Hold me!Follow

You know, you leave for a few months and things change. You come back and you think "OK things change". You stick around for a while and you realize that change isn't always good.

When I was here for prot advice there was no CapJack, there was Thels and Gaudion. Players who'd studied and extended their class and were at the edge of the game. (I wonder if it's telling that they're gone now. I don't know what happened to Thels but Gaudion rolled another hybrid class and was disillusioned and is now levelling a priest) They were no carebears. It was "ask a decent question and we'll give you an answer" it was "post your build (no armory then) and we'll try to help otherwise we can't be ****** you tool".

No one had Thels' or Gaudion's **** wedged firmly in their mouths. There were no fanbois there were expectations. You had to go some way to at least attempt to understand your class (like reading the stickies) Now? Now this is entirely the capjack fan club. There's very little information here past anything. Heck most of the answers given were penned by those before.

And now Cap is posting stuff to either pad the "zomg I <3 Cap jack!" notch fan club or he's thinking he should be dictating behavior. I suspect the former but it doesn't really matter. Back in the day (6 months ago) we expected people to not post stupid ****. We expected people to ask actual questions instead of "I like ret wat du I du?". You know why? Because we thought paladins should be capabale of thought and effort. At least that was the impression I got. Maybe back then everyone were pricks. Either way it wasn't necessarily a bad thing.

Back then no one accused us of being cesspits of oboards or anything else and lots of people learned the way to ask questions in terms of their deficiencies and in a way that would give them good answers instead of just allowing everyone to suspend thought and paste cliches. They would learn how to ask questions to get useful responses instead of allowing the local denizens to copypasta what we've all said before and what's in the stickies.

Is this really better? Sure, kinder gentler is swell but what does it really do?

You can say that the lawl ret has made this go to hell, I say that the carebear cockmunching has made it even more useless.

I can sum up nearly every post here right now.

Race: Dwarf, BE
AoE wait til reckoning or ret to mash quests
Holy pally stats for Kara? In the sticky
Prot stuff for kara, check out Thels' list (sticky) but zomg Cap you rock
Ret? Well if someone would deign to consolodate their stuff into the more comprehensive thread with gear and stuff there'd be ROOM for a sticky (wait, why didn't Cap, for all his mouthings about ret, nominate a sticky for the ret post again?) Even still, if we wanted (or were allowed) to be honest about that spec instead of needlessly stroking someone until 70 when they realize the bitter truth, we'd be alowed to say ret is broke at end game. Period. Whether you say Lawl Ret or Ret of broke at end game it's the same damn thing.

I'm realizing this place does suck.

But not for the reasons put forth lately.

You know that's where Gaudion is right? Oh god if you've looked that closely of course you do. Poor Gaudion.



I dunno but I really, really miss him.

edit: and I remember you Vaeliorin. You don't post too much here anymore, do you.

Edited, Jan 30th 2008 4:59am by Celcio

I smell jealousy.

Celcio, this isn't the Asylum, not by a longshot. Stop thinking the rule of indecent behaviour applies here. It doesn't. It's not a flaming match, it's a gaming forum designed to help people. If you miss the sarcasm, the flames and the drama, please go back to the Asylum.

Tired of you asshats leaving the den and trying to convert the rest of the site to your ways.

Edited, Jan 30th 2008 11:04am by Mazra

Most of my posts are here in the paladin forums. Most are helpful. You lack history and insight.

Your post is the knee-jerk equivalent of the now-banned lawl ret posts. Please see Cap for your spanking and move along.

edit: in thinking about it I'm pretty sure I haven't posted in the Asylum more than twice in myabe 6 months. Who's got the wishful thinking jealousy thing going now?

Edited, Jan 30th 2008 5:11am by Celcio

I've got a 60 prot pally as well as the 63 shammy. Also a 60 balance druid (and a 42 feral druid). I quit for 6 months (from late May to December of 2007) but I'm back now, though most of my time lately I'm on the Druid forums.

Don't know why, but I'm just not wild about Outlands. Stupid thing is I really enjoy playing the shammy, but with not much hope in terms of end-game it seems like a lost cause.

Still, I'll probably level at least my pally up some more, I'm just frustrated that it's so hard to find decent groups to AoE grind in Hellfire, too many casters around. That, and the only one-hander from the early quest rewards was a sword with a 2.7 speed...the thing is horrible for prot. Guess I'll have to run some instances until something decent drops.

Mmmmmm crit chicken. I always thought it would be a blast to play one but I could never actually level a druid past 20.




Slave pens (the light saber), or SL or KoT rep are your options here I think. And yeah, it sort of sucks finding a weapon.

Heh too bad you're not on my server. I have a SPriest just approaching Outland level. A little silence, a little consecrate, a little dots, a little heal, we'd be golden.

edit: quotes still better than me - can I talent to improve that? :(

Edited, Jan 30th 2008 6:06am by Celcio

Celcio, that's just how things work. Every forum finds its favorites.

Hell, I had a pretty large fanclub at some point on both the Druid and Main forums. Mostly because I was helpful, but also because I spoke my mind. And I'd like to think I made people smile once in a while as well.

You can't be a sarcastic cold-***** veteran on his high horse and expect people to fall in love with you just because you've played the class more than anyone else. It takes charm, friendliness and a broad sense of humor to achieve that.

This thread proves you lack a couple of those features.

The rant and the direction thereof are Mazra's alone. I'm merely lamtening the good old days. Sure we walked uphill to school both ways in the driving snow, but we were happy to have it.



If someone really wants to be the best at their chosen class shouldn't we tell them what the best is? If they insist on a spec that's not viaable for the task they're ultimately asking for isn't it our duty to tell them before they invest the time?

And shouldn't we require they've put in some thought?

See here's my thing. You look around the boards. Next to hunters, paladins are a top response for "what is the easiest class to play" (some say lock but that's often said that they're hard to play well and they're sort of squishy). I do not want my class to be the new hunter. I want people of my class to encourage by whatever means, the appropriate mindset to succeed in the class.

Just out of curiosity - what do you all think of melee hunters?

But even still the specifics of this is not at all what I'm lamemting. What I'm lamenting is a somewhat ascerbic but helpful group of people that knew exactly the limitations of the class, told it like it was and didn't tell the 400 lb kid that he could absolutely be a jockey next month.

Personally, and I think any logically thinking person would agree, melee Huntards are pathetic. That said, if someone wanted to be a melee Huntard, sure I'd tell them that's the biggest mistake they could make other than a melee Priest/Mage/Lock, but I'd still answer their question to the best of my knowledge.

The point some of us are trying to make, and it obviously isn't sinking in with anyone, is if someone wants to be a Ret Paladin, why won't you accept that? Or does everyone coming to these boards need to start with, "I know Ret isn't going to be the best way to do DPS, but it's what I want to do: advice please"?



Again, it's fine to tell someone that Ret will not be the best way to spec a Paladin, but if that's what someone wants, it is "our duty" to help them be the best Ret they can be.

So you want proof. And if we find it for you, is it really going to matter? I'm not going to spend my time re-reading posts just to find this "proof" you want, sorry.

About your point though, is it in regards to the "where are these posts?" or the "it's our duty to tell them Ret isn't the best way to play a Paladin"? If it's the second one, yes that has indeed sunk in very deep. The problem is this: when someone asks how they can be a better Ret there is a HUGE difference between 1) "lawlRet", does not answer the question nor is it helpful in any way 2) "Don't spec Ret, it is lame to say the least for end-game DPS" slightly helpful, but still doesn't answer the question, and 3) "Ret DPS isn't viable end-game, but (insert help lines here)" which gets the point across that Ret isn't the way to go AND actually answers the poster's question.

Well, I tried asking (legitimately) about your point, and all I got was some childish dribble and "FTFY" which I admit I have no idea what that means. GG

Well I tried asking for any sort of validatoin for what you're all saying. I guess we're both walking away empty handed.

Oh oops, just me then. Since I reiterated my point just now. Again.

You saying "you don't feel like finding" the proof of the points you've been consistently arguing and the proof that you and others are constantly referring to really just means you can't. There is none. So you're going to try to distract from that by rambling about something else and trying to flick insults. That was my second point.

Is all of this clear enough for you now?

Just needed to be said again....there is more to WOW than raiding and arena