% crit aura for spells or melee is a worse buff than aspect of the wild?

that is possibly the most random buff ever, obv its good in a nature damamge enviroment though!

have an emo day!

Can you not see the inherent flaws in your own logic here?

You're getting constant invites from a guildy. Why? Because you're a Shaman? Because you're just that good? Or because you're a guildy? And he always makes sure he's got two other CC's. What if you don't have those CC? If one or both of the other two DPS'ers can't CC, are they going to take a Shaman along just because he's a Shaman? Is there anything about a Shaman specifically that you are being invited for or are you just... being invited?

Try looking at it from another angle. Imagine you're playing a tank. Or a healer. Imagine you're not geared to the nines and you need to pug a heroic group. Imagine there is a piece of gear on the last boss of that heroic, a piece of gear which you have been trying forever to get and really want/need because it's a huge upgrade for you, so if you don't make it all the way through then the entire run and a couple hours of your night are a total wash.

How are you going to build your party? Are you going to give yourself the best chance possible by grabbing three DPS with CC applicable to the instance, or are you just... going to grab the first three DPS you can and run with it? Which would you rather have? A little more damage and threat from Windfury or a mob taken out of the fight?

I don't need to hear your answer. If you're going to be completely honest about it I think we all know what anyone's answer would be.


And I'm not expecting it to. I was talking about PvP. Shaman buff too well to be given CC on par with other classes because then there would be no reason to take anything but Shaman to heroics. It's just unfortunate that as things stand right now, CC > buffs no matter how good they are. The only other option would be to change heroics to make them easier and less-reliant on CC.

If you disagree then just get over it, because those are the facts.

Right. I'm the only Shaman who's ever experienced trouble getting into and/or through heroics when DPS specced.

Gaudion I really think your a jerk and all but i have to come to your aid right now, look at big's reputations, not passed honored with anything and thinks he knows what he is talking about =P

When did I say that?
My post must have been confusing if you got it like that. What I said is that druids'/shamans'/paladins' buffs are better than hunters'/mages'/rogues'/warlocks'.
For example:
Moonkin aura+mark of the wild is better (objectively, it of course depends on the group composition) than aspect of the wild+trueshot aura.




You probably misread my post then, I only addressed the PvE issue here.
I do agree that shamans have no CC for PvP, but I have little knowledge on PvP and therefore I can't say anything I feel comfortable with about this subject.

Have a nice day,
Yuval.

DPS Warriors are in the same situation, Utarius. As are Balance and DPS Feral Druids (lawl), Ret Pallies, etc... There are many who feel your pain. It's not that none of these specs aren't good; they are. All of them are great in Kara (after CC reqs there are met) and 25-man content where the actual value of your DPS and buffs become important. But you still don't bring a wooden spoon to a gunfight no matter how great it is or how much you love it.

Heroics are all about CC unless--and this is a huge unless--your tank is geared enough that he can tank multiple heroic mobs and your healer is geared enough to keep him alive for the duration thereof. And I guarantee you that the gear required to reach that level is not going to be found in any manner of pre-heroic content.

Like I said, you don't even have to take my word for it. Put yourself in the shoes of someone else looking to run a heroic. Would you invite a DPS Shaman? I sure as hell wouldn't unless there was absolutely nothing else seeking. I don't even want to hear what his gear is or how much DPS he can put out. I don't care. My role as a healer takes priority over anything else, and as much as I'd like to take him along, I know we've got a better chance of success with more CC at our disposal.

Draenie ele shaman raid fine but you need to pop mana pots when your under geared, and you need a tank that pays attention quite a bit.

Was top DPS in my ZA but had a geared pally tank and good heals too ( I tanked several pulls but only had a 2g repair bill for the night lol 0 deaths in a ZA ftw)

For kara I think having a dps shaman is great, shaman pumps out tons of damage and increases those in his group quite a bit.

We do have some mana issues, but as you gear up I promise you it gets better, i can now throw Chain Lightning into my spell rotation with no issue on Prince.

I will also say, I am very much over geared for kara in my pve gear pushing 40% crit and 1100 spell dmg fully buffed.

I will go as far saying we fit better in 10 mans then we do in 5 mans, and having us present for a melee or caster group is big, 100 spell damage and 50mana/5 seconds and if ele spec 3 hit and crit is big, and the AP and crit shaman provide to melee dps is amazing, if you totem twist it only gets better for the rogues and or warriors in your group.

Now in Heroics since many people really aren't ready for them, having 3 CC I can see being somewhat important.

Shaman are great, but I wouldn't say you're gimping yourself if you don't take DPS Shaman for buffs. Most encounters past 25-man content you don't really want more than a small handful of melee DPS, like 3-4 at the absolute max. A full five-man melee DPS group is really pushing it. Typically you're going to see the Enhancement Shaman slotted into a group with two tanks and two other melee DPS, or some small variation thereof. There isn't just going to be "Group 3 is melee DPS" running around.

Casters, again... Ranged DPS is typically going to want to spread out as much as possible. It's not like four other people are going to get the constant benefit of WoA and ToW.

That goes back to the conversation (see also: argument) I was having the other day concerning Shaman vs. Rogues in raids. It's presumptious to assume that as a DPS Shaman you're always going to be slotted into a custom-made group where you're going to be buffing four other people through the roof and that's going to be all there is to it.

On trash, sure... that may indeed be all there is to it, but boss battles are really complex later on and very unforgiveng. Your standard-issue "tank and spank" scenarios are so rare they're practically non-existent.

Again, I'm not trying to say that Shaman are in any way deficient for 25-man content, but you can't always assume they're going to be in there buffing with four other melee or caster DPS.

In 25 mans, I'm usually in a group with *shudder* 3 rogues and a feral druid OT. My battle shout and the druid's LotP do a great job of buffing the rogues, but I would really love for our shammy to gear up some more and replace one of the rogues.... But then I'd miss out on all those rogue buffs o.O

Oh yea, I hope you get hex sometime in the near future. Out of all my alts, I hate that my shaman has no cc, stun, root or charge-type attack.