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Crystalforged War Axe... downgrade????Follow

#1 Dec 27 2007 at 4:19 AM Rating: Decent
Just purchased a nice shiny [wowitem=31291]Crystalforged War Axe[/wowitem] as an upgrade.
Picked it over my fist weapons:

[wowitem=30277]Ripfang Paw[/wowitem] and [wowitem=29372]Void-Talon[/wowitem]

My ranged tooltip DPS has gone down, that can't be right surely???
The Axe gives me 80 AP and the fists give me 84 (including agility)
But I would have thought the crit rating would effect it!

Does melee weapon skill effect the ranged dps??

Can someone offer guidance?
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#2 Dec 27 2007 at 4:35 AM Rating: Good
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nope, but crit isnt calculated in tooltip dps ;)
Its the dps you'd do with 0% crit, never missing and only autoshooting.
#3 Dec 27 2007 at 6:00 AM Rating: Decent
Aethien wrote:
nope, but crit isnt calculated in tooltip dps ;)
Its the dps you'd do with 0% crit, never missing and only autoshooting.


Hazaa! Thank you Aethien, that makes sense.

I can pony up for Savagery now!
#4 Dec 27 2007 at 6:10 AM Rating: Good
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Its also why its not a very reliable measurement, 5% chance to miss and ~20% chance to crit already makes a big difference in dps, not to mention a shooting cycle.




Disclaimer: I'm not 100% sure i did this math correctly, so if someone can verify that would be nice =P

The easiest way to calculate your true autoshot dps is (<tooltipdps> x <critchance>) + (<tooltipdps> x <chance to hit>) = <true autoshotdps>

for example with 300 tooltip dps, 20% crit and no +hit (so 95% chance to hit or 91 on bosses):
(300 x 0.2) + (300 x 0.95) = 345, so a difference of 15%...
#5 Dec 27 2007 at 6:21 AM Rating: Excellent
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Kelnoen wrote:
Aethien wrote:
nope, but crit isnt calculated in tooltip dps ;)
Its the dps you'd do with 0% crit, never missing and only autoshooting.


Hazaa! Thank you Aethien, that makes sense.

I can pony up for Savagery now!


I wouldn't waste the G to enchant it. You can get a much, much better weapon for very little effort. Join a 5v5 team(can even be a crappy on). Make sure your team gets 10 games played a week and you are part of 30%(or is it 40% I forget) of those games, and earn your Arena points.

1000 points gets you Vengeful Gladiator's Waraxe

Pop a +35 agi enchant on that bad boy and it's better than any non-raid item out there.

1000 points takes about 4 weeks to get even in a low 1400s 5v5 team.

Edit: removed my wrong info about multiple teams earns you more weekly points.

Edited, Dec 27th 2007 11:41am by SynnTastic
#6 Dec 27 2007 at 8:32 AM Rating: Good


You only get points for one of your teams per week. The highest earning team will be the one that gives you your points for that week. A 5v5 with 1450 rating earns 25% (not sure on the math) more arena points then a 2v2 with 1450 rating.

Am fairly positive that the new arena axe is the best 2H you will see until t6. And boy are people ******** we get it for 1000 points when others have to drop 3250.

Edited, Dec 27th 2007 11:34am by ithikul
#7 Dec 27 2007 at 1:51 PM Rating: Good
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Make sure you are looking at your Ranged DPS, not yoru melee, your melee will drop since the skill hasnt been maxed since you have been dual wielding, so make sure you are looking at ranged :) (I did this once, that is why I am mentioning it)
#8 Dec 27 2007 at 4:59 PM Rating: Good
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Caldone the Shady wrote:
Make sure you are looking at your Ranged DPS, not yoru melee, your melee will drop since the skill hasnt been maxed since you have been dual wielding, so make sure you are looking at ranged :) (I did this once, that is why I am mentioning it)


I did this once as well. I was looking at my melee dps for whatever reason, a few hours go by, I bought Valanos' Bow, and I equipped it, equiped my quiver with the same speed increase, and it took me about an hour to figure out why in the hell my attack speed was 3.50.
#9 Dec 28 2007 at 4:56 AM Rating: Decent
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ithikul wrote:
Am fairly positive that the new arena axe is the best 2H you will see until t6.
Yup, just as much as lvl 70 greens are better then beastlord.

Its the best pre-raid axe i'll admit that.
But Legacy is at least equal to it and i'm pretty sure that there are some weapons in T5 content for hunters.
#10 Dec 31 2007 at 9:24 AM Rating: Excellent
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[wowitem=34014]Waraxe[/wowitem] [wowitem=28587]Legacy[/wowitem]

compare 28 AP(legacy) to 1.09% crit, .95% hit, 98 ignore armor (waraxe), not to mention some extra stamina. The 8 Mp5 on the legacy is nice but imo does not compare to the stats on the waraxe. Using some rough math I would say that the 28AP would be worse even if all the waraxe had extra was the crit. They are in no way equal.

Of course a SV hunter would go for Legacy, but for everyone else, get the Waraxe and put some mana oil on it.

Math: generally assume .2% crit is slightly better then 8 AP.

Edited, Dec 31st 2007 11:30am by Xsarus
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#11 Jan 01 2008 at 9:31 AM Rating: Good
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my bad, i've still got the old legacy in mind with a high amount of int instaed of stamina...

And i'm sure there still are some weapons for hunter in t5 content =P

Twinblade

jup, thats one weapon pre- T6 that is definately better...




Damn, i thought we had more options oO

#12 Jan 01 2008 at 7:06 PM Rating: Excellent
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Assuming you gemmed it with 8agi, 8 crit and 4 agi+4sta

twinblade:

130 AP
2.345 % crit

WarAxe

92 AP
2.09% crit
.95% hit
98 ignore armor

Comparison

(38 AP and .252% crit) vs. (.95% hit and 98 ignore armor.)

If you equalize (hit and crit and ap) you get

10 AP vs 98 ignore armor. Tough call, I don't understand ignore armor enough to make the call here, but it's not that definitive. If the gear you have pushes you to hit cap then the twinblade is better. If not I'd have to give the waraxe the edge.

I'm not in T5 content though, how is the hit rating on those items? pretty good? I know in T4 content, I don't have to worry about getting enough hit, although there are a lot of items I'm trying to juggle.
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#13 Jan 02 2008 at 7:41 AM Rating: Excellent
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SynnTastic wrote:
I wouldn't waste the G to enchant it. You can get a much, much better weapon for very little effort. Join a 5v5 team(can even be a crappy on). Make sure your team gets 10 games played a week and you are part of 30%(or is it 40% I forget) of those games, and earn your Arena points.


I have never PvPed in my entire life. I had a bad experience in my first MMORPG that isn’t worth going into. So I tend to loath PvP. Heck, I don’t even duel. Should I even consider getting this weapon on one of my 70 hunters? I don’t want to completely destroy other people’s fun because I don’t have a clue as to what I’m doing.
#14 Jan 02 2008 at 8:07 AM Rating: Good
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Calabar, find a friend in game and start a 2v2 team with them.

Heck, get another hunter and you can both work towards your waraxe at the same time.

There is literally no reason why a 70 hunter should not have the Vengeful Gladiator's Waraxe within 3-4 weeks of dinging 70.
#15 Jan 02 2008 at 8:49 AM Rating: Excellent
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You can just lose and get it in 4 weeks. I would suggest giving arena's a try. You'll lose at first until you get into a ranking where you fit. Find some good add-ons and learn how to pvp, and it's actually a lot of fun.

I never enjoyed pvp much, but lately our arena team is getting better, and now that we understand how to play it's becoming a lot of fun. There's no camping, or ganking, people can't sneak up on you. (well there is stealth, but at least you know they are there) and you'll never have 3 people beating on one over and over. That being said, not everyone enjoys it, so have fun either way.
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#16 Jan 02 2008 at 10:11 AM Rating: Decent
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thats what i did aswell, teamed up with another hunter friend(just turned 70) and meraid spec with very low hp. ofc the plan on my side was just doing 10games a week, win or lose, to my surprise 2 hunters acually worked better than expected, have about 50/50 wins. unfortunatly i dont have the axe yet since the first week acually was the only week we have made 10 games sofar since i find it so damn boring, but like others have said all you need is 10games/week for 4 weeks and its yours wether you win or lose.
and to be honest it looks better than the toy axe(legacy)
#17 Jan 02 2008 at 11:33 AM Rating: Excellent
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It just occurred to me that since I have two accounts I could just form my own 2x2 team if all I wanted to do was go in and get my virtual butt handed to me. Is something like that frowned upon?
#18 Jan 02 2008 at 12:12 PM Rating: Good
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nope, in fact some people play 5 characters at once.

Edited, Jan 2nd 2008 2:13pm by Xsarus
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#19 Jan 02 2008 at 8:32 PM Rating: Decent
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not sure if its against the rules or not, kinda doubt dual boxing is allowed, but yea it would def be the easiest way and im sure there are loads of ppl out there doing it, just wish you didnt need 2 accounts for it, would be perfect beeing able to equip my alts from instances/group quests this way :P
#20 Jan 02 2008 at 10:07 PM Rating: Decent
Dualboxing? Heh, some fellow did a full 40 man MC run pre-tbc all by his lonesome. And that was with Blizzard's blessing. As long as he didn't use third party programs, and had an account for each player it was fine. He apparently controlled nine people with one "group leader". He controlled four groupleaders separately, and the rest worked mostly with macroes and so on.

Can you imagine the leveling though? He said he leveled one party at a time. Five people with the best possible group setup running through all quests and instances, all controlled by yourself and all loot/gear/objectives are for you. It must have been awesome.
#21 Jan 02 2008 at 10:28 PM Rating: Decent
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havent seen that one did watch some vids of 5man boxing, SM among others, looks pretty funny something like lemmings vs wow :P
#22 Jan 03 2008 at 6:41 AM Rating: Excellent
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I have two PCs and two accounts, so I’m not worried about breaking any rules as such. But as I’ve never even dueled another player before, I’d be entering the combat fully intending to throw myself upon my opponent’s sword. I’ll attempt to draw a bit of blood before I die, but my second character will be doing little more than auto following. So what I’m really worried about is ruining the experience for someone else because I won’t be putting up much of a fight.

But to be honest, the thought of getting that axe for my hunter and something else nice for whatever other character I take in, possibly my druid, is very tempting.
#23 Jan 03 2008 at 6:50 AM Rating: Good
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Calabar wrote:
I have two PCs and two accounts, so I’m not worried about breaking any rules as such. But as I’ve never even dueled another player before, I’d be entering the combat fully intending to throw myself upon my opponent’s sword. I’ll attempt to draw a bit of blood before I die, but my second character will be doing little more than auto following. So what I’m really worried about is ruining the experience for someone else because I won’t be putting up much of a fight.

But to be honest, the thought of getting that axe for my hunter and something else nice for whatever other character I take in, possibly my druid, is very tempting.


I would welcome it. One win for me I love it lol. I've actually had some go in neekid and we win in a matter of seconds, it's a win/win. One team is getting their 10 games and ultimately points to gear up and the other team is getting a win and rank up. I don't know anyone that would complain about something like that.

Who knows you might actually win some. It can't hurt to try it out.
#24 Jan 03 2008 at 7:22 AM Rating: Excellent
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Well, what the heck? I’ll give it a shot. But… umm… that leads to a newbie question. How?

I know absolutely nothing about this side of the game. What zone do I need to go to? How do I actually enter… whatever this thing is called?

Edit:

Oh, and what is the level limit. Can I take a level 67 druid or a 63 priest or can only level 70s enter?

Edit 2:

Wowwiki is my friend. I found what I was looking for here http://www.wowwiki.com/Arena_PvP_System and here http://www.wowwiki.com/Arena_Rewards.



Edited, Jan 3rd 2008 10:23am by Calabar
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