Elitist Not-WarlocksFollow

Exactly. When I pull the imp out in an instance, it is 99.99% for the Stamina buff to the party as well as be my mana battery. His best role is one accomplished while passive.




Pets are situational. In an instance, if CC is required then it's normally my succy's job, not the Blueberry's. But if I am seducing, it's to keep things under control and I could care less about topping the damage meters. I'd rather complete an instance quickly and get the hawt lootz than to waste time and gold wiping and repairing for the sake of being #1 with damage.

Obviously you want to play the game the way you like and if DPS is the only thing you care about, then that's fine. Something to keep in mind is that if you only use one pet and focus on one role (DPS in your case), you can be the best, but you will be rather one-dimensional. And this class, like others (pally for example) are versitile and ignoring other roles/capabilities do limit you.

Good on you for telling a PuG upfront that you don't CC, but you can't blame a group for feeling a little put off if your choice not to CC makes things a little rougher on the party. Ohmikeghod hit it on the head: it's not so much them being elitist as it is them looking for good teamwork.

lol, good way to make up what you want to see. Did you not read what I said?
Further, when I said we were in UB, how much of that instance is actually humanoids? You cant seduce elementals, and my issue was doing that not using Banish or Fear or whatever else.


Yeah... and to deny that warlocks make kick *** DPS would be along the same path of error. But, those are just facts, so who cares, right?

My original post had NOTHING to do with crowd control in general. I was complaining about elitism, and insensitivity to how others like to play.

Oh? I like how you insert "DPS" in front of the class, as if that makes them any more or less effective. Yet, I or anyone can not be a "DPS warlock" without knowing anything about the class. Funny how that works.
Here is a list of spell descriptions from a couple of those classes you mention:


Sap - Knocks the target out for X seconds.

Earthbound Totem - Reduces enemy movement speed within 10 yards for 45 sec.

Stoneclaw Totem - Summons a Stoneclaw Totem with XX health at the feet of the caster for 15 sec that taunts creatures within 8 yards to attack it. Enemies attacking the Stoneclaw Totem have a 50% chance to be stunned for 3 sec.

Hammer of Justice - Stuns the target for X sec.

Rightious Fury - Increases the threat generated by your Holy attacks by 60%. Lasts 30 min.

Seal of Justice - Unleashing this Seal's energy will judge an enemy for 10 sec, preventing them from fleeing. Your melee strikes will refresh the spell's duration.

Taunt - Taunts the target to attack you, but has no effect if the target is already attacking you.

Mocking Blow - Deals X damage, forces opponent to focus attacks on you for 6 seconds, and causes a moderate amount of threat.

Intimidating Shout - Causes nearby enemies to flee, except for the currently targetted mob.

Challenging Shout - Taunts all nearby targets to attack you, but has no effect on targets that are already attacking you.

Piercing Howl - Causes all enemies near the warrior to be dazed for 6 sec.

Concussion Blow - Stuns the opponent for 5 sec.


I dont play these, so there is probably more that I am missing. But, looks to me, all those classes you mention each have their own crowd control methods-- unless you dont think demobilizing and focusing threat is crowd control.

With average mana pool your succubus can get the mob out of fight 6 to 7 times. 6 x 15 seconds is minute and half.
Assuming that seduce can break or be resisted, it still gives you fair chance of having one mob less in a fight for full minute.

How long can your Voidwalker last left alone with Cabal Fanatic?
Check it next time please.

Something that takes a mob out of the fight for 10 seconds, once a fight, is not CC.



Yes, that works as CC. It takes a mob out of the fight for at least as long as it takes to kill another mob, or two, without a problem. Check.



The former is not CC, that is kiting. Different processes entirely.
The latter could theoretically work as CC if it didn't die in a single hit (inside an instance), guaranteed. No check.

Hammer of Justice - Stuns the target for X sec.



Former is used for tanking, unless you want your healer to have aggro. Not CC.
Latter is essentially like CoRecklessness, except without the -armour and +AP, with a very occassional stun. No check.



These are, again, oh **** buttons. "My healer has aggro. I'd rather have the mob hitting me than him, I'll use taunt/MB" or, "Too many mobs all over the place, I'll AE taunt." Once again, no check.



This is another oh **** button. No check.



That's a tanking move, not a DPS move. It's a 21 point prot talent.

[hr]
Sorry, but no. You just made a big post of fail

I don't usually post here but mainly read, but in this case I do have to. As my hunter friend says that people who can't trap really annoy him, I have to say that people who say that Succy is not a viable CC alternative or it is too hard annoy me too. I've used Succy in every instance heroic or non-heroic since I hit 70. The main reason I started doing this is because my friends and I formed a group that usually had limited form of CC (nowadays we just say the best form of CC is good DPS :-) but even now sometimes you have to crowd control one or two mob). Shadow Priest, Ele Shammy, Pally healer, druid tank and warlock don't have much going for them in CC terms short of me fearing and seducing (banishing where it is possible). So the only advice I can give to any aspiring lock is to learn how to seduce effectively as in the end when you have to do it, it won't be a chore anymore. (Mind Control is a waste of time imo in most situations but can be effectively used in some situations. Waste of time as shadow priest does a lot more dmg than CCd mob -in most cases- and the prospect of that mob going after the priest after MC expires is not something to look forward too).

BTW I didn't use succy before 70 because I was mainly trying to get my lock to 70 as fast as possible.

Now to this form of CC. It is not mage's polymorph and it was never meant to be that. Having said that it doesn't mean it can't be used just as effectively. What I like about warlock CC it involves more than just CC and forget for 15-20 seconds and then get back to it recast your CC spell and don't worry about mob. Every single form of CC for warlock means (fear being the only exception) that the mob will be loose for a short period of time. This means you have to be on the ball.

But I digress. Seducing is what I love doing in instances while still managing (as Sethy said) to do a considerable dmg to other mob. There are tools/addons/macros out there that make the warlock CC so much easier to do. I for example use focus macros to seduce and banish. I use frames (X-Perl) to have my focused target display on my screen so I know exactly when my seduce/banish will expire which in turn lets me know exactly when to start casting my banish or when to let succy recast seduce. It also tells me if someone (most likely me :-)) has also put a DOT on my seduce target in which case I know it is time for fear and curse of exhaustion/curse of recklesness until DOT expires. For people who say succy dies too quick just make sure she doesn't have agro. What I always do is I seduce, put COS on the target and then cast a shadowbolt on that seduced target from a distance. I can guarantee you that succy will be safe and that target will go after me the whole fight. Reapply your seduce after shadowbolt move to a safe distance and then just reseduce when you have to.

As for the poster who said dethcoil is not safe. There is only one place I can ever see this be a problem and that is in SH where you fight the 6mob groups without gladiators cleared on the side. Other places the 3 second fear will get mob just far enough from you to give you chance to seduce again or do something else. I cannot tell you how many times Dethcoil has been a life saver in instances. Most other instances if pulls are done correctly (i.e. away from other mob) you can fear mobs to your hearts content. I prefer using curse of exhaustion just to make sure it doesn't stray to far away but if you are not that far into affliction tree fear with recklesness is just as effective.

In any case for a first warlock post this is too much :-)
I hope this was a bit informative for at least one person here :-),

Cheers,
S

I offtanked Slabs with felguard a lot in like first 20 times, my felguard used to have around 8k hp and 11k armor if I remember correctly.
That specific mob could cut throught him in few seconds no matter of my 2 points in Imp Health Funnel and 3 in Demonic Resilience.

I am exalted with Lower City on running Slabs exclusively.
I ran it with all classes in all kind of gear from quested greens up to full beyond Kara epics. I ran it with warlocks of all specs that used all kind of available pets.
I myself ran it as demo and as destro and used imp, succubus and felguard in there.

Any warlock that showed with VW in that particular instance was worthless to my group. He was worthless CC wise and damage wise as a rule.
Cudos to you if you can do better, but in my experience none I saw with VW was worth anything but /kick.

Alternatively, L2P f'noob.

Mwah, ha, ha...

You still have to watch the timer, keep distance, keep aggro, and sometimes wonder why you cant reseduce though you press your key like a maniac and then discover nearby hunter just serpent-stinged your target and keeps wingclipping it.
*sigh*

Seducing isnt easy even with macro and timers sometimes.

alot of warrior-class mob usually one shot clothies in heroics.

l2pOldschool:



Edited, Dec 11th 2007 4:03pm by Oakenwrath

oh please don´t treat me like i have no real life.
I take great joy in optimizing gameplay, rather than walking around with a
horrible low equipped level 70 char and than come here to the forums and preach how elite succubus-cc is.