Hi, this is my first post on the forums although i've been reading them for some time. I've been playing a Rogue for about a year on and off, and i've recently started on a warrior with intentions of being a viable tank. Whilst building my Rogue i've taken note of popular builds but I like to mix it up a little(5/35/21 maces).
Now my main priority rolling a warrior is to tank, but i'm not looking for the 'perfect' tanking build. Before I say anymore i'll tell you I am completely new to the Warrior and obviously tanking, so my idea could be waaaaay off the mark, and thats why i'm asking you guys to tell me if what im thinking of is viable, or if its a stupid idea that will do me no good:)
Looking at the talent trees, after checking out the Prot tree one thing that caught my eye was Mace Specialisation. I love maces, i love stuns. Now to get to that requires 20 points spent in Arms which seems to have a few tank-wise benefit talents anyway. With Mace Spec thats 25 total.
Arms(25):
Deflection 5/5
Iron Will 5/5
Imp Thunderclap 3/3
Imp Charge 2/2
Imp Heroic Strike 3/3
Anger Management 1/1
Imp Overpower 1/2 (to make up 20)
=== Mace Spec 5/5
Rage generation and tanking ability are both helped with these talents I believe, allowing me to make up some atleast, for the lost points in the Prot tree, as i'll be throwing away Bloodrage and Tactical Mastery.
Protection(36):
Anticipation 5/5
Shield Specialisation 5/5
Toughness 5/5
Last Stand 1/1
Imp Shield Block 1/1
Imp Revenge 3/3
Defiance 3/3
Imp Sunder Armour 3/3
Shield Mastery 3/3
Concussive Blow 1/1
Shield Slam 1/1
Imp Shield Wall 2/2
Imp Defensive Stance 3/3
With this build, as well as tanking my goal is to be as pvp/solo able as i can whilst being a tank. Hence the stuns. Now after several headaches from studying the talent trees this is what i'm more or less intending to do. So please be critical, but not purely for the sake of telling me how I need to "l2p"
My questions:
1. I've heard tanks say stunned mobs make it difficult to tank Why is this? And is that aimed at just party member stuns, or our own stuns as well?
2. Is this build deep enough into the Prot tree to effictively tank end game?
3. The One-hand Specialisation Talent. As described it increases one-hand weapon damage. Does it also increase efficiency or benefit your one hand weapon in any other stat/way? I may put points in this talent if so.
If you've read all this I really would appreciate your input. As i've said I am yet to tank an instance and I dont want to get into the changing spec habits that i had with my Rogue. I ask the guild normally for input, but they're all stoners and this stuff is too tedious:D
Yeah i'm gunna stop typing real soon, i'd just like to say, I respect the Warrior;) Hardest job in the game is expected of you and you still get the most crap whether you tank or not
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AchDaddy wrote:
1. I've heard tanks say stunned mobs make it difficult to tank Why is this? And is that aimed at just party member stuns, or our own stuns as well?
When you're tanking you're doing low damage. This is normally what you get rage from while soloing. This has lead to most tanks depending on the damage they take for rage generation. You might find yourself rage starved, even with all the effort you've up in to compensate.
AchDaddy wrote:
2. Is this build deep enough into the Prot tree to effictively tank end game?
Yes. As long as you have Shield Slam you'll be fine.
AchDaddy wrote:
3. The One-hand Specialisation Talent. As described it increases one-hand weapon damage. Does it also increase efficiency or benefit your one hand weapon in any other stat/way? I may put points in this talent if so.
I was going to come to that. This talent increases all the damage you do with your weapon by 2% per point. It's worth speccing for sure!
I was gonna write alot more, but I've got a party to go to, so I'll see you later.
Utarius wrote:
AchDaddy wrote:
3. The One-hand Specialisation Talent. As described it increases one-hand weapon damage. Does it also increase efficiency or benefit your one hand weapon in any other stat/way? I may put points in this talent if so.
I was going to come to that. This talent increases all the damage you do with your weapon by 2% per point. It's worth speccing for sure!
I've always wondered if 1H Weapon Spec talent increases damage done by Shield Slam. Anyone know?
Quote:
1. I've heard tanks say stunned mobs make it difficult to tank Why is this? And is that aimed at just party member stuns, or our own stuns as well?
As a tank, your usually going to only be above the healer on the DPS meter, so you need to be hit to maintain rage. Thats why I feel most comfortable tanking 3 mobs, that way I have a large amount of rage at my disposale. I usually only use Conc. Blow to stop a target from going to a class throwing out too much DPS. And soloing
of course.
Quote:
2. Is this build deep enough into the Prot tree to effictively tank end game?
Yes, though its probably going to be easier endgame wise to pick up devastate as of 2.3.2
Quote:
3. The One-hand Specialisation Talent. As described it increases one-hand weapon damage. Does it also increase efficiency or benefit your one hand weapon in any other stat/way? I may put points in this talent if so.
To my knowledge it only affects damage, but if your soloing a lot, I would recommend it.
Also, put the points into arms first, as it sucks grinding prot.
Quote:
I've always wondered if 1H Weapon Spec talent increases damage done by Shield Slam. Anyone know?
No, it doesnt. Shield slam is affected by shield block rating, that talent only increases weapon damage.
Scynadumos wrote:
No, it doesnt. Shield slam is affected by shield block rating, that talent only increases weapon damage.
Wrong, and wrong. Don't post information like that unless you're sure of it. For starters, shield block RATING has absolutley no effect on shield slam damage. Shield block VALUE does. You're also wrong about the talent. 1H weapon specialization adds 10% damage to your Shield Slams. Get your facts straight.
I hope this information helps you, and the OP, in the future.
Alright fannies, back from the party... a bit hung over, so bear with any mistakes I may make.
Now, to clear quite a few things up in this thread:
To extrapolate my 3rd answer.
Now, this applies to all weapon damage, so it's favorable to Devastate. It also affects white hits and HS's. It also increases rage generation by a fair amount (since more damage = more rage, not to mention more threat). To be honest, I have no idea why you picked Imp. Def. Stance over this talent.
To duvar, Scyna and Fleetus:
As far as I know 1h spec doesn't affect Shield Slam in any way. I realize that it might be frustrating that people spread misinformation, but (Fleetus) I don't much care if you're sure on what you say or not. Back it up. I've found no evidence that 1h spec affects SS. Not on WoWwiki, or elitistjerks, or any page for that matter. In addition: Where's the logic proof? You're smacking someone in the face with a Shield. How does specializing in one-handed weapons help you smack them any harder?
What DOES affect SS though, is Shield Mastery. Now, Blizzard aren't always the best at writing tool tips... It's supposed to say "Increases your Block Value by 10/20/30%" and by reading that you can surely figure out why it affects SS.
Finally, at OP: I think your build is a good starting point, but defo needs some fine tuning. I'd recommend this build to you. It's similar, and based on stunlocking. You can swap three points out of 1h spec into Focused Rage in case of rage starvation.
And lastly, not telling you "l2p", but I'd advise you stick with a cookie cutter prot build. Although the overkill on stuns (watch DR's!) might, with luck, help a great deal in PvP... They're hardly useful at all while soloing. And while instancing you only ever need them if you've got survivability issues. In almost any other case than that they're likely to leave you rage starved, on one-mob-pulls at least.
That's pretty much all the feedback I've got for you... back to my headache now, bye bye!
Now, to clear quite a few things up in this thread:
To extrapolate my 3rd answer.
Utarius wrote:
I was going to come to that. This talent increases all the damage you do with your weapon by 2% per point. It's worth speccing for sure!
Now, this applies to all weapon damage, so it's favorable to Devastate. It also affects white hits and HS's. It also increases rage generation by a fair amount (since more damage = more rage, not to mention more threat). To be honest, I have no idea why you picked Imp. Def. Stance over this talent.
To duvar, Scyna and Fleetus:
As far as I know 1h spec doesn't affect Shield Slam in any way. I realize that it might be frustrating that people spread misinformation, but (Fleetus) I don't much care if you're sure on what you say or not. Back it up. I've found no evidence that 1h spec affects SS. Not on WoWwiki, or elitistjerks, or any page for that matter. In addition: Where's the logic proof? You're smacking someone in the face with a Shield. How does specializing in one-handed weapons help you smack them any harder?
What DOES affect SS though, is Shield Mastery. Now, Blizzard aren't always the best at writing tool tips... It's supposed to say "Increases your Block Value by 10/20/30%" and by reading that you can surely figure out why it affects SS.
Finally, at OP: I think your build is a good starting point, but defo needs some fine tuning. I'd recommend this build to you. It's similar, and based on stunlocking. You can swap three points out of 1h spec into Focused Rage in case of rage starvation.
And lastly, not telling you "l2p", but I'd advise you stick with a cookie cutter prot build. Although the overkill on stuns (watch DR's!) might, with luck, help a great deal in PvP... They're hardly useful at all while soloing. And while instancing you only ever need them if you've got survivability issues. In almost any other case than that they're likely to leave you rage starved, on one-mob-pulls at least.
That's pretty much all the feedback I've got for you... back to my headache now, bye bye!
It may not follow logic, but it IS true. Here's a link to a reputable source for you. Granted, I already have it bookmarked, but honestly..I googled it afterwards and it took me about 2 minutes tops to find the page. This infomation isn't exactly secreted away. I DON'T post about those sorts of things unless I'm sure. Better to stay quiet if I don't know than to spread the wrong information. Fortunately I normally do my homework, and have for awhile. On my old warrior I tanked into SSC/TK (which I realize IS not uber or anything, but it was also 4 months ago when that was still somewhat of an accomplishment, and it ALSO meant I had to have known was I was doing.) I also raid tanked pre-BC. Most of the time when I post on talents and things of that nature, I've done my research either then, or in the past.
Ciderhelm's Guide to tanking - Official WoW forums. There's one respected source for you. Anyone that has read Ciderhelm's guide has to respect the guy for the research and time he's put into tanking. I've tested a lot of what he says, and trust his experience. This guide can also be found on theoryspot, a reputable resource for tanking information.
P.S.: From a logic standpoint, you actually can make sense of the specialization increasing SS damage. Warriors on the field of battle would commonly use their shield as a weapon. It was one of the things that made the use of a shield useful, aside from obviously being able to deflect attacks. A skilled fighter could use the shield to as a bludgeon to attack his opponents with in conjunction with attacks from his sword. So really it would make less sense in my eyes if it didn't increase SS damage.
Edited, Jan 1st 2008 1:27pm by FletusSanguine
Ciderhelm's Guide to tanking - Official WoW forums. There's one respected source for you. Anyone that has read Ciderhelm's guide has to respect the guy for the research and time he's put into tanking. I've tested a lot of what he says, and trust his experience. This guide can also be found on theoryspot, a reputable resource for tanking information.
P.S.: From a logic standpoint, you actually can make sense of the specialization increasing SS damage. Warriors on the field of battle would commonly use their shield as a weapon. It was one of the things that made the use of a shield useful, aside from obviously being able to deflect attacks. A skilled fighter could use the shield to as a bludgeon to attack his opponents with in conjunction with attacks from his sword. So really it would make less sense in my eyes if it didn't increase SS damage.
Edited, Jan 1st 2008 1:27pm by FletusSanguine
Just in relation to the stun thing - do stuns affect aggro at all?
It seems like I lose aggro, or ther people gain it during/after a stun sometimes.
It seems like I lose aggro, or ther people gain it during/after a stun sometimes.
6 posts
running here a 25/5/31 build and i like it solo . Got 4/5 mace and shieldslam
grinding is fun with stun ( use the time that mob is stunned to get a shout up again or take a potion) . tanking with mace is another thing its just to slow ( 2.6) so i take a sword to keep my rage up . But OT with mace is np and the ranged dps`s like the stun :).
lose aggro is not a problem thrash mobs never stand up again.
grinding is fun with stun ( use the time that mob is stunned to get a shout up again or take a potion) . tanking with mace is another thing its just to slow ( 2.6) so i take a sword to keep my rage up . But OT with mace is np and the ranged dps`s like the stun :).
lose aggro is not a problem thrash mobs never stand up again.
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