RetributionFollow

Head to Outland, start questing and then tell me what you think.

Tommy you don't have to jump to this guy's defense, I got nothing on you but I don't like his attitude.

It never ends.

penalty. this actually lowers your potential dps over the long term and lengthens downtime.



if by easier you mean tedious and mundane. cant solo group quests as pally and kill quests take 4-eva(wtb a mage)

"I'm level 5x and I do good DPS so ret paladins should be good DPS at 70. You guys don't know what you're talking about!"

My response? lawl ret.

All I can tell you is that you will see that Ret doesn't scale all that well at the higer levels, and is typically not the spec others will want you to be in a group at 70 (where grouping is pretty much the game, either doing heroics, kara or beyond, or arenas).

Ret pallies have always done wonderfull damage mid game. and your the 100th person that ive seen post sillyness like this.

come back when your 70 and tell us how leet Ret DPS is. . .

hmm, thats odd. i know i only have blues, but at 70 with not a single epic yet, the only dps'er i've grouped with that has beat me was a mostly epic'd rogue. i've beat out mostly epic'd mages, dps warriors, and a boomkin (granted the boomkin off-healed one fight where the healer died). (names i can remember are: rogue that beat me - elldios, mage - zaanah, warrior - falromord, and mage i've leapfrogged dps with - abednego) and my healer i've been with for every 70 instance so far is a shaman, so i've taken ceansing duties on top of dps. admittetly their epics weren't from past kara or S1/S2, but they were all geared better than me... i guess i'll see what happens when i get some epics... maybe my dps will go down or something ;)



hmm, i guess i'm lucky my guild likes me. i've been removed from a group a grand total of once when they found out i was ret. been successful even in heroics. not sure when i'll get a chance to do kara, cause my healadin will be my priority there, but if i do get that chance, i'm sure my ret will be successful there too.

Quick fix for you.



Not entirely true. Will you get more respect if you are level 70? Yeah probably. But if you are saying things that are at least true and I or others on these boards agree with then you're fine in my book.

For instance: I've never been past the Curator in Kara, yet I've given advice to Paladins who raid. That's mostly cause I've done a TON of reading from other posters and from a number of sites about the encounters and gear, etc.. If a new poster pre-70 showed that same knowledge and enlightenment about 70 instances and heroics I would gladly welcome them into the forums.




I agree with you (mostly) Ze. I pay attention to lower levels, but playing in lower levels is so much simpler than playing in higher levels. You don't have to worry as much about gear choice, talent choice, or anything really. You can pick the worst spec in the game, have the worst gear possible, and still do well enough. Once you get into the 60s and eventually hit 70, you suddenly have to worry more about numbers, percentages, proper talent choices, picking the right gear, juggling stats in order to be successful, etc... It's much more complicated and thus we tend to pay more attention to people with those needs.

Ret got a fix and the dps ain't hateful and neither is the aggro. It isn't going to compete with bm hunters, combat swords rogues or any other high sustained dps class that is played well (lot of em arent).

Still the problem of not being all that great in Arena, not as pivotal as a healer in BG and suffering from huge gear table issues well into t5 /shrug.

Out damaging a raid specced guy in a 5 man where its burst dps and the guy is probably asleep at the wheel or poorly played in entry level epics is like winning gold at the special olympics.

You can only know so much by reading, though. Sure I've read a TON about protection paladins, but I have very little experience actually putting it into practice. You'll find that most forum posters talk out their rear and either misquote someone else's experience/research or flat get things wrong. I offer only the most basic advice about protection in my posts, anything slightly advanced you'll see that either I don't post or I direct them to someone else. However when it comes to Holy... I've healed every single boss currently in the game. Not only have I read strats, watched movies, but I've actually DONE it. When I say something like "stand on Tidewalker's heels" for example, I'm not saying it just because I've read it somewhere or hear about it. I say it because I've tried being with the main raid, tried being around corners, personally tried different things and found out through experience that what you actually need to do is X. I'm glad that you read things, it will prepare you for the future. But don't think for a SECOND you KNOW anything unless you tried it. Do NOT talk about Ret raid DPS in BC when you're pre-70, you haven't done it! I don't care if you've even seen others in person do it, its still not the same thing as actually doing it yourself. Knowledge and experience are not equal. I have YET to see a frigging ret pally on this forum start off a post with "in my experiences in <insert raid here>..." Yes there are a few ret paladins out there that raid, but none of you pre-70s are them! Just shhh, and come back when you've lost your ret raiding cherry. Then we'll talk.

Tommy is the only ret I'd listen to on these forums, even then I still can't truely take ret seriously

I retlol'd at this.

I've got to admit, Tommy has often made me think about making a ret pally. I just can't bring myself to start over at level 1 though with a class I've already played so much (and I don't want to respec my prot pally, or search out ret gear for her).

Besides, if I made a ret pally, I'd almost have to go with blacksmithing as a profession, and I don't want to go through that struggle over again (my shaman is a blacksmith, and it's just horrible to level).