What do you guys prefer to do on your mage, PVP or raid? and if so why? I find raiding on my mage boring :(. He is my second 70 so my main goal was to level him fast. I've done a few bg's with him but nothing like my rogue. I guess what I am looking for is if you find PVPing alot more fun then raiding? Or raiding over PVP'ing?
Thanx
XpReSS
- Forums
- World of Warcraft
- Class Discussion
- What do you prefer?
What do you prefer?Follow
raiding by far, it seems so much more fun to be with 24 other people progressing through somewhat of a storyline and taking on legendary figures in WoW lore, that and seeing all of the cool loot that the bosses drop. It is fun to learn new strategies and see how my guild adapts to them to make them work for us.
I think that PVP as mage is probably the hardest straight forward PVP in the game.
Our gear has next to no defense, if anything touches you - you're probably doing something wrong, and your survival is dependant on not taking damage while dealing massive damage to someone who likely is able to take a fair amount of damage (or they have a pet to take the damage).
Locks and Hunters have pets
Priest, Pally, Shamen, Druids can heal
Warriors and Pally can take big DPS
Mage only has CC and DPS.
Thus I like PVE. (Though I rolled PVP server cause PVE servers don't have the excitement of getting killed by a guy 25lvls above you...)
Our gear has next to no defense, if anything touches you - you're probably doing something wrong, and your survival is dependant on not taking damage while dealing massive damage to someone who likely is able to take a fair amount of damage (or they have a pet to take the damage).
Locks and Hunters have pets
Priest, Pally, Shamen, Druids can heal
Warriors and Pally can take big DPS
Mage only has CC and DPS.
Thus I like PVE. (Though I rolled PVP server cause PVE servers don't have the excitement of getting killed by a guy 25lvls above you...)
Raiding...Working together with 24 other people is so incredibly fun!
Oh and I HATE PvP...period
raiding rocks!
Oh and I HATE PvP...period
raiding rocks!
Borsuk wrote:
I think that PVP as mage is probably the hardest straight forward PVP in the game.
Our gear has next to no defense, if anything touches you - you're probably doing something wrong, and your survival is dependant on not taking damage while dealing massive damage to someone who likely is able to take a fair amount of damage (or they have a pet to take the damage).
Locks and Hunters have pets
Priest, Pally, Shamen, Druids can heal
Warriors and Pally can take big DPS
Mage only has CC and DPS.
Our gear has next to no defense, if anything touches you - you're probably doing something wrong, and your survival is dependant on not taking damage while dealing massive damage to someone who likely is able to take a fair amount of damage (or they have a pet to take the damage).
Locks and Hunters have pets
Priest, Pally, Shamen, Druids can heal
Warriors and Pally can take big DPS
Mage only has CC and DPS.
I dislike PvP in a game that has things other than PvP, but every once in a while when I wake up at 3AM and have a sudden urge to do WSG, I do decent-to-great on my Fire Mage. I know it's not Arena where everyone has awesome gear and PvP specs, and that's why I like it. It's more casual PvP.
Anyway, I do win duels with moderate PvP skill, because the mage is not broken, it could just stand for a little buffing. Mages have plenty of defensive moves, which is why they lack statistical defense. They can burst and control, and controlling IS defense.
PvP > all 'nuff said.
And that's coming from a guy who did up to AQ40 and dipped into Naxx. To be honest I find hitting an unintelligent thing which is completly unable to react to anything I do to be incredibly boring - I really prefer to play something competetive, against someone who can actually think, who'll react to what I do, and who will keep surprising me by pull new tricks out of their sleeves. Unfortunatly this kind of PvP is only found in arenas (Thanks for the honor and the x-server bgs changes - more tards to the BGs).
Oh and I would just like to add - some classes are easy to LEARN to PvP with, but all classes are hard to master - mage is definatly not the worst - then you've never tried to play a feral druid.
Edited, Feb 12th 2008 5:23pm by krqllebqlle
And that's coming from a guy who did up to AQ40 and dipped into Naxx. To be honest I find hitting an unintelligent thing which is completly unable to react to anything I do to be incredibly boring - I really prefer to play something competetive, against someone who can actually think, who'll react to what I do, and who will keep surprising me by pull new tricks out of their sleeves. Unfortunatly this kind of PvP is only found in arenas (Thanks for the honor and the x-server bgs changes - more tards to the BGs).
Oh and I would just like to add - some classes are easy to LEARN to PvP with, but all classes are hard to master - mage is definatly not the worst - then you've never tried to play a feral druid.
Edited, Feb 12th 2008 5:23pm by krqllebqlle
compgenius wrote:
Raiding...Working together with 24 other people is so incredibly fun!
Oh and I HATE PvP...period
raiding rocks!
Oh and I HATE PvP...period
raiding rocks!
This.
PvP fo sho. To me thats what the game has always been about, gearing up and getting skilled enough to beat real people.
Its just to easy too kill computers, because you know exactly what there gonna do, while pvp tests your reflexes and problem solving ability, all while under pressure.
mage is the most fun class to pvp with once you get it imo. There are many that are easier, but none more enjoyable than the glass cannon.
Not to say that PvE isn't fun, but laying the smackdown on someone will always be more fun than watching some very large boss die after basically spamming one spell for 15 mins.
Its just to easy too kill computers, because you know exactly what there gonna do, while pvp tests your reflexes and problem solving ability, all while under pressure.
mage is the most fun class to pvp with once you get it imo. There are many that are easier, but none more enjoyable than the glass cannon.
Not to say that PvE isn't fun, but laying the smackdown on someone will always be more fun than watching some very large boss die after basically spamming one spell for 15 mins.
Gohanian wrote:
PvP fo sho. To me thats what the game has always been about, gearing up and getting skilled enough to beat real people.
Its just to easy too kill computers, because you know exactly what there gonna do, while pvp tests your reflexes and problem solving ability, all while under pressure.
mage is the most fun class to pvp with once you get it imo. There are many that are easier, but none more enjoyable than the glass cannon.
Not to say that PvE isn't fun, but laying the smackdown on someone will always be more fun than watching some very large boss die after basically spamming one spell for 15 mins.
Its just to easy too kill computers, because you know exactly what there gonna do, while pvp tests your reflexes and problem solving ability, all while under pressure.
mage is the most fun class to pvp with once you get it imo. There are many that are easier, but none more enjoyable than the glass cannon.
Not to say that PvE isn't fun, but laying the smackdown on someone will always be more fun than watching some very large boss die after basically spamming one spell for 15 mins.
that aspect of single target spamming is limited to only certain fights, most fights, at least post-bc have a lot of movement, and cooperation that is required, sitting there spamming a single button will most likely get you killed.
Well I took my mage into kara for the first time and it was alot of fun! Is there a build that would do ok for both I dont see my mage going past gruulz, At least any time soon. I lvl'd frost and went to fire when I hit 69ish. I might try the pom pryo for a bit I guess. I cant imagine how it is to raid SSC on this guy, I love it on my rogue though.. It seems like its alot harder then it would be for a caster. Thank you all for your inputs. Im just kinda getting bored with the game and wanted to try something new out. I get killed in the bg's, But then again I leveled this guy fast and didnt spend much time in them at lower lvl's.
XpReSS
XpReSS
Although I've never played BG or Arena, or been in a raid before, I have to say I enjoy both PvE and PvP, but I enjoy PvE more. I know that when I hit 70 (my mage is 63) and make my Frozen Shadoweave I'm going to raid (as much as I can), both instances and real raids, more than anything else, but I really wanna try out BG and Arena.
Edit: PvP is very fun, but I know I could easily get tired of it after a few battles (which is why BG seems very intriguing to me; it's more than just fighting people). For some reason, I can almost never get tired of PvE (the only instance I've ever got sick of thus far is Mara, and perhaps UB).
Edited, Feb 15th 2008 4:32pm by PsydonX
Edit: PvP is very fun, but I know I could easily get tired of it after a few battles (which is why BG seems very intriguing to me; it's more than just fighting people). For some reason, I can almost never get tired of PvE (the only instance I've ever got sick of thus far is Mara, and perhaps UB).
Edited, Feb 15th 2008 4:32pm by PsydonX
Dailies + farming primals + no life = both
PVP all the way. Till we get smarter AI...
Both.
But I miss old world fire pvp ;-;
But I miss old world fire pvp ;-;
Quote:
that aspect of single target spamming is limited to only certain fights, most fights, at least post-bc have a lot of movement, and cooperation that is required, sitting there spamming a single button will most likely get you killed.
This is true, and you may note that I qualified what I said with a 'basically'. Generally if your not spending most of your time on a boss casting your nuking spell your doing something wrong. I wont argue that PvE is not fun, nor that its not challenging in its own way, but it just doesn't compare to pvp.
You seriously can't believe that it requires more understanding of the game and its mechanics, your own classes strenghts/weaknesses, or greater reflexes, to pve than to pvp.
PvP FTW!
PsydonX wrote:
Edit: PvP is very fun, but I know I could easily get tired of it after a few battles (which is why BG seems very intriguing to me; it's more than just fighting people). For some reason, I can almost never get tired of PvE (the only instance I've ever got sick of thus far is Mara, and perhaps UB)
/agree
Gohanian wrote:
You seriously can't believe that it requires more understanding of the game and its mechanics, your own classes strenghts/weaknesses, or greater reflexes, to pve than to pvp.
The topic of debate was the fun factor, not the intensity factor.
Anobix had said
Anobix wrote:
it seems so much more fun to be with 24 other people progressing through somewhat of a storyline and taking on legendary figures in WoW lore, that and seeing all of the cool loot that the bosses drop. It is fun to learn new strategies and see how my guild adapts to them to make them work for us.
The competitive "better-than-you" spirit is not everyone's cup of tea, contrary to popular belief (and I'm not just saying that-- it's popular belief that competition is what everyone wants to do.)
And actually, I'd say that understanding of game mechanics is on par between PvE and PvP. Knowing how AI works is a game mechanic-- judging your opponent's reaction is logic and experience.
Quote:
The topic of debate was the fun factor, not the intensity factor.
I'm not arguing that pvp is more intense, in fact I would say that an AoE pull of 20+ is just as intense as any experience in pvp. Just saying that I personally have more fun when the games I play challenge me, and PvP is a challenge without end, while the PvE aspect of the game is more finite.
Quote:
And actually, I'd say that understanding of game mechanics is on par between PvE and PvP. Knowing how AI works is a game mechanic-- judging your opponent's reaction is logic and experience.
This is true to an extent, and as I have said before endgame PvE is certanly challenging, but the AI will allways do the same thing every time, and a human is not as predictable ( more fun to fight).
Quote:
The competitive "better-than-you" spirit is not everyone's cup of tea, contrary to popular belief (and I'm not just saying that-- it's popular belief that competition is what everyone wants to do.)
the spirit of competition is something you can't deny my friend, the constant struggle between people is what makes life interesting.
I'm sure even you Raglu, tealess, feel satasfied when you best someone in a duel.
Just to clarify, the previous statements are opinion only and not based on rigorous science.
Gohanian wrote:
Quote:
The topic of debate was the fun factor, not the intensity factor.
I'm not arguing that pvp is more intense, in fact I would say that an AoE pull of 20+ is just as intense as any experience in pvp. Just saying that I personally have more fun when the games I play challenge me, and PvP is a challenge without end, while the PvE aspect of the game is more finite.
Quote:
And actually, I'd say that understanding of game mechanics is on par between PvE and PvP. Knowing how AI works is a game mechanic-- judging your opponent's reaction is logic and experience.
This is true to an extent, and as I have said before endgame PvE is certanly challenging, but the AI will allways do the same thing every time, and a human is not as predictable ( more fun to fight).
Quote:
The competitive "better-than-you" spirit is not everyone's cup of tea, contrary to popular belief (and I'm not just saying that-- it's popular belief that competition is what everyone wants to do.)
the spirit of competition is something you can't deny my friend, the constant struggle between people is what makes life interesting.
I'm sure even you Raglu, tealess, feel satasfied when you best someone in a duel.
Just to clarify, the previous statements are opinion only and not based on rigorous science.
just to note on a few things:
Plenty of PvE fights have very random factors (random targeting/aoes/kiting/etc) that must be attended to or else the entire raid will wipe (check out fights like Vashj/Kael'thas/Gurtogg Bloodboil and others where you have to know your mechanics, the bosses mechanics, and be able to be at the top of your game for 10-15 minutes straight (for one fight) not like in PvP where most fights are over in less than 2 minutes. I'm willing to bet that there is more study of the class-mechanics in PvE than there is in PvP, just check out the forums at EJ (ElitistJerks) to get an idea.
Also, there is plenty of competiton in PvE. Just check out wowjutsu to see how the guilds earn points/are ranked and move up and down depending on who they downed and when, it becomes a progression-race for that matter.
Do I enjoy PvP -- sure, it has its moments, but it turns into a grind of the same 4 places (7 if you include arenas) where you can't say that it isn't almost the same every time. You almost always see the same basic strategy in all of the battlegrounds and most people know how to counter it if they have proper communication and teamwork. Arenas is a bit different, although more and more cookie-cutter arena team builds are coming out that it becomes obvious what will happen here or there as well.
Alright, it seems like this thread has turned from which you prefer [pve or pvp] to which is better, and thats an argument with no winner, as we all have 100 different criteria and we all are gonna value them differently.
So ill keep this brief and address one thing
You seem to be arguing that PvE is more variable than PvP, and to me, thats just false. You say that each bg is almost the same every time, well the thing is that each boss fight, and to a lesser extent every single pull in the game is EXACTLY THE SAME EVERY SINGLE TIME, the only variable being the setup of your group.
Then you go on to say something funny, "You almost always see the same basic strategy in all of the battlegrounds and most people know how to counter it if they have proper communication and teamwork." so... since everyone knows how to counter everyones strategy, since terrain and objectives remain constant... what happens when you have 2 teams with proper communication and teamwork?
FUN HAPPENS.
ty and g'night
So ill keep this brief and address one thing
Quote:
Do I enjoy PvP -- sure, it has its moments, but it turns into a grind of the same 4 places (7 if you include arenas) where you can't say that it isn't almost the same every time. You almost always see the same basic strategy in all of the battlegrounds and most people know how to counter it if they have proper communication and teamwork. Arenas is a bit different, although more and more cookie-cutter arena team builds are coming out that it becomes obvious what will happen here or there as well.
You seem to be arguing that PvE is more variable than PvP, and to me, thats just false. You say that each bg is almost the same every time, well the thing is that each boss fight, and to a lesser extent every single pull in the game is EXACTLY THE SAME EVERY SINGLE TIME, the only variable being the setup of your group.
Then you go on to say something funny, "You almost always see the same basic strategy in all of the battlegrounds and most people know how to counter it if they have proper communication and teamwork." so... since everyone knows how to counter everyones strategy, since terrain and objectives remain constant... what happens when you have 2 teams with proper communication and teamwork?
FUN HAPPENS.
ty and g'night
Gohanian wrote:
Alright, it seems like this thread has turned from which you prefer [pve or pvp] to which is better, and thats an argument with no winner, as we all have 100 different criteria and we all are gonna value them differently.
So ill keep this brief and address one thing
You seem to be arguing that PvE is more variable than PvP, and to me, thats just false. You say that each bg is almost the same every time, well the thing is that each boss fight, and to a lesser extent every single pull in the game is EXACTLY THE SAME EVERY SINGLE TIME, the only variable being the setup of your group.
Then you go on to say something funny, "You almost always see the same basic strategy in all of the battlegrounds and most people know how to counter it if they have proper communication and teamwork." so... since everyone knows how to counter everyones strategy, since terrain and objectives remain constant... what happens when you have 2 teams with proper communication and teamwork?
FUN HAPPENS.
ty and g'night
So ill keep this brief and address one thing
Quote:
Do I enjoy PvP -- sure, it has its moments, but it turns into a grind of the same 4 places (7 if you include arenas) where you can't say that it isn't almost the same every time. You almost always see the same basic strategy in all of the battlegrounds and most people know how to counter it if they have proper communication and teamwork. Arenas is a bit different, although more and more cookie-cutter arena team builds are coming out that it becomes obvious what will happen here or there as well.
You seem to be arguing that PvE is more variable than PvP, and to me, thats just false. You say that each bg is almost the same every time, well the thing is that each boss fight, and to a lesser extent every single pull in the game is EXACTLY THE SAME EVERY SINGLE TIME, the only variable being the setup of your group.
Then you go on to say something funny, "You almost always see the same basic strategy in all of the battlegrounds and most people know how to counter it if they have proper communication and teamwork." so... since everyone knows how to counter everyones strategy, since terrain and objectives remain constant... what happens when you have 2 teams with proper communication and teamwork?
FUN HAPPENS.
ty and g'night
I never said that it was more variable than PvP, I just said that PvE is not a constant, there are random elements to fights that cannot be planned for, most fights are not standard tank and spank fights.
When you have 2 teams with proper communication and teamwork (depending on the battleground) it can turn into an hour-long match (just think of WSG where it becomes a turtle fest)
Quote:
When you have 2 teams with proper communication and teamwork (depending on the battleground) it can turn into an hour-long match (just think of WSG where it becomes a turtle fest)
Aha! the heart of the issue, you have been pvping with incompetent people!
Think to yourself, when was the last time you pugged any endgame instance and made anything resembling good progress. Now, imagine pvping with 1-14 of your buddies, who you know you can count on to be doing what they need to be doing, all of you coordinated on vent, against another premade (and to a lesser extent pugs). You wont see 'turtle fests' too often, and each bg or arena becomes a completely unique game of chess, and unlike fights in a pve setting, you cant get too caught up with plans, everyone needs to be acting in the moment to bring forward victory.
Also it seems like a lot of your enjoyment Anobix is coming from your ongoing progression through the endgame content. Unfortunately (fortunately?) I'm in a guild which has Illidan on farm, so I don't have that same feeling of progressing toward a goal. Yes, sunwell is coming out, and I'm sure more instances after that, but at this point they just feel like more fights to 'learn' while we wipe a lot and spend an assload on consumables. But hey, thats just me, and it sounds like I'm closer to how the op feels about it, but obviously your not alone in your thinking either.
And you keep saying that there are 'random elements' to fights, when to me, once you know they're coming, they are totally predictable and dealing with them becomes second nature. sure its 'random' where that aoe dmg spot is gonna be, but that doesn't make it hard to run out of it ;P.
Gohanian wrote:
Quote:
When you have 2 teams with proper communication and teamwork (depending on the battleground) it can turn into an hour-long match (just think of WSG where it becomes a turtle fest)
Aha! the heart of the issue, you have been pvping with incompetent people!
Think to yourself, when was the last time you pugged any endgame instance and made anything resembling good progress. Now, imagine pvping with 1-14 of your buddies, who you know you can count on to be doing what they need to be doing, all of you coordinated on vent, against another premade (and to a lesser extent pugs). You wont see 'turtle fests' too often, and each bg or arena becomes a completely unique game of chess, and unlike fights in a pve setting, you cant get too caught up with plans, everyone needs to be acting in the moment to bring forward victory.
Also it seems like a lot of your enjoyment Anobix is coming from your ongoing progression through the endgame content. Unfortunately (fortunately?) I'm in a guild which has Illidan on farm, so I don't have that same feeling of progressing toward a goal. Yes, sunwell is coming out, and I'm sure more instances after that, but at this point they just feel like more fights to 'learn' while we wipe a lot and spend an assload on consumables. But hey, thats just me, and it sounds like I'm closer to how the op feels about it, but obviously your not alone in your thinking either.
And you keep saying that there are 'random elements' to fights, when to me, once you know they're coming, they are totally predictable and dealing with them becomes second nature. sure its 'random' where that aoe dmg spot is gonna be, but that doesn't make it hard to run out of it ;P.
that was the exact type of post that I was looking for. I haven't been in a good premade since when I was doing the grind for hwl gear at 60 (had a group of about 30 or so people and we did pre-made AVs)... although that came down to very little pvp and just steamrolling and everyone knowing what they need to do and how to do it.
I understand what you mean though, each game (Especially areanas) can be like a game of chess, where PvE ends up being who can buff up the most and use the most consumables (good god so many pots/flasks/etc...) but I am in the situation of starting MH/BT this coming (or next week) once we get more people attuned for them.
Recent Visitors: 301
All times are in CST
Anonymous Guests (301)
- Forums
- World of Warcraft
- Class Discussion
- What do you prefer?
© 2024 Fanbyte LLC