CapJack of the Seven Seas wrote:
I decided to continue to crunch the numbers, and I'm still not seeing it Ialaman
here's what I found when calculate damage, including block after the mitigated damage, tell me if I messed up somewhere here:
Formulas
DR: Same as I linked above.
Damage Taken = 3500(1-DR)
Damage Taken after Blocking = Damage Taken - 500
Damage Reduced = (3500 - Damage Taken after Blocking)
DPS Reduced by last 5k = (Damage Reduced - Previous Damage Reduced)
%Reduced by last 5k = (DPS Reduced by last 5k/Damage Taken from Prev 5k)
My numbers still show diminishing returns with more armor even with block figured in.
Your numbers in your final column seem to be a bit off. They should be:
37.50%
30.81%
27.10%
25.01%
23.97%
23.76%
Now I will admit that I used some poor wording when I said the scaling of armor. I had intended to say the stacking of armor, because as you can see, while there is a diminishing value per 5k armor added, it still is a very significant and worthwhile percentage.
While the amounts it adds are debatable, there is one thing that all sides have agreed on. It DOES decrease the damage you take. Keep in mind that we are comparing talents against Redoubt.
In boss tanking gear with full buffs and holy shield up I am currently at just over 106% avoidance, completely uncrushable short of a stun. No boss mob in game (that can crush) will eat through those charges before the buff duration is over. Therefore going from 106% uncrushable to 136% uncrushable by adding 30% block is going to be 0 value, because that extra 30% will never come in to play.
So if it's worthless during bosses, what else is there? Well there's raid trash, which can eat through holy shield depending on how many mobs you're tanking. Of course, trash can't crush, so uncrushability isn't as much of a factor, and as I said before, I'm at 90% miss/dodge/parry/block base, so there's only 10% of attacks that are landing as hits anyways. Redoubt, IF it's up, will only add the block value in terms of damage mitigation, as well as the shield spike damage, because if holy shield is up redoubt (as with bosses) will never have an impact due to uncrushability status. While this might sound nice, you also have to keep in mind that since I personally run with 40% block chance in my trash mob set, only 1 out of every 5 blocked attacks while redoubt is up will actually be DUE to redoubt being up. (this means that there will be times when redoubt procs and is used up without having prevented any extra attacks). Basically, per redoubt proc, it will block 0.8 extra attacks. For 5 talent points, that's not much, and the damage mitigation it would provide is actually INFERIOR to improved devotion aura.
So if it's not useless in any raid situation once you surpass a certain gear level, we come to your example of gearing down for 5-mans. I won't even bother trying to argue this point but will simply say, if you want to spend 5 points for a talent that may be useful when you to back to trivial content, by all means, go right ahead.
I said it before, but I'll repeat it again. Redoubt is great when leveling. Redoubt is good for gearing up and entering raiding. However, there is an undeniable point where redoubt will never have a noticeable impact on any group, but we are still forced to take it for Shield Specialization. At high end gear levels you are forced to spend 5 talent points on something that will never benefit you.