I was running Bot last night with a hunter that I swear to god made me so angry. He always laid his trap down as soon as the mob got to him.
I told him to put his trap out of the fight area so he did. but still drug the mob over there then laid trap.
I saw this and finally gave him the suggestion to lay it down before the fight and he said... Why?
When I told him it will help when a mob resists he said. Oh ok.
Then he would put his trap almost on top of mine. I went Irate at that poins. I said, WTF are you doing? go lay it somewhere away from mine. (He had just got me killed by getting both traps popping on his mob.)
Are people really this stupid? I mean it isn't that hard is it?
Lay down trap outside of fight area, Wait for CD, Then let tank know its good, pull your mob as they run to tank, trap 1 mob lay trap far enough away from that mob that when it breaks it will be retrapped almost imidiately... Am I giving people to much credit?
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Are people really this dense?Follow
Hey, at least he wasn't multi shot pulling and breaking his own trap like the lvl 68 Hunter did today in one of the pugs I was in.
1) Ghost Saber is awesome.
2) give him some credit... he's probably been forced to level SV from 10-70 and farm money for his flying to get to bot and hasnt had any experience with traps.
:D
2) give him some credit... he's probably been forced to level SV from 10-70 and farm money for his flying to get to bot and hasnt had any experience with traps.
:D
I'm a Tankadin, have almost no experience with traps, and even I had to lecture a Hunter on where to properly place his traps and get mobs to walk into them.
I guess what's common sense to some people is "Da pointy end gos whar????" to others.
I guess what's common sense to some people is "Da pointy end gos whar????" to others.
Well, there's a flip side to this.
Sometimes you're in a group where they won't let you have the TIME to setup a trap properly.
I always go to the side and as far away from the AoE damage as I can reasonably get. I drop the trap, get the target marked for me, HM the tanks first target so any other range combat sorts get the bonuses, and like to have only 10 seconds left on my trap CD before I give the RDY signal. This takes about 15-20 seconds to do. I've been in so many groups that can't 'wait' and then I have to clean up DURING the fight because they didn't give me the time necessary to setup.
Now in heroics, I know you are on a short clock and don't have much time to do this, but I'm talking normal instancing here. Hunters aren't the only ones that can get it wrong. I think the simple truth is when you are doing your job right, others don't appreciate just how much you do or are too impatient to let you.
Funny thing, in one of those groups I got called a Huntard by the impatient tank. I've never gone off on anyone in WoW... ever. I let that moron have it with both barrels. I left the group. The guy that put the group together PST'd me back and asked me to come back and kicked the tank. I did, we went through without further incident with a warrior 3 levels lower than the first guy but he knew how to tank. We didn't wipe once after that.
Patience and setup are what makes the Hunter's job easier. Impatience makes us to double and triple work. Just like perfect pulling takes time but no risk to the group.
Sometimes you're in a group where they won't let you have the TIME to setup a trap properly.
I always go to the side and as far away from the AoE damage as I can reasonably get. I drop the trap, get the target marked for me, HM the tanks first target so any other range combat sorts get the bonuses, and like to have only 10 seconds left on my trap CD before I give the RDY signal. This takes about 15-20 seconds to do. I've been in so many groups that can't 'wait' and then I have to clean up DURING the fight because they didn't give me the time necessary to setup.
Now in heroics, I know you are on a short clock and don't have much time to do this, but I'm talking normal instancing here. Hunters aren't the only ones that can get it wrong. I think the simple truth is when you are doing your job right, others don't appreciate just how much you do or are too impatient to let you.
Funny thing, in one of those groups I got called a Huntard by the impatient tank. I've never gone off on anyone in WoW... ever. I let that moron have it with both barrels. I left the group. The guy that put the group together PST'd me back and asked me to come back and kicked the tank. I did, we went through without further incident with a warrior 3 levels lower than the first guy but he knew how to tank. We didn't wipe once after that.
Patience and setup are what makes the Hunter's job easier. Impatience makes us to double and triple work. Just like perfect pulling takes time but no risk to the group.
I can still count on two hands the number of runs I've been on where the tank wanted the hunter to pull (misdirection, what's that?) or allowed time to place a trap and have it cool-down.
I don't have the problem in guild runs, they wait for the Hunters to setup... I agree, on PUGs it's more damage control than not. In the case I cited, the guy wouldn't even let healers or casters juice up.
We try to do things right, but sometimes we aren't allowed. Nobody ever said being a hunter was easy mode in a group... ^_^
We try to do things right, but sometimes we aren't allowed. Nobody ever said being a hunter was easy mode in a group... ^_^
9 posts
your right, it is rather simple. i never truly learned to trap till 56 when a guild member showed me how. but it took one try after tht and its the easiest thing ever. prolly was just over tired or just naturaly slow (poor guy)
My biggest problem with some idiot trapping wasnt actually a hunter, it was with the warrior. Rather than trust us to pull guys off into traps, he would pull into our traps. The problem being it then became a random mob that would get trapped, not necissarily who we wanted to.
Of course this warrior was an idiot...he took about 3 minutes to pull each group of mobs, and during that 3 minutes of down time seemed to be AFK (if me or the other hunter pulled, he wouldn't tank and our pets would have to).
Of course this warrior was an idiot...he took about 3 minutes to pull each group of mobs, and during that 3 minutes of down time seemed to be AFK (if me or the other hunter pulled, he wouldn't tank and our pets would have to).
9 posts
wow, that is rather bad. i always volunteer to mark cuz of people like him, that way if any1 is that bad i can kick him instantly :) makes u good at marking to
oh no! jack's here too! >.<
I always read his name as Clapjack...
I was just in a UB run yesterday, with an excessively aggressive tank. Sure, we had a 70 holy/disc priest that healed like mad, but I almost never could get to full mana. My hunter's mark was the only mark used. The tank didn't do any marks, so I just marked whatever he was hitting, and trapped something else.
I'm only a 62 BM with no SV talents, and I get constant compliments for my traps. And also for my pet tanking skills. I saved the group when everyone but me, my pet, the priest, and the shaman died. I was almost the whole DPS for the last 10% of a bog lord and 3 underbats.
I can't stand people who can't even single-trap right.. It's so simple!
1. /cast Freezing Trap 30 seconds before a pull.
2. Shoot repeatedly at a mob no one's attacking until it comes your way.
3. Target something else before it gets to you.
4. If it fails, cast another freezing trap.
5. If somehow that fails too, well.. then you're screwed. Feign death.
I'm only a 62 BM with no SV talents, and I get constant compliments for my traps. And also for my pet tanking skills. I saved the group when everyone but me, my pet, the priest, and the shaman died. I was almost the whole DPS for the last 10% of a bog lord and 3 underbats.
I can't stand people who can't even single-trap right.. It's so simple!
1. /cast Freezing Trap 30 seconds before a pull.
2. Shoot repeatedly at a mob no one's attacking until it comes your way.
3. Target something else before it gets to you.
4. If it fails, cast another freezing trap.
5. If somehow that fails too, well.. then you're screwed. Feign death.
Ehcks wrote:
5. If somehow that fails too, well.. then your group is screwed because when you feign, the mob will go to the healer.
Fixed.
Quote:
My biggest problem with some idiot trapping wasnt actually a hunter, it was with the warrior. Rather than trust us to pull guys off into traps, he would pull into our traps. The problem being it then became a random mob that would get trapped, not necissarily who we wanted to.
Of course this warrior was an idiot...he took about 3 minutes to pull each group of mobs, and during that 3 minutes of down time seemed to be AFK (if me or the other hunter pulled, he wouldn't tank and our pets would have to).
Of course this warrior was an idiot...he took about 3 minutes to pull each group of mobs, and during that 3 minutes of down time seemed to be AFK (if me or the other hunter pulled, he wouldn't tank and our pets would have to).
I hate that also, especially when the jerk-off acts like he's doing you a favor even when you yell him to stop.
ProjectMidnight wrote:
Ehcks wrote:
5. If somehow that fails too, well.. then your group is screwed because when you feign, the mob will go to the healer.
Fixed.
That's why I tend to use hunters as last-priority CC. If I'm wrangling the other mobs and I see the trap end, I can't tell whether to jump on the guy or not. Standard progression of the CC, from my side, looks the same as "we're all gonna DIE!"
Or course as a counterargument, rarely using hunters for CC means that I don't learn the signs that I need to jump on the guy.
And skribs, I'll see your "tanks who pull into the trap" and raise you a "hunters who put the trap under my feet".
"Skill is a measure of how fast a player can turn experience into competence." -- Anedris, EJ forums
You mind if I sig that?
You mind if I sig that?
selebrin of the Seven Seas wrote:
ProjectMidnight wrote:
Ehcks wrote:
5. If somehow that fails too, well.. then your group is screwed because when you feign, the mob will go to the healer.
Fixed.
That's why I tend to use hunters as last-priority CC. If I'm wrangling the other mobs and I see the trap end, I can't tell whether to jump on the guy or not. Standard progression of the CC, from my side, looks the same as "we're all gonna DIE!"
Or course as a counterargument, rarely using hunters for CC means that I don't learn the signs that I need to jump on the guy.
And skribs, I'll see your "tanks who pull into the trap" and raise you a "hunters who put the trap under my feet".
I completely agree that in PuGs it's smart to use hunters as a last resort. Sure, you could get a hunter that comes prepared with Macros to let the tank and healer know that a trap is done for, and the tank needs to pick it up... But you could also get a hunter that is mediocre to just plain bad, and doesn't give any sort of indication of anything. You could always try to ask if they can set up a macro to let everyone know, but there's a good chance you'll get a "Don't tell me how to play" response.
Does anyone know if Raid Warnings work in normal groups? I think that I've used it in a normal 5-man, but I can't clearly remember. It would probably be helpful to have a hunter yell it out in a raid warning.
Raid warning work in any group last I checked.
Mizzoulover wrote:
"Skill is a measure of how fast a player can turn experience into competence." -- Anedris, EJ forums
You mind if I sig that?
You mind if I sig that?
Fine with me. I just stumbled across it on the EJ forums one day and liked the way it was phrased. Keep the credit.
How about you put your trap as far away you can and soon you set your second trap some fire mage idiot pulls X or O or whatever was intended to be second or third target right into your second trap?
First mob is loose, CD is not up, and "zomg look at my dps" mage breaks the trap with frost nova.
Would he take a trouble to sheep the square that bashes on you? No way, its your mob and your problem.
I had warlocks dotting my seduced mob too.
Imo its those "run me through *insert the name of instance here" whiners that get to 70 being babysitted and never learned anything.
I would make impossible for players to enter instances if grouped with anyone like 5 levels lower than them.
First mob is loose, CD is not up, and "zomg look at my dps" mage breaks the trap with frost nova.
Would he take a trouble to sheep the square that bashes on you? No way, its your mob and your problem.
I had warlocks dotting my seduced mob too.
Imo its those "run me through *insert the name of instance here" whiners that get to 70 being babysitted and never learned anything.
I would make impossible for players to enter instances if grouped with anyone like 5 levels lower than them.
I ran Underbog the other day with some guild-mates. The funny thing is that I'm possibly one of the least experienced at instances within the guild. A lot of them run through stuff all the time, where as I've spent a lot of time just solo questing and farming. My pet-use and trapping experience mostly comes from common sense and my using skills to take on groups while questing (or during PvP). And I would have thought that raid symbols were easy to follow... Evidently not.
I pull the blue symbol mob away from the fight to my trap, pet off-tank the X symboled one and dps the skull. The mage goes ape-sh*t with damage and ends up getting aggro but instead of calling for help or running over to the tank, he backs up as fast as he can, towards me, pauses and starts blowing out AoE's that break my trap!
After working to bottle up the situation, the tank, boomkin druid and I drop the mobs... The mage dies and the priest narrowly avoids death. After we're settled, I politely make a note to say that traps can't be AoE'd near because they break - and the priest comes back by saying that it's my fault and I shouldn't have put my trap near the mage! O.o
I explain that the mage backed up to my trap and we move on. I get the blue symbol mob to my trap and send in the pet to the X. Bam! Boomkin shoots my trap like a redneck who's out hunting. He then starts shooting at the X being off-tanked by my pet so I figure it was an accident. I have my traps CD ok, so I drop another and focus on the dps target.... Bam! Green magical **** hits my trap again and the boomkin starts blasting with wild abandon.
***** it, he's a moonkin, he can handle some beating. I let him take the aggro and I concentrate on my job. Eventually the smoke clears and someone asks me where my trapping was. I explain that it was accidently shot (I don't want to accuse Mr. Boom Boom of purposefully sabotaging our run). But the druid argues and claims he was shooting at the unmarked target, to keep it covered. Unmarked? So, I point out the blue marker that clearly symbolises "Freeze this *****".
Boom Boom shrugs it off and accepts this without rudeness, which is ok by me if it was a mistake on one occasion. Until the tank politely (although warningly) tells me that I should practice my trapping and keep on top of it, or groups won't let me in because I might make it unsafe for them. ><
I... Hfhg... The trap is an inanimate object. It doesn't tell the difference between friendly fire, accidents or idiocy. The scary thing is that the priest also has a 70 hunter alt and was giving me "advice" about how to practice trapping!
Yes, many hunters are huntards and should probably die. But maybe everyone should roll a hunter at some point - so they at least understand the mechanics and abilities of the class. Or even just the dynamic of group work.
I pull the blue symbol mob away from the fight to my trap, pet off-tank the X symboled one and dps the skull. The mage goes ape-sh*t with damage and ends up getting aggro but instead of calling for help or running over to the tank, he backs up as fast as he can, towards me, pauses and starts blowing out AoE's that break my trap!
After working to bottle up the situation, the tank, boomkin druid and I drop the mobs... The mage dies and the priest narrowly avoids death. After we're settled, I politely make a note to say that traps can't be AoE'd near because they break - and the priest comes back by saying that it's my fault and I shouldn't have put my trap near the mage! O.o
I explain that the mage backed up to my trap and we move on. I get the blue symbol mob to my trap and send in the pet to the X. Bam! Boomkin shoots my trap like a redneck who's out hunting. He then starts shooting at the X being off-tanked by my pet so I figure it was an accident. I have my traps CD ok, so I drop another and focus on the dps target.... Bam! Green magical **** hits my trap again and the boomkin starts blasting with wild abandon.
***** it, he's a moonkin, he can handle some beating. I let him take the aggro and I concentrate on my job. Eventually the smoke clears and someone asks me where my trapping was. I explain that it was accidently shot (I don't want to accuse Mr. Boom Boom of purposefully sabotaging our run). But the druid argues and claims he was shooting at the unmarked target, to keep it covered. Unmarked? So, I point out the blue marker that clearly symbolises "Freeze this *****".
Boom Boom shrugs it off and accepts this without rudeness, which is ok by me if it was a mistake on one occasion. Until the tank politely (although warningly) tells me that I should practice my trapping and keep on top of it, or groups won't let me in because I might make it unsafe for them. ><
I... Hfhg... The trap is an inanimate object. It doesn't tell the difference between friendly fire, accidents or idiocy. The scary thing is that the priest also has a 70 hunter alt and was giving me "advice" about how to practice trapping!
Yes, many hunters are huntards and should probably die. But maybe everyone should roll a hunter at some point - so they at least understand the mechanics and abilities of the class. Or even just the dynamic of group work.
I soloed a lot of my leveling too and I found being able to chain trap a great thing before I even thought of going into some instance.
I had trap/stopattack and pull/stopcasting macros hotkeyed at level 40 or so.
When I started grouping for instances I downloaded one useful little addon - its called CC Breaker.
I would recommend it to everyone who has to argue over who and why broke whatever CC.
When we had to get a PuG in group my tank would explain the markings and then add "blue square is Beas trap - if you only touch it you will regret you ever joined this group". It works usually.
I had trap/stopattack and pull/stopcasting macros hotkeyed at level 40 or so.
When I started grouping for instances I downloaded one useful little addon - its called CC Breaker.
I would recommend it to everyone who has to argue over who and why broke whatever CC.
When we had to get a PuG in group my tank would explain the markings and then add "blue square is Beas trap - if you only touch it you will regret you ever joined this group". It works usually.
ItsaGaAs wrote:
I can still count on two hands the number of runs I've been on where the tank wanted the hunter to pull (misdirection, what's that?) or allowed time to place a trap and have it cool-down.
But thats mostly because i have ran Mech enough times to get to exalted twice.
And you just need to pull the first real boss there with MD.
(well, it really sucks without MD =P)
It helps when you run with the same tank all the time... I wouldnt run anything with some other tank if my life depended on it.
Scholar
27 posts
He's a bad CC unfriendly tank, you should practise with some others too.
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