My 70 shaman has been resto for a while now and I've been considering switching back to elemental for some PVP fun and maybe light instancing.
I can't for the life of me remember my exact spec before I went resto, but I know it was 40/0/21.
I'm considering going with a 41/0/20 build and was wondering how it would work out.
The build is linked here. Let me know what you think. I kinda like the 3% hit and 11% crit for lightning bolt just from talents.
I guess it's time to start PVPing for gear again...
Edited, Jan 26th 2008 8:37pm by Bigdaddyjug
- Forums
- World of Warcraft
- Class Discussion
- Elemental Buil
Elemental BuilFollow
I'd have to disagree, unfortunately.
A "halfway" build designed to PvP and PvE doesn't work for Elemental Shaman. You really need to decide one way or the other. Points are simply too precious and there are far too many talents to cover.
For PvP, Nature's Swiftness, Elemental Warding, Elemental Shields, and Eye of the Storm are completely mandatory in my opinion. Healing Focus and Totemic Mastery aren't quite as necessary, but I still highly recommend them. Nature's Guidance is pretty much overkill for PvP hit rating, Imp. Reincarnation is completely worthless, and you won't ever be casting HW in a PvP fight, so you're better off with Tidal Focus to make LHW a little bit cheaper. You won't miss Unrelenting Storm at all, nor will you ever lay ToW; your direct-damage fire totems are the weapons of choice in every scenario.
For a 40/0/21 build, you want something more like this.
As you can see, even that build lacks Elemental Shields. It's really a difficult juggling act among Elemental Sheilds, Elemental Precision, and Tidal Mastery over in the Resto tree. You might be better off with 44/0/17 since crit gets hit so badly by resilliance, but... then you're missing the all-important Nature's Swiftness.
However... given some time you might eventually reach the same conclusion I did. PvP is not like PvE. You don't just stand there casting Lightning Bolts and Chain Lightnings over and over and over. If you do, you die. (For the record, if you don't you still die, just maybe a little slower, but I digress.) It's really pretty hard to appreciate or miss Lightning Overload in PvP since you really end up casting lightning spells a lot less frequently than you might imagine.
If you're at all curious, this is my personal Elemental PvP build. All of the fixin's except for two points in Elemental Precision, and silence/interruption duration reduction from Focused Mind to boot.
PvE's much easier. You don't have to worry about constantly getting hammered on, so your build would work fine for that. The only thing I absolutely, positively recommend you do is pick up Totemic Mastery. You want the extra radius on your totems' AoE to benefit both yourself and your party members. It is absolutely mandatory in PvE for any spec of Shaman.
Edited, Jan 27th 2008 11:48am by Gaudion
A "halfway" build designed to PvP and PvE doesn't work for Elemental Shaman. You really need to decide one way or the other. Points are simply too precious and there are far too many talents to cover.
For PvP, Nature's Swiftness, Elemental Warding, Elemental Shields, and Eye of the Storm are completely mandatory in my opinion. Healing Focus and Totemic Mastery aren't quite as necessary, but I still highly recommend them. Nature's Guidance is pretty much overkill for PvP hit rating, Imp. Reincarnation is completely worthless, and you won't ever be casting HW in a PvP fight, so you're better off with Tidal Focus to make LHW a little bit cheaper. You won't miss Unrelenting Storm at all, nor will you ever lay ToW; your direct-damage fire totems are the weapons of choice in every scenario.
For a 40/0/21 build, you want something more like this.
As you can see, even that build lacks Elemental Shields. It's really a difficult juggling act among Elemental Sheilds, Elemental Precision, and Tidal Mastery over in the Resto tree. You might be better off with 44/0/17 since crit gets hit so badly by resilliance, but... then you're missing the all-important Nature's Swiftness.
However... given some time you might eventually reach the same conclusion I did. PvP is not like PvE. You don't just stand there casting Lightning Bolts and Chain Lightnings over and over and over. If you do, you die. (For the record, if you don't you still die, just maybe a little slower, but I digress.) It's really pretty hard to appreciate or miss Lightning Overload in PvP since you really end up casting lightning spells a lot less frequently than you might imagine.
If you're at all curious, this is my personal Elemental PvP build. All of the fixin's except for two points in Elemental Precision, and silence/interruption duration reduction from Focused Mind to boot.
PvE's much easier. You don't have to worry about constantly getting hammered on, so your build would work fine for that. The only thing I absolutely, positively recommend you do is pick up Totemic Mastery. You want the extra radius on your totems' AoE to benefit both yourself and your party members. It is absolutely mandatory in PvE for any spec of Shaman.
Edited, Jan 27th 2008 11:48am by Gaudion
I don't know why I said PVP goodness with some light instancing.
I really don't care for PVP anymore except on my rogue.
Would my build be the best build to use if I was just doing PVE?
And yes, I had the pretty standard 40/0/21 build last time I was elemental. But back then AV was at least grindable and I did a lot more BGs than instances.
Edited, Jan 27th 2008 9:37am by Bigdaddyjug
I really don't care for PVP anymore except on my rogue.
Would my build be the best build to use if I was just doing PVE?
And yes, I had the pretty standard 40/0/21 build last time I was elemental. But back then AV was at least grindable and I did a lot more BGs than instances.
Edited, Jan 27th 2008 9:37am by Bigdaddyjug
This is the build I've been running for PVE DPS which seems to work alright.
Based on what I've read, I decided Nature's Guidance was overkill +spellhit for me. I'd echo the comment that Totemic Mastery is pretty crucial.
I'm sorta neutral on the differences in Tier 2 resto. I always miss Cheaper Totems when I don't have it, and I could probably ditch Imp Reinc in favor of at least 2 points into that talent, but I feel Ancestral Healing is pretty solid - at least in a Heroic/5-man atmosphere where offhealing has saved the party countless times.
Based on what I've read, I decided Nature's Guidance was overkill +spellhit for me. I'd echo the comment that Totemic Mastery is pretty crucial.
I'm sorta neutral on the differences in Tier 2 resto. I always miss Cheaper Totems when I don't have it, and I could probably ditch Imp Reinc in favor of at least 2 points into that talent, but I feel Ancestral Healing is pretty solid - at least in a Heroic/5-man atmosphere where offhealing has saved the party countless times.
Next time I decide to just pvp for a wek i wanna try this build:
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=hVcuVfMoqsxZgc0x0xo
really starting to enjoy useing my fire totems in pvp, i have have been seeing my Nova crit for 2k lately and I like it, for pvp the nova gives me alittle more dps when i am on the move and a nice surprise for a warrior hitting me too much to cast LBs.
for pve tho I enjoy this build:
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=hEczVo0qAotZxfczox
lots of mana regen and crit, when you have enough hit from gear you can also sacrifice points in nature's guidance
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=hVcuVfMoqsxZgc0x0xo
really starting to enjoy useing my fire totems in pvp, i have have been seeing my Nova crit for 2k lately and I like it, for pvp the nova gives me alittle more dps when i am on the move and a nice surprise for a warrior hitting me too much to cast LBs.
for pve tho I enjoy this build:
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=hEczVo0qAotZxfczox
lots of mana regen and crit, when you have enough hit from gear you can also sacrifice points in nature's guidance
I'm curious, jmfmb do you intentionally go light on +spellhit gear so you can use Nature's Guidance instead? If so, that seems like a clever way to squeeze some extra DPS out of resto talents that would otherwise be less useful. I may have to keep that in mind when I'm searching for gear upgrades to pursue.
here is the thing, it is an easy way to get lots of spell hit before gear, but basicly what your working for is once you have enough spell hit from gear is to lose the talents and grab healing focus, which i miss quite a bit and wouldnt moind losing some range to totems for, but for pve the spell hit is great, i mean how many classes can ding 70 and have 9 spell hit from talents and 3 more from your totem?
once you have enough you can start replacing talents which is nice, but if you have to put in points into resto for elemental build (which we do) best to maximize your points towards dps for raiding.
eventually you have enough from gear without sacrificing too much and still pull off healing focus, which is a life saver at times.
once you have enough you can start replacing talents which is nice, but if you have to put in points into resto for elemental build (which we do) best to maximize your points towards dps for raiding.
eventually you have enough from gear without sacrificing too much and still pull off healing focus, which is a life saver at times.
BTW i am jealous of you and your scryers, i wish i did more research and went scryers for that trinket, i have to wear a bit of spell hit gear as resto when i still want to dps, and that would make things much easier.
Edited, Jan 29th 2008 1:44am by jmfmb
Edited, Jan 29th 2008 1:44am by jmfmb
Quote:
BTW i am jealous of you and your scryers, i wish i did more research and went scryers for that trinket, i have to wear a bit of spell hit gear as resto when i still want to dps, and that would make things much easier.
Well as I was saying, I think this probably works out a bit to your benefit depending on where you are with your char.
In Heroics I find offhealing to frequently be helpful, and mobs don't hit so hard that the 56% interruption protection is useless. So I'm in an alright position there. But in heroics I'd imagine offhealing is used less often and when mobs do hit you they're going to 1/2-shot you (making interruption protection kinda useless).
So at least in raiding it seems like it'd be beneficial to intentionally go 3% lighter on Spellhit gear and make up for it with talents. This assumes you get a good tradeoff in +DMG and +Crit in place of the lost Spellhit.
Edited, Jan 29th 2008 5:21pm by Axehilt
I only have a couple things to say about an elemental pvp build:
1. Lightning Overload is a necessary talent. No matter what you say Lighning Overload is more burst dps, and therefore completely necessary.
2. Totem of Wrath may be you personal choice, but I think that point could be better spent in Nature's Swiftness. An instant cast spell can be very helpful if someone is on you.
3. Depending on you play style you may want to grab the fire totem talents. Fire Nova totem can deal a decent amount of burst damage. These are awsome in arena. The choas helps a massive amount.
4. Crit Cirt Crit... you want all the lightning bolt crit you can get. The more crit you have the better you will do.
5. Spell hit is worthwhile. I would take crit over it though because, at least for me, it is not a problem. If you must get spell hit talents, I will say just get the ones in the resto tree.
6. Uninterruptable heals are priceless, unless you have a healer who follows you everywhere. In battlegrounds you are just standing with a binch of people spamming lighning bolt and will not always need to heal.
7. Eye of the Storm is very helpful. It is actually awsome until you get the gladiators gear set with the 70% chance not to be interrupted. You aren't hit much in battlegrounds, at least to my experience, so this isn't necessary.
8. Don't go with things that reduce damage taken unless you are doing arena, in which they are very helpful. If you are only doing battlegrounds, then ditch those talents for more damageing ones.
9. Unrelenting Storm is awsome, especially in battlegrounds. In arena, I will admit that I don't know about it.
My build for battleground pvp is this: http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/shaman/talents.html?5500015500021505105000000000000000000000050230320005010000000
My Arena build is this:
http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/shaman/talents.html?0503305523021005135000000000000000000000050230050003000000000
Good luck!
Edit: Guess which moron didn't see he meant PvE <---
Try this for questing: http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/shaman/talents.html?5500015500021505105100000000000000000000050230311005000000000
Or this for raiding: http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/shaman/talents.html?5500015500021335105100000000000000000000050105301004000000000
Try messing around with anything im open to advice too.
Edited, Jan 29th 2008 8:51pm by stUUf
1. Lightning Overload is a necessary talent. No matter what you say Lighning Overload is more burst dps, and therefore completely necessary.
2. Totem of Wrath may be you personal choice, but I think that point could be better spent in Nature's Swiftness. An instant cast spell can be very helpful if someone is on you.
3. Depending on you play style you may want to grab the fire totem talents. Fire Nova totem can deal a decent amount of burst damage. These are awsome in arena. The choas helps a massive amount.
4. Crit Cirt Crit... you want all the lightning bolt crit you can get. The more crit you have the better you will do.
5. Spell hit is worthwhile. I would take crit over it though because, at least for me, it is not a problem. If you must get spell hit talents, I will say just get the ones in the resto tree.
6. Uninterruptable heals are priceless, unless you have a healer who follows you everywhere. In battlegrounds you are just standing with a binch of people spamming lighning bolt and will not always need to heal.
7. Eye of the Storm is very helpful. It is actually awsome until you get the gladiators gear set with the 70% chance not to be interrupted. You aren't hit much in battlegrounds, at least to my experience, so this isn't necessary.
8. Don't go with things that reduce damage taken unless you are doing arena, in which they are very helpful. If you are only doing battlegrounds, then ditch those talents for more damageing ones.
9. Unrelenting Storm is awsome, especially in battlegrounds. In arena, I will admit that I don't know about it.
My build for battleground pvp is this: http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/shaman/talents.html?5500015500021505105000000000000000000000050230320005010000000
My Arena build is this:
http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/shaman/talents.html?0503305523021005135000000000000000000000050230050003000000000
Good luck!
Edit: Guess which moron didn't see he meant PvE <---
Try this for questing: http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/shaman/talents.html?5500015500021505105100000000000000000000050230311005000000000
Or this for raiding: http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/shaman/talents.html?5500015500021335105100000000000000000000050105301004000000000
Try messing around with anything im open to advice too.
Edited, Jan 29th 2008 8:51pm by stUUf
Draeneipally wrote:
good build.
QFT, especially considering that you corrected yourself about the PvP. For PvE, I see no problems whatsoever with that build, except perhaps take one point out of Totemic Focus and put it into Totemic Mastery.
EDIT: Velena, when did you go Resto, and why? =( WTB Elemental Velena?
Edited, Jan 29th 2008 9:31pm by GWynand
Double post, sorry.
Edited, Jan 29th 2008 9:31pm by GWynand
Edited, Jan 29th 2008 9:31pm by GWynand
Scholar
44 posts
I think Lightning Overload is a waste of points that are better spent in Resto.
Here's my spec: http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=hEczVcMqAoZZxfxz0xo
It's a primarily hybrid PVP build designed for as much spell and heal crit as possible. While not the highest in terms of overall damage, I love to be a backup spur-of-the-moment emergency healer.
While some of my choices in that build are certainly debatable (yeah, I know, no Elemental Shields or Healing Focus), it is a perfect fit for how I like to play, alternating between Chain Lightnings and Chain Heals.
Here's my spec: http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=hEczVcMqAoZZxfxz0xo
It's a primarily hybrid PVP build designed for as much spell and heal crit as possible. While not the highest in terms of overall damage, I love to be a backup spur-of-the-moment emergency healer.
While some of my choices in that build are certainly debatable (yeah, I know, no Elemental Shields or Healing Focus), it is a perfect fit for how I like to play, alternating between Chain Lightnings and Chain Heals.
I use to like this build a lot back in the day before I did heroics and pvp a bit, it didn't have the burst, but it had the survivability I wanted at the time,and it was more then enough points to heal or off heal non heroics.
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=hE0zVf0qVsZZE00t0eo
but Lightning Overload is too nice to give up now it seems =P
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=hE0zVf0qVsZZE00t0eo
but Lightning Overload is too nice to give up now it seems =P
Eh, thanks for the replies but I ended up going enhancement instead.
Having gotten 4 or 5 Kara epics for an enhance spec I just couldn't pass it up.
My ele gear was nowhere near that good.
Having gotten 4 or 5 Kara epics for an enhance spec I just couldn't pass it up.
My ele gear was nowhere near that good.
Quote:
I think Lightning Overload is a waste of points that are better spent in Resto.
You have clearly never been hit with Chaincrit->Overload->LB->Overload. It's *incredibly* useful for burst damage.
lsfreak wrote:
Quote:
I think Lightning Overload is a waste of points that are better spent in Resto.
You have clearly never been hit with Chaincrit->Overload->LB->Overload. It's *incredibly* useful for burst damage.
CL crit (let's assume 35% crit chance) x Overload (20% chance) x LB (100%) x Overload (20% chance). .35 x .20 x 1.00 x .20 = .014.
What you've just described has a 1.4% chance of happening. So you'll see that maybe one out of roughly 70 fights or so? Congratulations, you've found Elemental's version of the triple WF crit. Not even considering the cast times, silences, LoS errors, or interruptions that might be involved, that is a ridiculously low-chance best-case scenario.
Compare that against the guaranteed benefit of 30% less time spent silenced (and completely helpless) from Focused Mind and you fail. Miserably.
Again, outside of BG's or 5v5's--hell, even in BG's or 5v5's--you really spend a lot less time sitting there spamming CL's or LB's than most people imagine. Shocks, direct-damage fire totems (especially Fire Nova Totem; make friends with it), and even melee attacks with Flametongue applied to your weapon add up to be a considerable amount of your total damage. CL and LB only come out to play when you know you've got a free window, such as when Eye of the Storm procs or the rare times you may find yourself not being focused on by anyone.
Scholar
44 posts
You're right, with all the time I've spent in BGs, I can't recall a single time I've been hit with a proc like that from another elemental Shaman. And, given the maths supplied in the post above, I'm not surprised.
Instead, I chose to spend the 6 points I could have spent on LO and ToW on Tidal Mastery for 5% increased nature spell crit (which Includes heal spells) and Nature's Swiftness for a free instant cast. I can't say I have any regrets...
Instead, I chose to spend the 6 points I could have spent on LO and ToW on Tidal Mastery for 5% increased nature spell crit (which Includes heal spells) and Nature's Swiftness for a free instant cast. I can't say I have any regrets...
Unless your not 70 you can get both...
observe this pvp build:
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=hiczEbMoVsxZgc0x0xo
basically gets you all the pvp talents and your resto talents...
you miss out on eots but some talents can be traded depending on what you prefer.
now if you said it was for a build that would optimize survival in pvp you would have implied something more like this:
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=hiczEcMoVsZZgc0t0xs
observe this pvp build:
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=hiczEbMoVsxZgc0x0xo
basically gets you all the pvp talents and your resto talents...
you miss out on eots but some talents can be traded depending on what you prefer.
now if you said it was for a build that would optimize survival in pvp you would have implied something more like this:
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=hiczEcMoVsZZgc0t0xs
k here are the standard pvp and pve builds and I will say one thing. THERE ARE VERY FEW POINTS YOU CAN THROW AROUND but I will tell you which
pvp
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=hEczVcMoqsxZVcbt0Lo
you can toss points from eye of the storm and elemental warding wherever in elemental and in resto you can put the 2 points in totemic focus wherever but everything else is where I had it and I used to have a 1750 3's team ( lock shammy pally) not exactly epic but it's better than alot of peoples i see here :S and then there's my druid barely hanging on in the world of pvp with his blues and greens :S I srsly need to pvp more
pve
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=hEzuV0MsAotZVbjz0x
this build is more of a toss up but I don't really see any good variances of it in anything. I put the points in imp fire totem because in very mobile fights I can just drop my totem of mini fireballs next to the boss and it does about 150 dps ( LOL AT THIS ) and the fact that your fire elemental gets 15% more dmg which means it starts hitting pretty hard, also I didn't max unrelenting storms since after the mana spring and water shield changes mana is a problem of the past ( never really was unless your doing the 3lb's:1CL combo)
also the points that would gone into unrelenting storm go into tidal mastery which is more crit which is more dmg and mana efficiency in the first place :P
if you have any ideas about what I could make better here shoot ( mind you I have 3 points in eye of the storm since I've been doing alot of BG's lately in pve gear :D bigger numbers mean I'm happier)
Edit: forgot the pve build lol
Edited, Feb 1st 2008 3:33am by EvilShenanigans
pvp
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=hEczVcMoqsxZVcbt0Lo
you can toss points from eye of the storm and elemental warding wherever in elemental and in resto you can put the 2 points in totemic focus wherever but everything else is where I had it and I used to have a 1750 3's team ( lock shammy pally) not exactly epic but it's better than alot of peoples i see here :S and then there's my druid barely hanging on in the world of pvp with his blues and greens :S I srsly need to pvp more
pve
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=hEzuV0MsAotZVbjz0x
this build is more of a toss up but I don't really see any good variances of it in anything. I put the points in imp fire totem because in very mobile fights I can just drop my totem of mini fireballs next to the boss and it does about 150 dps ( LOL AT THIS ) and the fact that your fire elemental gets 15% more dmg which means it starts hitting pretty hard, also I didn't max unrelenting storms since after the mana spring and water shield changes mana is a problem of the past ( never really was unless your doing the 3lb's:1CL combo)
also the points that would gone into unrelenting storm go into tidal mastery which is more crit which is more dmg and mana efficiency in the first place :P
if you have any ideas about what I could make better here shoot ( mind you I have 3 points in eye of the storm since I've been doing alot of BG's lately in pve gear :D bigger numbers mean I'm happier)
Edit: forgot the pve build lol
Edited, Feb 1st 2008 3:33am by EvilShenanigans
jmfmb wrote:
Unless your not 70 you can get both...
observe this pvp build:
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=hiczEbMoVsxZgc0x0xo
basically gets you all the pvp talents and your resto talents...
you miss out on eots but some talents can be traded depending on what you prefer.
observe this pvp build:
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=hiczEbMoVsxZgc0x0xo
basically gets you all the pvp talents and your resto talents...
you miss out on eots but some talents can be traded depending on what you prefer.
I don't think anyone here is arguing the trade of ToW for NS. That's pretty much a gimme. What I'm disagreeing with is this:
stUUf wrote:
1. Lightning Overload is a necessary talent. No matter what you say Lighning Overload is more burst dps, and therefore completely necessary.
LO is not required for PvP. It's nice to have, I'm not arguing that, but you're not using it as a crutch the way we are in PvE right now. And whereas in PvE you've got more than enough talent points to fit it in, in a PvP it's superfluous or possibly even damaging to your total build because of the things you have to give up in order to fit it in.
I've been PvP'ing off and on for the last two months in between raids. I respec every time, and almost every time I have I have tried out different builds to see what I have the most success with. There are a lot of things I immediately regret not having when I spec out of them--EotS, FM, Imp. FNT, Elemental Shields--I can't say that I've ever missed LO when I didn't take it.
All I'm saying is have an open mind. Try dropping LO for yourself and see if you actually miss it. If so, hey, it's your build... pick it back up.
Quote:
now if you said it was for a build that would optimize survival in pvp you would have implied something more like this:
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=hiczEcMoVsZZgc0t0xs
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=hiczEcMoVsZZgc0t0xs
That's closer to what I have in mind when I think of an Elemental PvP build. The next time I respec for PvP I'm going with this build. I've gone without maxing Elemental Precision before, but I've never gone without at least a single point in it. If it's not a problem, I am pretty much ready to call that build a finished product.
Recent Visitors: 108
All times are in CST
Anonymous Guests (108)
- Forums
- World of Warcraft
- Class Discussion
- Elemental Buil
© 2024 Fanbyte LLC