I just respecced to the 0/21/40 build that is so popular nowadays and am really happy with it. 7k SB crits are lots of fun.
I have one problem though. While I was always #1 on DPS I was only #3 on damage done and that by a far margin below #2. As affliction I was usually very close to that top spot but had lower dps.
So now I am confused. I know dps only counts time spent in combat but if time in combat is comparatively equal, how can the SPriest/Rogue be beating me by close to 100k damage? And on Prince last night I had 900 dps and was still 10k lower than the SPriest who had about 820. No deaths for either of us.
Any explanations other than recount being a stupid damage meter :P (it's what we were all using and the numbers came up almost identical for all 3 of us).
My current spell rotation is CoS, Corr, Imm, SB spam, renew DoTs, SB spam, etc. I dont use corruption on trash as the mobs die before it can finish. Should I cut immolate out of my trash mob cycle too?
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I'm confused about spell rotationsFollow
Meter's which include trash for dmg are pretty meaningless, usually for ego buffing of the players who do more dmg on the trash than on the bosses... usally mages or rogues, sometimes locks if there's a lot of soc going on.
First off forget corruption, as its not improved its a waste of cast time which can be used for 7k bolts, I'd just look who's in your group, CoS or CoE depending on whos in group and if your only lock, trinket, immolate, sb spammage, rinse repeat trinket when up, immolate, sb spammage. It's timing when to tap which can mess up your dmg or forgetting to trinket etc.
As for trash stick to either CoS/CoE sb spam or throw in an immolate if the mob will take a bit long to down, otherwise just CoS/CoE sb spam.
First off forget corruption, as its not improved its a waste of cast time which can be used for 7k bolts, I'd just look who's in your group, CoS or CoE depending on whos in group and if your only lock, trinket, immolate, sb spammage, rinse repeat trinket when up, immolate, sb spammage. It's timing when to tap which can mess up your dmg or forgetting to trinket etc.
As for trash stick to either CoS/CoE sb spam or throw in an immolate if the mob will take a bit long to down, otherwise just CoS/CoE sb spam.
k, well as a dest lock. for trash mobs that last less than 15 seconds, just SB them. for ones that last over 20seconds. immolate + SB. ones that last over 30seconds. CoA, imm+SB.
for bosses.
CoD (if you're not on CoS/CoE/CoRec duty). immolate + SB rotation. no conflagorate, no incinerate, no corruption (certain bosses where you move alot like prince/gruul it can be worth it also if your gear is below par for dest. also if you have 10+% spell haste, then corruption > immolate).
also. what's your +hit, +dmg and crit% like?
also, to explain the dps to damage difference. dot heavy / physical damage classes hit the target alot more often, but for lower numbers, so their dps is calculated to be a lower number as they're dealing lower damage but for a longer sustained period of time. the 0/21/40 spec though doesn't rely to much on dots (still needs them though) and so hits hard but slow, so getting a higher dps BUT on bosses that require movement your total damage can be lower due to larger periods of time where you're dealing little to no damage.
finally.. i'm going to make a little guestimation and say that 'cos you're doing kara and you're not even breaking the 1k dps point that you don't have over 170 hit. that you probably don't have 20+% crit. that you don't have over 1000+dmg and that you don't have over 8k hp and mana before buffs. in which case no wonder you're dealing less damage as 0/21/40 than afliction because you simply don't have the gear to accomodate for the spec.
POST EDIT
mangia. actually corruption IS a dps increase if you're at the lowest gear level for dest. for certain bosses and if you have the right upper gear level for dest (which includes 1.4+k +dmg and over 10% spell haste)
Edited, Dec 30th 2007 10:35am by Jenovaomega
for bosses.
CoD (if you're not on CoS/CoE/CoRec duty). immolate + SB rotation. no conflagorate, no incinerate, no corruption (certain bosses where you move alot like prince/gruul it can be worth it also if your gear is below par for dest. also if you have 10+% spell haste, then corruption > immolate).
also. what's your +hit, +dmg and crit% like?
also, to explain the dps to damage difference. dot heavy / physical damage classes hit the target alot more often, but for lower numbers, so their dps is calculated to be a lower number as they're dealing lower damage but for a longer sustained period of time. the 0/21/40 spec though doesn't rely to much on dots (still needs them though) and so hits hard but slow, so getting a higher dps BUT on bosses that require movement your total damage can be lower due to larger periods of time where you're dealing little to no damage.
finally.. i'm going to make a little guestimation and say that 'cos you're doing kara and you're not even breaking the 1k dps point that you don't have over 170 hit. that you probably don't have 20+% crit. that you don't have over 1000+dmg and that you don't have over 8k hp and mana before buffs. in which case no wonder you're dealing less damage as 0/21/40 than afliction because you simply don't have the gear to accomodate for the spec.
POST EDIT
mangia. actually corruption IS a dps increase if you're at the lowest gear level for dest. for certain bosses and if you have the right upper gear level for dest (which includes 1.4+k +dmg and over 10% spell haste)
Edited, Dec 30th 2007 10:35am by Jenovaomega
Trash CoS->SB spam
Boss CoS->SB spam :P
In kara you probably don't have the crit + damage to make 0/21/40 better then UA though, its usually around mid-late SSC/TK that you really start gearing up in T5 crit gear.
Boss CoS->SB spam :P
In kara you probably don't have the crit + damage to make 0/21/40 better then UA though, its usually around mid-late SSC/TK that you really start gearing up in T5 crit gear.
ignore anyone who says "only spam SB+respective curse". they're wrong. the ONLY time you spam SB only is if you have no spell haste. over 30% crit, 202 hit and over 1400+dmg. so in otherwords. like 1% of all raiding warlocks have the gear for it. otherwise. dots are worth it. also
CoD > CoS for solo dps. get some other lock to do CoS ;)
CoD > CoS for solo dps. get some other lock to do CoS ;)
I dunno, my numbers are less then those and I really tested both, I did more dps spamming shadowbolts.
Hehe,another discussion on something that has been proven already.
Ah well,guess Jen will pull math&numbers now.
Ah well,guess Jen will pull math&numbers now.
He's probably banging his head against the desk right now :P
Ah I forgot to say when I was raiding, I was part of a really nice group, boomkin, ele shaman, shadow priest and fire mage. I forget my exact numbers now, I haven't raided in quite a while and I've been SL/SL for a long time now. I know I had 202 spell hit, and ~1200 shadow damage with fel armor. Add another 100 from wrath of air, the 5% crit from boomkin put me around 29-31% or so. And potions and all that, I was probably at 1200 spell damage/1475 shadow damage in raids.
Ah I forgot to say when I was raiding, I was part of a really nice group, boomkin, ele shaman, shadow priest and fire mage. I forget my exact numbers now, I haven't raided in quite a while and I've been SL/SL for a long time now. I know I had 202 spell hit, and ~1200 shadow damage with fel armor. Add another 100 from wrath of air, the 5% crit from boomkin put me around 29-31% or so. And potions and all that, I was probably at 1200 spell damage/1475 shadow damage in raids.
i can't be ***** to do the maths 'cos i've done it plenty of times before and you all know i'm right. so yeah. L2P you nubs. also if you had those stats then yeah, did you not see the "SB only works with these minimum stats", which with all those buffs you do hit. nub
Edited, Dec 30th 2007 7:35pm by Jenovaomega
Edited, Dec 30th 2007 7:35pm by Jenovaomega
Jen, fully raid buffed I hit 1200 +damage, am hit capped. 11k health, 10k mana, and have 27% crit (without our moonkin). I definitely have the stats to raid as this spec.
So yeah, have cut Corruption out of my rotation and have seen quite a significant increase.
Thanks :)
So yeah, have cut Corruption out of my rotation and have seen quite a significant increase.
Thanks :)
np. do ZA, get some haste and you can chuck corruption back in ^^ lol
Funny how he's below the stats you listed and still doing more damage without corruption. Nub.
here we go again^^
happy new year, btw.
luv you all, even though you guys are asses an rate me down all the time.
i kicked corruption from my rotation as well, when i am specced destro, i just do my curse -> immolate -> SB spam
happy new year, btw.
luv you all, even though you guys are asses an rate me down all the time.
i kicked corruption from my rotation as well, when i am specced destro, i just do my curse -> immolate -> SB spam
mike. he's above the minimum stats where both dots are beneficial but below the point where SB only is best, so he should be using SB+imm, which i believe is what he means when he said "i dropped cor". sb + imm will be the best choice for his stats. so L2lock mike, thought i had proved plenty of times you're a nub
Edited, Jan 1st 2008 12:56pm by Jenovaomega
Edited, Jan 1st 2008 12:56pm by Jenovaomega
lol, as usual, Jen's Math is correct. Immolate = dps increase, Corr = dps decrease.
Hit 980 dps in Zul'Aman on Sunday night. Was crazy stuff, our entire dps team was hitting over 1k (except for me - but I'm the least geared by a lot).
So yeah, when Shadow damage hits 1200 unbuffed I'll try putting corr. in again :)
Hit 980 dps in Zul'Aman on Sunday night. Was crazy stuff, our entire dps team was hitting over 1k (except for me - but I'm the least geared by a lot).
So yeah, when Shadow damage hits 1200 unbuffed I'll try putting corr. in again :)
seeing as you're doing ZA. get the badges offhand, ZA neck, shoulders, feet + bracers of nimble thought crafted and you'll have about 13% spell haste. try using corruption over immolate then. you should find a nice change ;)
the problem as usual is the juggle between +hit, +spelldmg, +spellcrit and now +spellhaste, but please feel free to post your results and choice of gear.
Edited, Jan 1st 2008 6:14pm by Oakenwrath
Edited, Jan 1st 2008 6:14pm by Oakenwrath
crit is the least beneficial of all stats for all warlocks specs, so as long as you can keep your crit rate above the 'minimum' for that spec (with a ruin based builds being the only one with a base crit rate of about 20% including devestation) then stacking for the other stats is more beneficial. until you hit their 'caps' (202 for hit, no cap for +dmg. current 'cap' for haste is 21% with complete full haste gear, though if you do the maths. the real 'cap' is at 40% where shadowbolt becomes a 1.5second cast and so no more haste is beneficial (presuming 0 latency or a very good /stopcasting macro. including these it's probably more around 45-50% depending on connection speed and distance from server)
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