Everyone says Marksmanship, and I see that a 20-second cooldown silence is a little insane, but does that truly justify the rest of the tree? Scattershot is amazing, Trueshot Aura isn't an epic talent. It's the most fragile of specs.
I mean, everyone's going to target you, so I would think you should focus on tools for survival. Here's what I came up with:
Intimidation/Scatter Shot/Deterrencehttp://www.wowhead.com/?talent=cxf00xxRZE0ioxzZ0GA0z
I don't have time to finish, but Entrapment is a MUST for any build I create. Frost trap's AoE slow, with 2-second ticks to proc Entrapment, is ungodly powerful in arena. I will not live without it.
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30 posts
Eh, the spec sort of depends on the Arena size. 2v2 and 3v3, BW for the win. It is a one trick poney, but if you macro in an attack up trinket and rapid fire (They all share seperate CDs, so /stopcasting macro works. One push for three buffs.) is a VERY nice "I-W-I-N" button. The second determinate is a healer. If you have an amazing healer on your side, and you know both of you are not going to die for a LONG, LONG time, go marks. The lower CDs on scatter and silence shot stand out in a long term fight. My setup for both of my teams is Me, Mage, and Rogue, so I freaking love BW. With this set up, i'm almost always targeted first, even more so after the patch(ninja nerf!)so staying alive long enough to make a difference is always nice.
I'll link some specs for you, first my spec, the second has points in Surv, which you seem to like.
BM/MM
BM/SV
First build, my current, and I love it.
Second build, Very nice for staying alive. 15% total health from both, imp. Wing clip, your entrapment talents that you like, improved hit, and the last point is up to you. Either put it in Humanoid slaying or Deterrence. Your call.
Just don't forget. These are all opinions based on my personal experience. Your results may vary. =p
Edited, Nov 20th 2007 11:27am by Hakaisha
I'll link some specs for you, first my spec, the second has points in Surv, which you seem to like.
BM/MM
BM/SV
First build, my current, and I love it.
Second build, Very nice for staying alive. 15% total health from both, imp. Wing clip, your entrapment talents that you like, improved hit, and the last point is up to you. Either put it in Humanoid slaying or Deterrence. Your call.
Just don't forget. These are all opinions based on my personal experience. Your results may vary. =p
Edited, Nov 20th 2007 11:27am by Hakaisha
I began to tend towards SV for the arena, speaking from a 2v2 perspective.
From your (Enabler's) spec, you speak about being fragile as a marksman and reinforce it with your talent choices:
-Imp AotH procs MUCH less in the arena because you keep moving, so move those points to Endurance training.
-I prefer thick hide over imp AotM, but the choice is up to you. They both help against melee.
-If you can spare it, take the points from intimidate & Bestial discipline and move them to Mortal Shots, or else your crits down mean nearly as much as they should. If you do this, you might as well move the other 10 pts from your pet's dps to Survivalist and Surefooted (going to help you more than you can imagine).
Deflection should come after Imp Wing Clip, so go 2/5 and 3/3.
---> Minor BM/Scatter Shot/Survival
I'm also addicted to max range, so would move points in Hakaisha's BM/MM build to get Hawk Eye, but otherwise (for a BM spec, which I just recently pulled myself from) I love it.
The BM/SV spec Hakaisha linked is BM spec without the needed MM to perform dps. Your pet just cant dps well enough for the fast pace of the arena and no matter how uber you think he is, will get slammed once your rating passes 1600, so the Survival talents aren't good enough to compensate for Imp Concussive and Lethal Shots (also passed up deterence, so drop 1 pt of Survivalist for deterence).
This is my build, which unfortunately is a hybrid Arena/5-mans SV spec:
Dunter
Was a hard decision to take Readiness, but i grabbed it because it benefits me a second rapid fire, trap, feign, and Wyvern Sting in my very short 2v2's (Rapid Fire and Wyvern Sting being the most important). I would have enjoyed Scatter Shot :(
Edit: Expose Weakness and Master Tactician don't help enough in Arena to be extremely worthwhile, but they are enough to keep your dps up (and sometimes the group's dps) in 5-mans. If you have a decent kara group, this may also be sufficient without constantly blowing 50g, but it would require more than average agility and melee members.
Edited, Nov 20th 2007 11:46pm by DukyFrodo
From your (Enabler's) spec, you speak about being fragile as a marksman and reinforce it with your talent choices:
-Imp AotH procs MUCH less in the arena because you keep moving, so move those points to Endurance training.
-I prefer thick hide over imp AotM, but the choice is up to you. They both help against melee.
-If you can spare it, take the points from intimidate & Bestial discipline and move them to Mortal Shots, or else your crits down mean nearly as much as they should. If you do this, you might as well move the other 10 pts from your pet's dps to Survivalist and Surefooted (going to help you more than you can imagine).
Deflection should come after Imp Wing Clip, so go 2/5 and 3/3.
---> Minor BM/Scatter Shot/Survival
I'm also addicted to max range, so would move points in Hakaisha's BM/MM build to get Hawk Eye, but otherwise (for a BM spec, which I just recently pulled myself from) I love it.
The BM/SV spec Hakaisha linked is BM spec without the needed MM to perform dps. Your pet just cant dps well enough for the fast pace of the arena and no matter how uber you think he is, will get slammed once your rating passes 1600, so the Survival talents aren't good enough to compensate for Imp Concussive and Lethal Shots (also passed up deterence, so drop 1 pt of Survivalist for deterence).
This is my build, which unfortunately is a hybrid Arena/5-mans SV spec:
Dunter
Was a hard decision to take Readiness, but i grabbed it because it benefits me a second rapid fire, trap, feign, and Wyvern Sting in my very short 2v2's (Rapid Fire and Wyvern Sting being the most important). I would have enjoyed Scatter Shot :(
Edit: Expose Weakness and Master Tactician don't help enough in Arena to be extremely worthwhile, but they are enough to keep your dps up (and sometimes the group's dps) in 5-mans. If you have a decent kara group, this may also be sufficient without constantly blowing 50g, but it would require more than average agility and melee members.
Edited, Nov 20th 2007 11:46pm by DukyFrodo
Thanks DukyFrodo.
You've made me see how useless the first and second tiers of BM are.
You've also made me see why Intimidation is inferior, not only because every class and their mom can use Stuns, thus activating the DR, but it relies on your pet "on next attack", which means they have to be in range, and there's a delay. A 3 second stun with a 60-second cooldown also isn't the greatest. If you activate DR with such a crappy stun, you'll be wasting valuable CC.
I see now that Scatter Shot is a great skill, but it requires great coordination, and getting that kind of coordination for a 5v5 is nearly impossible. Its 15-yard range is a handicap, as you should be trying to stay at max range at all times. I now see it as a support interrupt instead of an escape skill.
Getting "Surefooted" seemed dumb at first, but when I thought it over, it actually seemed to make sense. I now see it as a "must have" when this far in the Survival tree. I now feel that Clever Traps isn't exactly super-useful. Resourcefulness also seems like a bust. My primary trap is a Frost trap, which lasts 1 minute until activated, which then lasts for 30 seconds, and merely needs renewal. I can still stack two on top of each other without the talents to double my Entrapment proc chance. By using two Frost Traps instead of Freeze traps, I not only don't have to worry about DR, but the control is more reliable and affects more targets. I can also shoot at them without having to break some silly ice. Instead, they are immobilized 25% chance every 1 second, along with walking with 60% less speed.
Was a hard decision to take Readiness, but i grabbed it because it benefits me a second rapid fire, trap, feign, and Wyvern Sting in my very short 2v2's (Rapid Fire and Wyvern Sting being the most important). I would have enjoyed Scatter Shot :(
You say Rapid Fire is oh-so-important, but yet, why don't you get Rapid Killing? If Wyvern Sting is the only other important skill for Readiness to be used on, then I'm feeling that Readiness isn't for me.
I'm REALLY confused on why Improved Wing Clip is such hot stuff. I realize you can spam it until you get the immobilization, but I view that particularly wasteful.
Finally, I view Mortal Shots as overrated because it's about a 6% overall damage boost (discluding DoTs and obviously melee) with 20% crit.
From your suggestions, I have created THIS. Unless you can explain to me how Improved Wing Clip and Mortal Shots are really important, I think I've got this down.
You've made me see how useless the first and second tiers of BM are.
You've also made me see why Intimidation is inferior, not only because every class and their mom can use Stuns, thus activating the DR, but it relies on your pet "on next attack", which means they have to be in range, and there's a delay. A 3 second stun with a 60-second cooldown also isn't the greatest. If you activate DR with such a crappy stun, you'll be wasting valuable CC.
I see now that Scatter Shot is a great skill, but it requires great coordination, and getting that kind of coordination for a 5v5 is nearly impossible. Its 15-yard range is a handicap, as you should be trying to stay at max range at all times. I now see it as a support interrupt instead of an escape skill.
Getting "Surefooted" seemed dumb at first, but when I thought it over, it actually seemed to make sense. I now see it as a "must have" when this far in the Survival tree. I now feel that Clever Traps isn't exactly super-useful. Resourcefulness also seems like a bust. My primary trap is a Frost trap, which lasts 1 minute until activated, which then lasts for 30 seconds, and merely needs renewal. I can still stack two on top of each other without the talents to double my Entrapment proc chance. By using two Frost Traps instead of Freeze traps, I not only don't have to worry about DR, but the control is more reliable and affects more targets. I can also shoot at them without having to break some silly ice. Instead, they are immobilized 25% chance every 1 second, along with walking with 60% less speed.
DukyFrodo wrote:
Was a hard decision to take Readiness, but i grabbed it because it benefits me a second rapid fire, trap, feign, and Wyvern Sting in my very short 2v2's (Rapid Fire and Wyvern Sting being the most important). I would have enjoyed Scatter Shot :(
You say Rapid Fire is oh-so-important, but yet, why don't you get Rapid Killing? If Wyvern Sting is the only other important skill for Readiness to be used on, then I'm feeling that Readiness isn't for me.
I'm REALLY confused on why Improved Wing Clip is such hot stuff. I realize you can spam it until you get the immobilization, but I view that particularly wasteful.
Finally, I view Mortal Shots as overrated because it's about a 6% overall damage boost (discluding DoTs and obviously melee) with 20% crit.
From your suggestions, I have created THIS. Unless you can explain to me how Improved Wing Clip and Mortal Shots are really important, I think I've got this down.
If i was in a 5v5 or even a 3v3, i would drop Readiness for Rapid Killing. I might get it anyway if i started running 5-mans more than twice a week.
Imp Wing Clip can be spammed at least twice during a joust, giving you a great chance to immobilize (though root resistances are very upsetting). Ideally, it's amazing. In practice, it's great. For everyone, it is not :D
Survival Instincts seems more tempting to me than Master Tactician in the arena, but that's not always the case.
When mostly Survival, your crit should be closer to 30% (haha mine's 25%... damn), pushing Mortal Shots up to 9%. I would take it as 6%, but 9% should be irresistible to everyone.
I love Resourcefulness and the Beast Lord set, but I've gotten used to having them.
I actually love Intimidation and Scatter Shot can be sworn by vast amounts of hunters, but it would depend on your arena team to determine their effectiveness. Scatter Shot's range isn't the handicap, but the whole reason for having it. When there was a dead zone, it was one of our only defenses up-close, but dead-zone is gone and Scatter is not king anymore. With this said, I think you should keep it. It'll save your *** when you are getting run over.
Are you talking a 2v2, 3v3, or 5v5? In a 2v2, with almost any partner, you are the main target and must be able to survive. This is why Survival Instincts, Imp. Wing Clip, and any other available stun (or anti-stun/root) is such a life saver, but this drops as your team gets bigger, where it gets so much harder to kill a hunter, rather than just escape his LoS (and choose another target).
If you are grabbing Imp Stings, i'm assuming you also grabbed a scorpid pet to keep viper sting up. Since i'm grouped with a lock, all the times that i can NOT use Wyvern is pissing me off, but that's why Survival takes so much skill and practice to work effectively.
Expose Weakness is gonna be crap in a 2v2 and only minimally better in most 5v5's. I keep it because my 2v2 isn't very serious and I enjoy not getting kicked from 5-mans.
Edited, Nov 23rd 2007 1:42am by DukyFrodo
Imp Wing Clip can be spammed at least twice during a joust, giving you a great chance to immobilize (though root resistances are very upsetting). Ideally, it's amazing. In practice, it's great. For everyone, it is not :D
Survival Instincts seems more tempting to me than Master Tactician in the arena, but that's not always the case.
When mostly Survival, your crit should be closer to 30% (haha mine's 25%... damn), pushing Mortal Shots up to 9%. I would take it as 6%, but 9% should be irresistible to everyone.
I love Resourcefulness and the Beast Lord set, but I've gotten used to having them.
I actually love Intimidation and Scatter Shot can be sworn by vast amounts of hunters, but it would depend on your arena team to determine their effectiveness. Scatter Shot's range isn't the handicap, but the whole reason for having it. When there was a dead zone, it was one of our only defenses up-close, but dead-zone is gone and Scatter is not king anymore. With this said, I think you should keep it. It'll save your *** when you are getting run over.
Are you talking a 2v2, 3v3, or 5v5? In a 2v2, with almost any partner, you are the main target and must be able to survive. This is why Survival Instincts, Imp. Wing Clip, and any other available stun (or anti-stun/root) is such a life saver, but this drops as your team gets bigger, where it gets so much harder to kill a hunter, rather than just escape his LoS (and choose another target).
If you are grabbing Imp Stings, i'm assuming you also grabbed a scorpid pet to keep viper sting up. Since i'm grouped with a lock, all the times that i can NOT use Wyvern is pissing me off, but that's why Survival takes so much skill and practice to work effectively.
Expose Weakness is gonna be crap in a 2v2 and only minimally better in most 5v5's. I keep it because my 2v2 isn't very serious and I enjoy not getting kicked from 5-mans.
Edited, Nov 23rd 2007 1:42am by DukyFrodo
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