Elitist Not-WarlocksFollow

Exactly.

I can dish out 6k SB even with my crappy gear. There is no VW that would keep aggro after that.



We are talking about level 70 normal 5 mans, you are the one that mentioned Slab, no?



I am destro now. Not raiding destro but nevertheless. I never use VW apart from saccing him for farming shards.
I use succubus, dead to up my damage, alive to seduce.
I never saw a capable level 70 affliction or destro lock on my server with VW. Ever.



Felguard is designed to be the most powerful pet a lock can have, mini tank. Hence 41 points in demo which is a lot.
You actually make me wonder how your talent points look like if you still find VW a viable option for offtanking after getting felguard.

Or imp?
Let's see... because it has served perfectly well so far. What more of a good reason do you want?


According to who? You are assuming that your play style is somehow the best, and just because some people might agree with you, does not mean that is the only viable option.
By "balls of suck", you mean "not die in two hits" then I agree. But, some people like to pick a minion that will actually outlast them, so I guess we are idiots for going with what WORKS lol.

Why not start a poll in a separate thread, asking which has worked best? To be fair, the question should include before and during Outland, as I am aware needs change drastically in that time.

______
This is a little off-topic, so just warning to all ;)


What is your definition of easy?
My alt. is a priest, so I would rather throw on a Renewal periodically on everyone, with the occasional Heal/Flash Heal and Prayer of Healing, than have to spend all my mana keeping up with a massive amount of damage in a short time-- granted, I am not speced for healing, but it's the same principle.
Systematically dying is not my idea of easy, and that is what can happen if one character is taking all the damage in a long fight.
When everyone is doing that thing called "working together": no one dies, regardless of which minion/pet they use.

I'll show you why that works:
Let's pretend these characters have the same health bar, and are fighting something that hits them for an insane amount of damage for their level.
In example A, we can see what will happen when the whole groups works together, sharing damage.
In example B, we see what will happen if at least one of that group decides to "tank".
Both examples, let's assume that one of them is healing and they are able to heal whenever they are needed.

A) 1000 damage / 5 player(s) = 200
B) 1000 damage / 1 player(s) = 1000

The priest spell "Prayer of Healing" costs about as much as the Heal spell, but heals less. In example A, you could use Prayer of Healing and the occasional renew to keep up with the damage; in example B, you would have to use Heal or Greater Heal periodically.

To me, example A seems the most efficient. More complicated, but I find that there are fewer casualties.

Edited, Dec 6th 2007 10:37pm by sederix

I am sorry but what kind instance do you usually heal when you can keep up with the damage with occasional renew?

What you are saying, is just because something WORKS perfectly well, that's a reason to stop using it?
That's like saying pain medicine works fine, but because it's been in use for so long, let's just try something else like amputation only because it does the job differently. Who is being silly? I already said voidwalker works perfectly fine, so you have no basis to assume the job does not get done, whatever that may be.


Renewal, or whatever else works. The point is that in example A, less damage is being allocated to particular players in general, so it should take less mana to keep up with the healing; whatever spell works is not really the issue.


Damage is damage. It has to be recovered all the same. My example is meant to point out the difference teamwork makes. I am sure you understand.




Edited, Dec 7th 2007 3:51pm by sederix

LOL come again?
"It has worked perfectly fine so far". What is wrong with you?

Scroll up.


Edited, Dec 7th 2007 6:03pm by sederix

So basically, bottom line, the general consensus is that VW is a waste of f*cking space in instances.

Except one guy who seems to manage to make it work.

Now, we either go with the majority, experience and reasoned argument...or we announce sederix as God.

Let me think about this...

Rate ups for joo, ccbutch.

I love a lock in an instance that swaps out pets (or asks - like "Lotta mobs, want succy or you ok?", "Hits hard, need imp?") in an instance. LOVE THEM! And I've been really fortunate to have grouped with a lot of them and tried to be that lock myself.

Your points are dead on, use the best pet for what's in front of you (and know how to use it).

(gah but I must just add that I've never seen the VW be the "best pet" in an instance.)

On a COMPLETE sidenote I've never played or grouped with a lock who used the pet as a sac-tool in an instance, from this and the poll is seems like there actually ARE a fair few out there - I think it'd be really interesting, maybe someday!

I used that option even before I respecced. For example the void boss in Slab, you cant keep felguard alive around him very long and its not worth trouble trying. And dps matters on that boss.
Even easier after I dumped felguard, succy ran with me for seducing and then when I dont need her anymore poof I get +15% shadow damage buff.

I used sacced VW as a trial in SH whenever I had to SoC, 240ish hp every 4 sec might not be that much but it sure helped me to stay alive.

Imp was wonderful with Master Demonologist, spam SBs and not worry about aggro :)
I can only imagine how useful he might be in early BM runs for those that have Dark Pact.

What leads me to complete sidenote..... I would very much like to see how Sederix build look like.
What pet you use pretty much depends on what talents you have too. They can make it work or ***** it up.

Depending on the tank and group make-up I will sometimes pull a VW out(affliction, so no felguard) on the mobs at the end of Botanica. The little bastards that are immune to all forms of CC and you have to pull 5 or something like that. This is only if the tank can't hold them and we don't have enough aoe so we have to do em 1 at a time. It makes things a bit rougher on the healer but over all it can make those pulls go much smoother.



PS. I know I said I'd stay away, but I have an addiction.

Are they preferred? No. Personally I would much rather have my Imp out due to Dark Pact and it's endless supply of mana. I believe this is why most people picked imp on the poll. After all, why would you keep the succubus out if she serves no purpose.



And herein lies the problem. As a Warlock you ARE CC. To deny this is to not understand your class. Most groups you will go with the importance is CC first, DPS second. To refuse to use crowd control in instances will just get you put on ignore lists, while learning to master cc will get you put on friends lists and invited to more parties.



Where you really undergeared, or was your tank taking a beating from 3 people because you refused to cc the other two because thats not what Warlocks do. That, my friend, is not so much undergeared as it is unwillingness to work as a team.

I think ccbutch give clear answer, rate up for that, and will not go over again, but let me clear:



I wish to tell you that, VW is good as a everyone warlock tool, but when you do OL instances you have much more powerfull choices of minions. I'm not tell you to stop using VW...i already said, it's your choise to be or not to be more effective warlock.

http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-...mp;n=Coruin