Who says warriors can't DPS?Follow

Earlier I talked about my issue with switching from a prot warrior to an arms warrior and how it pretty much eliminated me from being invited to any groups. Well with some significant boosts in strength, agility and attack power, I've become a force to reckon with against so called DPS classes. When I tell people who invite me that I'm an arms warrior and I DPS in groups I get laughed at and called an idiot. Well heres a story that should put that to rest.

I was guarding tower point in AV when I got jumped by a lvl 60 rogue and a lvl 60 mage. SO you would think that I would get dropped pretty fast right? Not in this case. I dropped the rogue in about 4 hits and commenced annihilating the mage. He put up a better fight but he made the mistake of immobilizing me (second wind= 10% health regen) and not getting as far away as possible. Instead he just ran around in circles hitting me with spells in the tiny flag room. Every pass he made I hit him with about 760 damage and once I was free all it took was a mortal strike and execution. 2 down and 60% health.

So then a lvl 59 hunter shows up a split second after the mage dies and I drop him in about 6 hits. Now I'm down to about 40% health. Before I get a chance to sit down and have some pie a lvl 60 warrior busts in and starts hitting me with all hes got. I'm a little worried because I'm really close to 20% and an execute might finish me off.After a while I got a good hit in when he turned around and bailed. He jumped off the tower and I thought he was dead but he started running when that rend I gave him did 60 damage and he dropped.

QFT.

The fact is that a Normal DPS class has more to offer a group than just DPS.

Mages: Sheep + frost nova (mass rooting ability) + decurse
Rogues: Sap (If Engineer a possible Wipe prevention due to Vanish and jumpercables)
Warlock: Seduce + Soul Stone +water breathing + CoR (for keeping mobs that are famous for running in the fight to be finished off)(I'm sure they got more just can't think of it.)
Hunter: Traps, Wing Clip, (IE the ability to CC anything not immune to Ice or CC in general) (and again if Engineer a possible wipe prevention with Feign Death and Jumpercables)
Shamans: Totems (buff and debuff kind), Wipe prevention due to reincarnation. (Not sure what else)
Boomkins: MotW, In combat Res.
Shadow Priests: Buffs, + Off heal ability in case of MH death early or the need arised for it.
(Again I am sure there are more... But I can't remember all the reasons why people like them.)


Warriors. A shout that lasts maybe 5 minutes? The only one being really any good for me is the one that gives a health buff. No CC abilities other than hamstring which can be taken care of by Mages or a Hunter's wingclip or a shamans earth bind totem.

In general if you don't know the Warrior's ability the chances of getting asked to DPS for a group is lower than having a DPS class called to do it.

Sorry I wish I could help more but it happens. My best friend has the same problem being a 63 Fury warrior.

Good input. I'm just beginning to think that warriors are severely under rated in this game. I rarely run into a warrior on my server. Every BG I check the list to see how many warriors there are and there are usually about 2 or 3 between both sides. Mostly hunters of course. Maybe its the difficulty and skill it takes to be a successful warrior. Because when I play my warlock its just sit back and let the minion do all the work while I blast it from a safe distance. I went prot spec because early on in the game I didn't know what tanking was and everyone gave me some tips on what abilities to get and how to gear.

So all the way up until like lvl 45 I would tank instances, but as far as BG's and PvP went I would get destroyed everytime. But then again up till lvl 30 I ran into alot of twinks and I don't twink whatsoever. My warlock has to earn his own damn keep. I do keep a shield and a one hander in case I get in trouble but I have yet to break them out.

Warriors have always been my favorite class because I prefer to go toe to toe with my opponents rather than casting a million spells while jumping around in circles, or being invisible and taking a cheap shot at the worst possible moment. Having fun is way more important to me than winning.

as it have been said before, warriors can be great dps.. i dont think anyone disputes that..
it is pure and simple that we dont have any good CC ability, and only shouts for buffs, that puts us in a tight spot.
this is just something we have to accept.. a group needs a tank, a healer, and then 3 dps classes.. what is needed from the dps is diferent from instances..
for most normal instances i would say 1 CC class can handle whats needed, but in heroics and the more hardcore normals often 2 CC classes will help alot..
this leaves only 1 spot open for a pure dps class, and so this is where we have to compete with shammys, shadowpriests, druids ect.. so ofcause its bound to be hard getting into a random group for anything tough when all you offer is dps, no matter how good it is.

and no warriors cant kite efficiently.. if you have to keep aggro on the target your kiting you have to be quite a bit in melee range. if you dont healer will get the aggro pretty fast, on heroics atleast..
the piercing howl is actualy a nice tool, but only for when the tank looses aggro on a target so he can get it back before it gets to casters

Buzak

I think some of you warriors need to understand the difference between the DMG that a warrior can do, versus the DPS (DAMAGE PER SECOND!). Yes, being arms puts out big numbers and we think we can then DPS in the PVE world, not the case every time, unless you have uber gear and the lolherald or equivalent.

To those CC fanatics, get a clue, its over rated! Oh no, the tank went down, lets just cc the mobs until they kill themselves! Yah, doubt it. Oh wait, we have this warrior decked out in some killer gear (or not)..the MT went down OH ****!! Any real warrior would realize that he can now put on a shield, switch to defensive stance and still tank the rest of the mob(s). (as it has been stated in a previous post). I don't know how many heroic wipes I have saved due to equipping a shield and spamming shield block, TC, DS, and SW if needed. Thank god we invited the DPS warrior instead of CC. I dunno...the whole CC thing just irritates me and its for the ones who don't know how the hell to play the game, plus its more fun w/o it.

If your tank is geared, then why the CC? I've run Heroic SP, UB, and SV with a Tankadin once and a warrior once, same results....myself, enhancement shaman, healadin, and one other class (lock maybe, can't remember) and we did just fine.

But remember, just because you can kill squishies in the BG's doesn't mean you can do the same to the elite mobs in instances. Please don't mistake DMG for DPS, its not the same. I think in one SSC run minus Lurker, I did a sustained 850~ DPS. If you get into a good raiding guild, and do the 2h junk and you're on top, find another guild cuz they're not gonna get too far. Anyways, I'm done ranting, its 3AM, can't sleep, and tired of 2h arms warriors thinking they can do DPS in instances. I just laugh at you because I can probably spec prot, wear my prot or dps gear, equip toothpicks and still kick your @ss in dps and dmg done. goodnight

Why exactly do you think that Arms warriors can't DPS? 31/30/0 is a pretty powerful PvE DPS build, and you'll do fine with it up through Kara and ZA. Prior to 25 mans, there really isn't enough gear to get a warrior to the hit/crit/AP numbers that a DW Fury warrior needs in order to shine (and where BT will out damage MS). You can however, be effective at 2h DPS. I know myself and others have used this build and done just fine.

I agree that Battle Shout is not ideal for groups...unless you are loaded up with rogues. However, Demo Shout is awesome. Reducing MAP from mobs can help significantly, and should not be underestimated as a group "buff".

Unless you're reaching a game-imposed limit of how many buffs can be placed on you and you want a more useful buff, why would you go out of your way to avoid getting Battle Shout, even going so far as to click it off after it's been applied? It's like having 4 Savagery enchants on the same weapon.

Edited, Dec 17th 2007 3:20pm by duvar

As I have said Before. It is "ABSOLUTELY USELESS" for a hunter that plays his class as it should be. MAP is garbage as "I DO NOT MELEE" I already stated this in the Prior post but aparently you didn't read it. So I will restate it a little bigger so you will catch the point.

I am a Hunter. I do NOT melee. Therefore MAP does not help me in any way shape or form as it does not convert to RAP. Complete waste of a buff slot. Even if I wasn't full I still take it off. No need for it.

In BGs I get it more times than not. Apparently the warriors there think 365 or what ever it is MAP is good for every class in the group... Yes even the Lock's, Mages and yup you guessed it, Priests.

You have something like 30 buff slots, and it's not a _targetted_ buff. It's a group buff only. If they use it, it'll go on everyone within range in your group... period, and always.

Is it useless for you? Yep, pretty much. But I don't go through the bother of clicking off Arcane Brilliance or group Divine Spirit, and they don't do me much good either.

You're like a caster throwing a hissy fit because you get Trueshot Aura and Leader of the Pack.

Group-wise, Warriors tend to slot into the same function as other hybrid DPS classes; Shadow Priests, non-Resto Shaman, Retadins, non-Resto Druids. Light on CC, except instead of being able to toss backup heals they can backup tank, and they provide valuable group buffs. The other difference between them and the other hybrid classes is their specialty is more focused on the AE damage rather than single-target; while they can do great single target, it's Sweeping Strikes/Whirlwind where they shine.

Correction, I am a Hunter stating to someone who is trying to say that I shouldn't click off a pointless buff for me.

As I said, in most of the Normal groups that I run with. The Warrior tends to use Battle shout more than the HP one. (sorry my Warrior isn't High enough to have it so I am not quite sure on the name)

When I am on my Warrior or Rogue and I get Arcane Intellect casted on me by some random mage I chuckle and click it off. When I am on my Mage or lock and get Blessing of Might I laugh and click it off. I appreciate the gesture and thank them but I still click it off as I don't need such buffs.

I do not get angry at them. I do however get angry at people telling me that I "should" keep it cause its like "4 Savagery Chants" on my wep. I know what helps me and what doesn't. If I get something that doesn't help me, then I remove it. Its like the Armor buff scrolls. I use them on my pet not me. In theory I should never be hit anyway.

Thank you for hopefully understanding what I was saying and paying a little closer attention to what others have said so I don't have to keep quoting people.

No ****, I'm pretty sure I said



So I'm not too sure what BG you're talking about. BG=Battle Ground. If you get the buff its because the warrior is buffing himself and you are in his group and range. Oh, I'm very awake now, but I'm not a hunter, never had any interest in hunters except killing/camping them, so I really don't know what order the talent tree's come in, therefore I dont know what spec your 0/gay/gay spec is. Oh, btw if you're in an instance and your TANK (the guy with the sheild taking the damage) is using Battle Shout, ask him politely to use Commanding Shout (quote that one since your warrior isn't high enough to know that its the health buff).

One more thing. Those "useless buffs" that you get in the BG's actually serve a purpose for the other guy who's purging them off your, or for the huntard who's arcane shooting you to death. Betcha didnt know your hunter friends were hitting you with that and taking your "precious buffs" away. So...by having useless ones, they get rid of them first, depending on when you got buffed. Goodbye and godspeed.

Oh but I am a hunter and I don't mind arcane Intellect or brilliance. Either one helps me. The fact was when I am on a warrior or Rogue neither of those help me. And I was stating when it was some passer by. Kind of the same as Battle shout except he is in my group. If I don't need the buff I don't keep it. Unless it is a 20+ min buff that can be stripped by an Arcane shot or a devour magic. I was just stating that in a PVE situation I don't keep buffs I don't need. The only BG I currently do is more of a PVE than PVP situation anyway. Most of the time you see maybe 10-15 enemy if we do like we ususally do.

My arguement was not with you RP and I hope you don't feel I am pickin one with you. I am just suggesting the lack of need to keep buffs that don't fit the situation. Now say if I were in AB, EotS or WSG then I would definately keep any that I got and hope those were the ones that got dispelled.

Now you may understand what I mean. But pigeon still needs to grow up a bit.