I know there's a pre-kara gear list, but what I was wondering is what is the expected stats to have when you start entering kara?
I just want to compare my friend to those, since he's apparently his guild's top healer as they're starting to hit stuff bigger than 5-mans.
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I posted a thread asking basically the same thing a few days ago...
skribs wrote:
I know there's a pre-kara gear list, but what I was wondering is what is the expected stats to have when you start entering kara?
I just want to compare my friend to those, since he's apparently his guild's top healer as they're starting to hit stuff bigger than 5-mans.
I just want to compare my friend to those, since he's apparently his guild's top healer as they're starting to hit stuff bigger than 5-mans.
don't people ever read the FAQ anymore? it in there. section 2.4.3 or something like that. if thats not the right part its close haha. its like 1k +healing minimum (more to actually complete it) 15-20% spell crit, 80 mp5, and 9k mana. double check though. i might be wrong.
Quote:
I know there's a pre-kara gear list, but what I was wondering is what is the expected stats to have when you start entering kara?
The "pre-Kara list" is what you need as you enter Kara. Not what you need for 5-mans. Well, for Heroics maybe since it's more or less the same requirements.
Bah. Read the wrong sticky lol.
At least I looked at one of them :P
Okay but I'll ask this:
Is the crit % holy crit or all-school crit (does it factor talents in or is it just your spell crit and int)?
Is the MP/5 benchmark with or without BoW?
What is the desired mana pool?
Edited, Dec 3rd 2007 8:06am by skribs
At least I looked at one of them :P
Okay but I'll ask this:
Is the crit % holy crit or all-school crit (does it factor talents in or is it just your spell crit and int)?
Is the MP/5 benchmark with or without BoW?
What is the desired mana pool?
Edited, Dec 3rd 2007 8:06am by skribs
All the stats are unbuffed, I think I mentioned that in the FAQ, if I didn't then I apologize. So that's the mp5 needed BEFORE BoW.
As for spell crit, the percentage I put in is the percentage you should have when you look at your Holy crit on your character window unbuffed.
Mana pool should be... whatever you can get once you've satisfied the above two, assuming you didn't make rediculous gear choices.
As for spell crit, the percentage I put in is the percentage you should have when you look at your Holy crit on your character window unbuffed.
Mana pool should be... whatever you can get once you've satisfied the above two, assuming you didn't make rediculous gear choices.
Actually on this one it wasn't my fault Jack, as I don't see the MP/5 or crit questions answered there. But you apologized so no hard feelings (I was just proud it wasn't MY fault for once).
I was asking b/c my friend has 1402 +heal, 54 MP/5, and a 15.7% holy crit chance, as well as 8958 mana.
So I'm guessing he should seek out some more MP/5?
I was asking b/c my friend has 1402 +heal, 54 MP/5, and a 15.7% holy crit chance, as well as 8958 mana.
So I'm guessing he should seek out some more MP/5?
From section 2.4.3:
Though I probably should expand that section a bit more. It seems kinda small for such a big topic.
Anyway, yeah dipping into his healing to grab some crit and mp5 wouldn't be a bad idea. It will increase his healing more in the long run since he'll be able to heal longer.
Quote:
To heal in Kara, 1200 healing, 15% crit, and 70mp5 is a good starting point. Every raid after that requires a little more, you should probably ask your guild what they want you to be at for further instances.
Though I probably should expand that section a bit more. It seems kinda small for such a big topic.
Anyway, yeah dipping into his healing to grab some crit and mp5 wouldn't be a bad idea. It will increase his healing more in the long run since he'll be able to heal longer.
lol i looked in sticky real fast also for this for a buddy of mine even though he's the 70 and i'm the 51 i probaly have better understanding of stuff than he does sadly. but i was looking for the min stats for him since he didnt wanna look at the list of pre kara stuff realy. thanks for the info guys will re look in sticky some more.
bah no wonder we didnt see it we was looking like for it as if it was set up for the tanking stuff. where it's bulleted.
edit well the bullets aint showing up in quote but you get the idea. maybe move the healing needed up with the healing info bullet?? or maybe bold it so we actually read all of it lol.
Edited, Dec 4th 2007 6:56am by punkspider
Quote:
2.4.2 What kind of gear does an end-game Tanking Paladin look for?
An end-game tanking paladin tries to go for the following gear (all Plate).
A spell damage/healing bonus of at least 200.
490 Defense (for reaching uncrittable status).
102.4% avoidance (about 52.4% of that must come from gear/talents).
As much stamina and Armor as possible.
These stats will help ensure your ability to keep threat and to take a beating.
2.4.3 What kind of gear does an end-game Healing Paladin look for?
At end-game, a healer needs to try to grab a balance of the following:
+Healing - Increases the effectiveness of the heals.
+Spell Crit - Further increases the effectiveness, and also an important source of mana regen.
+Mp5 - Another important source of mana regen.
+Int - Increases mana pool, spell crit, and +heal.
There is an ongoing debate over Plate vs. Non-Plate gear. What seems to be a good guideline is if you think you are going to get hit, then you should probably get more armor. Examples of when you will get hit are arenas, battlegrounds, and probably PuG groups. You will (or at least should) not get hit in guild runs, unless you are heal tanking something.
To heal in Kara, 1200 healing, 15% crit, and 70mp5 is a good starting point. Every raid after that requires a little more, you should probably ask your guild what they want you to be at for further instances.
An end-game tanking paladin tries to go for the following gear (all Plate).
A spell damage/healing bonus of at least 200.
490 Defense (for reaching uncrittable status).
102.4% avoidance (about 52.4% of that must come from gear/talents).
As much stamina and Armor as possible.
These stats will help ensure your ability to keep threat and to take a beating.
2.4.3 What kind of gear does an end-game Healing Paladin look for?
At end-game, a healer needs to try to grab a balance of the following:
+Healing - Increases the effectiveness of the heals.
+Spell Crit - Further increases the effectiveness, and also an important source of mana regen.
+Mp5 - Another important source of mana regen.
+Int - Increases mana pool, spell crit, and +heal.
There is an ongoing debate over Plate vs. Non-Plate gear. What seems to be a good guideline is if you think you are going to get hit, then you should probably get more armor. Examples of when you will get hit are arenas, battlegrounds, and probably PuG groups. You will (or at least should) not get hit in guild runs, unless you are heal tanking something.
To heal in Kara, 1200 healing, 15% crit, and 70mp5 is a good starting point. Every raid after that requires a little more, you should probably ask your guild what they want you to be at for further instances.
edit well the bullets aint showing up in quote but you get the idea. maybe move the healing needed up with the healing info bullet?? or maybe bold it so we actually read all of it lol.
Edited, Dec 4th 2007 6:56am by punkspider
Overlord CapJack wrote:
From section 2.4.3:
Though I probably should expand that section a bit more. It seems kinda small for such a big topic.
Anyway, yeah dipping into his healing to grab some crit and mp5 wouldn't be a bad idea. It will increase his healing more in the long run since he'll be able to heal longer.
Quote:
To heal in Kara, 1200 healing, 15% crit, and 70mp5 is a good starting point. Every raid after that requires a little more, you should probably ask your guild what they want you to be at for further instances.
Though I probably should expand that section a bit more. It seems kinda small for such a big topic.
Anyway, yeah dipping into his healing to grab some crit and mp5 wouldn't be a bad idea. It will increase his healing more in the long run since he'll be able to heal longer.
ah, ty for the correction. i was lazy and have a bad memory apparently.. oh well i was close on some of them anyway...
i just need 200 more +healing and i'll be good to go. finally got back on my holy pally again yesterday. been working so much on my retadin lately. i'll have the 1200 soon though.
Well my friend regeared and got some enchants and is sitting on quite a bit more stats now...1482 +heal, 90 MP/5, 17.04% crit chance, and 9258 mana unbuffed.
What level of end-game do you assume he could hit with that?
What level of end-game do you assume he could hit with that?
Kara
49 posts
You can do Gruul with that as well, and I speak from experience.
SideLabel wrote:
You can do Gruul with that as well, and I speak from experience.
I've done SSC(read: Lurker and the trash up to him) with 1402 healing, 20.97% holy crit, and 120 mana/5 while casting. Granted, I wasn't topping any healing meters and me coming to heal instead of playing my mage was a last resort(damned holiday season), but I did ok.
I am currently unbuffed 1688 bonus healing, 16.1crit, and 171mp5 with no buffs other than bow on and I get up to 1850 with mage druid and kings buff, but we are still in kara, so I can not speak past it, but when I entered kara I was around those numbers and had no problems healing.
14 posts
Sorry for being a little off topic, and kind of a newb question, but would you recommend doing heroics before entering Kara? Or that Kara is attunement for heroics? I only ask because it would seem to me that since all the gear lists for Kara that I look at contain pieces from heroics. You also become immune to critical hits before crushing blows which is needed for heroics where being un-crushable is not. So naturally you would run heroics fist. But a guildy keeps telling us that Kara is attunement for heroics. I would appreciate a little clarification on whether this is the case. Thanks in advance. ïŠ
Tell your guildy he's an idiot and CapJack said so.
Kara is not an attunement for heroics in any way shape or form. You need to be un-crushable to tank bosses in kara, and you can do that by kinda easily by doing heroics at the very least until you get the tanking libram which adds so much avoidance. However, it's still not super required, if you look at my armory below, the only piece of heroic gear I have is the belt, but I ran enough heroics to get the libram as well so that I can be uncrushable.
Kara is not an attunement for heroics in any way shape or form. You need to be un-crushable to tank bosses in kara, and you can do that by kinda easily by doing heroics at the very least until you get the tanking libram which adds so much avoidance. However, it's still not super required, if you look at my armory below, the only piece of heroic gear I have is the belt, but I ran enough heroics to get the libram as well so that I can be uncrushable.
Short answer: No, Kara is not attunement for heroics.
Longer answer: It rather seems that the intent of heroics is to give people a chance at more challenging content without having to raid. You can do neither, both or one or the other.
If you just do Kara then yes, you have a little trouble (at least with tanking itemization) getting yourself appropriately geared. Heroics offer some nice loot drops to get you to your magical tanking stats and you're right, you'll likely get yourself geared properly for heroics before you get yourself geared properly for Kara.
You don't need to do heroics prior to Kara if you can kit yourself out with Kara numbers via crafting/normal drops.
And you don't need to do Kara at all to do heroics.
Longer answer: It rather seems that the intent of heroics is to give people a chance at more challenging content without having to raid. You can do neither, both or one or the other.
If you just do Kara then yes, you have a little trouble (at least with tanking itemization) getting yourself appropriately geared. Heroics offer some nice loot drops to get you to your magical tanking stats and you're right, you'll likely get yourself geared properly for heroics before you get yourself geared properly for Kara.
You don't need to do heroics prior to Kara if you can kit yourself out with Kara numbers via crafting/normal drops.
And you don't need to do Kara at all to do heroics.
Overlord CapJack wrote:
Tell your guildy he's an idiot and CapJack said so.
I was going to add that but backspaced it out.Do you know the definition of attunement? If not, I'll enlighten you. An attunement is a quest that, once you complete, it allows entry into a place that you previously were not allowed to enter. The only real attunements left are Kara, Hyjal and BT, Blizzard has removed the rest. If kara was an attunement for heroics, then you would be unable to even enter a heroic until you had complete kara, since you can enter a heroic at any time, as long as you're honored with that faction, your guildie needs to learn to shut his mouth, or else more stupid will leak out.
I wouldn't say that Kara is a pre-req for heroics, neither would I say heroics are a pre-req for Kara. They are kind of interchangeable. I know there are a few heroics that I wouldn't bother with unless I had 1300+ healing and the only way you get to that level is either craftable epics or kara runs.
Kara you want to have all pieces of green gear or blue gear below lvl 68 gone, every single piece with the exceptions of trinkets. You want to be above 1000 healing, 1100 recommended and the closer to 1200 the better as long as it doesnt hurt your other stats. Spell crit and MP5 are your bread and butter in long fights, spell crit should be above 15% (before factoring 5% from talent tree) and mp5 should be as close to 100 as you can get it, unbuffed.
You should be using elixirs, food buffs and mana oil to help complement this especially for your first couple runs as you gear up. You should have your gear enchanted and be ready to spend more money enchanting the epics you are going to be getting. If you are just starting Kara now you are about 10 months behind the curve, so it shouldnt be too hard considering that there are tonnes of strats and the instance has been nerfed in terms of trash somewhat.
Kara you want to have all pieces of green gear or blue gear below lvl 68 gone, every single piece with the exceptions of trinkets. You want to be above 1000 healing, 1100 recommended and the closer to 1200 the better as long as it doesnt hurt your other stats. Spell crit and MP5 are your bread and butter in long fights, spell crit should be above 15% (before factoring 5% from talent tree) and mp5 should be as close to 100 as you can get it, unbuffed.
You should be using elixirs, food buffs and mana oil to help complement this especially for your first couple runs as you gear up. You should have your gear enchanted and be ready to spend more money enchanting the epics you are going to be getting. If you are just starting Kara now you are about 10 months behind the curve, so it shouldnt be too hard considering that there are tonnes of strats and the instance has been nerfed in terms of trash somewhat.
Bode - 100 Holy Paladin - Lightbringer
14 posts
Thanks for the replies. Yeah, I was hesitant to use the word attunement in this case but because that was what my guildy used I figured I would at least try to keep that part in (because it pertained to my question). I think he’s just real eager to start Kara and just doesn’t want us wasting time on heroics. This is great news for my shammy healer that wants a couple things from heroics first, and me to get my libram. Thanks and happy hunting!
Edited, Dec 16th 2007 6:41pm by Whatlol
Edited, Dec 16th 2007 6:41pm by Whatlol
I was glancing through this and had to add my own 2 cents into it. While Heroics are not required to run Kara Ive discovered Heroics a great way to get in the practice needed for Kara and to pick up some gear to help you in Kara.
As a previous poster said you want to eliminate all your -68 greens except your trinkets and I'll 2nd that completely. You should be concentrating on improving your gear by replacing blues/greens with blues and/or Heroic Epics before ya even start worrying about Kara Epics. Even if ya don't get any loot in Heroics theres still the badges and those add up quick....and the rep that comes with....which results in...You guessed it! Rep Reward Gear!!
Hope this Helps Some,
Gavilrain - Human Holy Paladin Level 70
Officer of "The Priory"
Aggramar Server
As a previous poster said you want to eliminate all your -68 greens except your trinkets and I'll 2nd that completely. You should be concentrating on improving your gear by replacing blues/greens with blues and/or Heroic Epics before ya even start worrying about Kara Epics. Even if ya don't get any loot in Heroics theres still the badges and those add up quick....and the rep that comes with....which results in...You guessed it! Rep Reward Gear!!
Hope this Helps Some,
Gavilrain - Human Holy Paladin Level 70
Officer of "The Priory"
Aggramar Server
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