2.4 Warrior suggestion.Follow

Actually, getting the 'interupt' effect of the glove would be nice. I'd love to use my T5 gloves for pvp (The Rogue T5 gloves are pretty much the best part of that set and by switching out some pvp and pve gear, I can keep 300resi and reach 2k+ atk) to increase my damage... but I really can't. Interupt on DT is just too powerful. It turns the ability from a lackluster to actually worth a damn.

Adding a Cooldown makes sense, but it can't be longer (or not much longer) then the snare attached to DT, since DT serves 2 purpose here (ranged interupt and ranged snare). But since the snare last 6 second, an 'earth shock-like' cooldown work just fine.



To be honest, balance changes are kinda moot as far as 2v2 go as long as the 'druid situation' isn't addressed. I just dropped that in there to try and make the post more rounded.



While I like your spirit and this is a really cute change... it's also a lost cause.

Resilience didn't kill Dagger. No, Resilience tied its hands behind its back and put a black bag on its head, but it was the scaling Stamina/HP that pulled the trigger and the scaling of healing that put the body in its trunk, drove it the old pier and tossed it in the lake. Later investigation showed that positional requirement* ordered the hit.

There's just way to many factor working against dagger for a simple fix like you're suggesting to have enough impact.

Even were it possible to totally ignore Resilience with Dagger... you'd get a 4k Ambush, followed by a 2.5k Backstab... and then what? You got him down to 45%! Woot! Your target then gets healed damn near back up to full by a flash of light crit? Not to mention that the damage goes down the drain if you're fighting something else then a clothie (the above burst will only do 4k dmg on a mail wearer).

Of course, in a 2dps team, combined with some CC... or in 3s... or in a 4dps 5v5, this would win some games. But in the end, the game has changed to much for this to be viable. Once people survive your opening shot, you're the weakest possible rogue spec around. And there's many way to survive burst damage nowaday...


*Once me and Sife went up against another Rogue/priest team. Both rogue went for the priest. Their rogue was mutilate. Sife put his back to a wall. I killed his priest and sife never even went down below 50%. Fun times.

RPZip for president in 08!

This thread delivers.

Ok let me just say this. Warriors being so powerful at level 70 is payback for being walked all over in lower levels. Its payback for being unable to sneak past mobs to get the quest objective. Its payback for all the times we died because we can't heal and we don't have a pet to absorb damage. Its also payback for every time we got excluded out of groups when we didn't want to tank. Arena dominance was hard earned because getting that warrior to 70 wasn't easy. They won't be nerfed because blizzard gave them those abilities to reward hard work. I was an arms spec'd warrior and I never got into any groups and I had to grind it solo. No pets. No minions. And no heals, buffs, or ranged attacks to keep me out of harms way.

When was the last time you leveled a warrior?

The time it takes to 70 is all about how much you want to learn while playing. I didn't rush anything to get to level 60, and I had 25 days /played right there. My hunter had 12 days /played at 70, and my current hunter was at 4 days /played at 60. I think I've turned out an ok hunter and warrior, simply because I wasn't retarded enough to rush to 70 on my first char just to have something to brag about.

You're a living example, because there's a backside to it: Having the knowledge base of an e-bay:er is nothing to brag about.

Shao...your arguments suck. Regularly.

Oh please.

I leveled a warrior to 60 and it's nowhere as bad as the average warrior player make it out to be.

Keep your gear updated frequently (don't wear stuff 10 level lower then yours - on my warrior, I would run every instance several time until I had all the key drops), fight mobs 2 level lowers then yours, don't be stupid about adds and pull carefully (know when not to charge) and it really isn't much harder then any other class out there.

And it's downright easy if the warrior is an alt and you can gear him with blue/twink gear. My level 23 Warrior baby alt decimates equal level mobs faster then any other PC I've ever had - that's what happens when your toon has 7 blues and 1100 hp at that level I guess.

Oh, and once you reach a higher enough level, Recklessness + Sweeping Strike is an incredible 'oh ****' button.

Yeah, you don't have any escaping ability. Yeah, when you do a bad pulls, you're more likely to die then a lot of the other class in the game (which doesn't mean you will die. Running away with a shield + Defensive Stance helps). But in the greater scheme of thing, 10-20 more death from 1 to 70 doesn't account for it being 'Hell'. If you're doing a lot more then that... then the problem's with you.

Edited, Jan 29th 2008 3:04pm by Tyrandor

There's a large difference between good warriors and bad warriors. If you don't know this, you're bad yourself.

I've dueled warriors in full S3 on my realm and gotten smashed. I've also dueled ones with full mixed arena gear and smashed them because they were bad.

Smashed doesn't mean I had like 10% HP left, it was more like I had 60% HP left.

But yeah. Just like with any other class, there's a large difference between the bads and the skilled.

That. :)

Edited, Jan 29th 2008 3:56pm by Tyrandor

Yes.

Also, since I can't believe I missed this the first time;



I've been a golden god since long before I got a Warglaive.

I think I may have remembered reading about you in mythology...

Though now instead of holding **** beads he's holding a warglaive.

That was my last allah accomplishment I was hoping for:

For RPzip to agree with me and to get quoted in someone's signature. I can die peacefully now.

I'm going to weigh in on RPZip's side here. Well, sort of his side. A side which is parallel, at any rate.

The popularity of a class in arena is not tied solely to how *OP* it is, and thus a flat out nerf is not going to achieve the desired result. I think there are several reasons Warriors are popular in arena, including but not limited to:

1) The class itself is easy to play at a competent level (especially in arena), just like the Warlock. It may, just like the Warlock in 3v3 and 5v5, get complex at higher levels, but I cannot say.

1.b)It's more of a passive defence class like Warlock, Paladin etc than an active defence class such as Mage, Rogue or Druid.

2) The Warrior is a staple PvP class. It has been strong throughout tBC and thus there are already plenty of well geared Warriors in arena. Therefore, even if a weaker class (Ret Paladin is a reasonable example - good 3v3 class but unpopular still) was to be buffed to become superior to or on par with it, it's going to take time for the change to take effect.

3) Mortal Strike. Aimed (Mortal) Shot is a ***** to put up. The only competitor is Wound Poison. As a healing debuff is normally important in 3v3 and 5v5 this basically means you'll either want a Rogue or a Warrior in the team (There are exceptions, even FoTM ones, but the majority have one or the other). Getting these two to be exactly equal would be incredibly difficult, as previously mentioned it is not down to brute force alone. How well they synergiSe (British tyvm)with the current FoTM matrices and such plays a large factor too. Of course, you want to be top. Of course, Warriors want to be on top. But one is always going to be a fair bit better than the other.

Anyways, the balance is delicate, and I suspect your proposed change would break the scales. Rogues have a great deal of benefits Warriors do not, just as Warriors have benefits you do not. (This is more for Shaolinz than Tyr).

These include increased control over the target you are dpsing, superior CC to those you are not dpsing and greatly increased mobility (as ShS). Additionally, as ShS, you have better survivability vs non melee than Warriors (yes, even the ones that know how to def stance, reflect and turtle the burst). As Mutilate, you have better burst dps than a Warrior (for reals). I assume you can see the weaknesses of your class for yourself.

Shaolinz, your opinion is horribly outdated. That post made me want to rend flesh, especially as a Mage. You know what pisses me off most in ALL of WoW? Post-patch Hunters. They aren't weak at all anymore.

BTW, Tyr, Rogues cannot kill people in 5s?

I guess the words "Renataki" and "Mutilate" would mean nothing to you.