S1 on Honorgrind, thinking of daggers/mutilateFollow

So, been doing the ShS, HARP and now considering grinding for some S1 daggers and give Mutilate a spin.

Do mostly BG's and arenas (2v2 and 3v3), not high ranked or anything but doing ok.

Now, whenever I've done Mutilate I've always put 20pts in Combat for S&D, DW and Imp Sprint.
Been thinking now about chucking them into Sub tree instead for Oppo, MoD and Dirty Tricks+SB. I haven't used Ambush as an opener since I levelled but next patch is supposed to buff it.

http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=fMe0RxTsikVoZEM0c0h

There is a build that I'm thinking about taking for a spin, please comment upon it.


Edited, Dec 23rd 2007 11:48am by TheSmisker


Ps. I realize you will comment (among other things) on Remorseless attacks, that is for BG's where I find it very useful as I often get the killing blow. Ds.

Edited, Dec 23rd 2007 11:50am by TheSmisker

Thx mate, should comment that Ive been mutilating from 55 to 70 but when I went raiding switched to Combat swords instead.

Imp EA and Remorseless attacks are the dubious ones but I like me my EA. In 3v3 w my Feral drood, it really makes a difference when we focus on non-platers.

Must say I never missed Imp. Gouge as much as I thought I would. Usually bleeds/crips/etc makes sure I wont get out of range/combat. I use it as a stopper mostly and for positioning.

My main concern is:
Ambush viable as opener?

41/20/0 is better for both PvE and PvP, actually.


Holy bad advice, Batman! Expose Armor is one of the best finishers we get in PvP. Hit anything in leather or lower with a 5 point Improved EA and they're down to 0 armor. That's about a 25% increase in damage.


1. Kidney shot, not Kidney Punch.
2. Eviscerate is bad in PvP.
3. Envenom is bad in PvP.
4. Rupture is bad in PvP on most classes.

Your primary finishers in PvP are Slice and Dice, Expose Armor and Kidney Shot.


This build is bad. Especially Remorseless, that talent is REALLY bad, especially for Arena. Zomg, more crit on one ability after I get a killing blow on one of their teammates! In 2v2, if you do get the killing blow, chances are the fight's over anyway. In 3v3 and 5v5, you don't often get the killing blows. The talent just fails.


Nope.


And that's a MASSIVE problem. Every class is going to turn around and wtfpwn you in the face, or kite you. Control is the name of the game in PvP.


No, it's not. I can do more damage in the 4 second stun from CS than you can with Ambush, I guarantee.


No, it's not. If it doesn't crit, it does crap damage. Use CS always, unless you're fighting a mage (and even then it can be good if they don't have room to blink away).

Now, for those of you thinking of going 4X/00/XX, just don't. Go Combat Mutilate if you really want to use Mutilate. Guess how many snare breaking abilities you have as Subtlety Mutilate. One. Two if you can cloak the snare off. This build gives you more flexibility, and more sustained damage to boot.

Have fun getting owned by 90% of rogues who do have MoD.

Winning you games? No. But getting busted in stealth by every rogue with MoD is definately a disadvantage, you'll never get openers against other rogue teams and start fights with no stun control or CP's built. All for what, imp sprint and duel wield?

Many thanks to all. Gives food for thoughts as all opinions and statements are evident of a willingness to support and help the Rogue community world-wide.

Personally writing from Stockholm Sweden, where sadly no snow has fallen this year.
Merry X-mas and a jolly good New Year to all of you!