Is tailoring a MUST have?Follow

Dont let Jenova hear you - he cant do enough /spit on FSW. Makes you wonder why he hates it so much :p

why do i hate it? because it's crap for raiding. it lacks everything a warlock needs except damage and the only reason people love it is 'cos they're all drunk on "+damage/+shadow damage" 'cos of the stupid idea that it's all you need (an idea which only appeared in tbc). but what's even worse is when I see warlocks in B L O O D Y TIER.SIX gear and STILL using the FSW boots/ shoulders etc... it's rediculous, it makes no sense and it's a complete gimp of your damage.
soooo many poeple think it's better than T4 and equal/just better than T5. well that's bull, they need to L2 theorycraft and they'll find that T4 out performs it by a rediculous amount.

/end rant

yes, i'm a dps ***** and yes, it lacks hit, it lacks, stam, it lacks int, it lacks crit, it lacks haste. it lacks EVERYTHING.

Edited, Dec 7th 2007 12:15am by Jenovaomega

ya, i don't deny that it's better than most blue gear (mana-etched 2set though being pretty good for new raiders), it just aggrevates me when i see people using it when they could happily have upgraded it. another thing i dislike is when people also presume that they're bad due to a lack of stam... it's the lack of int that's the major factor for all casters, especially mages and Spriests (the lack of spirit being an issue for them too). heck i was just looking at their Tier.5's and i really don't know how people can compare them for long-run dps, short term (trash), yes you hit for a bit less, but you also last alot longer.

longevity > damage

wtf, i wrote hack like 3 times then o.0, how random, can't believe i actually done that o.0

Edited, Dec 7th 2007 12:16am by Jenovaomega

it's actually not an over-exageration. 3 extra SBs alone is an extra 7.5 seconds of dps without having to lifetap, with alot of bosses having aoe abilities on 30-60second CDs / phase changes etc... (points when you need to have a few seconds break in damage), being able to save your lifetapping for those moments instead of moments when you could be attacking makes alot of difference in long run dps. it's called efficency and it's something most DPS classes have forgotten about in tbc (thankgod healers haven't or otherwise we'd have loads of "zomg 2500 +healing" but i run out of mana in less than a minute due to no mp5 and only 7k mana" healers

thats what i said the entire time FSW is kickass...thought the thread enden there..

Exactly, my guild downs mag every week and he only seems to want to drop defender or champion crap...its beyond rediculous at this point. And here i thought the 7 months of doing kara every week to get my t4 helm was stupid...sigh gg blizz.

Edited, Dec 7th 2007 1:39pm by LordAncalagon

hey, i never said don't use them if you can't get better. just simply that people who believe they're better than T4 are a bunch of idiots. also i wasn't 'spoonfed' my gear. I started raiding kara back before they hadn't even released a boss guide about it, we learnt the encounters ourselves and found out our own ways of downing the bosses.

now as you said, it's a great starter. my arguement though was and still is that it's not comparible to T4 AND that it's not a requirement for raiding as the mana-etched set + the epics from heroics/ tailoring crafted BoE epics (hence not needing the craft yourself) are more than enough to get into raiding. now if you want to jump into a raiding guild that's no-longer doing kara/gruul/mag with the FSW etc... sets, then go ahead. but your damage on bosses will be **** poor due to having crap all +hit, crap all stam and crap all int (enjoy tapping more often than needed and seeing loads of resists)

now the FSW set is good for when you start,but the below maths will prove that it's not as much of an improvement as people think (it'll also show you it is fairly spec orientated too as to how much of an improvement it is)

i'll put the maths in for you, but if you want to do them yourself. go to elitist jerks, get the latest warlock dps chart. now I've had to use a variation of figures as the results for what each bonus +dmg/shadow/hit/crit will be worth etc... varies from spec to spec (i've taken the figures of how much +dmg each stat is worth).
seeing as we're talking about new locks
for an afliction lock. 700 damage, 10% crit. 4% hit, all the usual talents
spell rotatation: all dots, SB filler

below is what each bonus stat is worth in +dmg
+1shadow = 0.88
+1dmg = 1
+1hit = 0.76
+1crit = 0.14
+1haste 0.69

so, lets compare mana-etched shoulders+chest to FSW shoulders+chest, including most beneficial gems for each
mana-etched = 124.5
FSW = 138

so yeah, as afliction fsw is a bit better

now as destruction
700 dmg, 20% crit, 4%hit, all usual talents
spell rotation: all dots, SB filler


+1shadow = 0.87
+1 fire = 0.13
+1dmg = 1
+1hit = 0.96
+1crit = 0.34
+1haste = 0.89

mana-etched = 139.5
FSW = 139.5

as you can see, if you enter raiding as a destruction lock then it doesn't matter which gear you use, as an afliction lock, yeah you'll benefit a bit from the fsw set, but the difference isn't enough to say "it's a must"

finally, lets get onto the locks in the better gear who're using still using this crap

1300 +dmg, 20% crit, say 13% hit, all dots. SB filler

as a dest lock:
+1shadow = 0.9
+1 fire = 0.1
+1dmg = 1
+1hit = 1.32
+1 crit = 0.52
+1haste = 1.4

as an afliction lock: (same stats, end game there's not much variation on dmg crit and hit)
+1shadow = 0.87
+1fire = 0.13
+1dmg = 1
+1hit = 1.17
+1crit = 0.26
+1haste = 1.05

now i'm obviously not going to compare fsw and mana-etched here, just simply do a bit of comparisons for you. as you can see compared to the poorer geared locks, with the higher dmg, increased hit becomes ALOT more important, as does crit and the now available more readily available haste rating. with these stat value changes, getting improvements on the fsw gear is far from hard. plenty of bosses drop gear that can match or beat it. T4 and ZA gear being the starting point for the upgrades, ssc and tk gear being far superior and bt/hjal outsurpassing it by a massive amount. now if you're unlucky enough to never see the drops, then nothing can be done there. but i've talked to plenty of warlocks who've chosen to not upgrade 'cos they believe fsw is better... those locks don't deserve their spot in those raids imo and belong back in kara/gruul learning to play their class properly.

i'm one of those sad gits who enjoys maths, don't know why... i just do. so yeah, 'tis fun. why else do you think i do theorycrafting? :P

idd, everyone has their own reasons for playing and their own levels they're willing to go to. same with all hobbies. heck look at football. now it's not to wrong to say that probably near 100% of all blokes have played it (and probably nearing that for women too), but also probably 99% of them done it for fun with a few mates / to just burn some energy. the last 1% though enjoy taking it to the next level and beyond. heck i bet if you asked alot of them they could even go into the physics/strategies etc.. of the game.
so yeah, each to their own on how far they're willing to go for a silly little game ^^

hehe, yes.. a game. a very boring and silly game

:p

personnal preferance :P