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#1 Nov 19 2007 at 9:28 PM Rating: Good
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Before I begin my post, I'd like to give all the flamers (Theo and Nooble in specific, although I do respect most of the people who are regulars of the Rogue forum) a heads up.
I did, in fact, read the stickies.
I know it's rather unorthodox to post a stereotype thread along the lines of "What's a good build?"
I'm a well-experienced, veteran rogue who's been playing since release, and I've tried just about every build there is, from cringing at Shadowstep (although, with Ultimus beating Serennia with a shadowstep build, I've looked at it in a new light.)
Now, I've reached 70 and got some decent gear, and I have begun to like the feel of daggers better then swords. Currently, I'm 41/20/0 specced, but I want to know what with 2.3 changes, would it be more beneficial to go combat daggers, for sole PvP performance? I am disliking how everyone can see me in stealth, missing prep, but enjoying the 2.6 mutilates. But, I can get the best of all three worlds with a build something like this:
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=fhg0oxZG0EzbxzZE0xcb0o
There I get Relentless Strikes, Blade Flurry, and Prep all in one neat build. The 5/5 Precision is mainly because my gear lacks +Hit, and I don't intend on getting any extra any time soon.
#2 Nov 19 2007 at 9:37 PM Rating: Excellent
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Combat Daggers is beyond horrible for PvP. CP generation is slow, positioning requirements suck, and the damage output of the build is dependent on long fights that allow you to keep up constant cycles.

As far as your linked build, I think you're confused on a few points. Imp SS and Ambush/Opportunity? Are you using swords or daggers? If it's the former, don't bother with Ambush or Opportunity. If it's the latter, don't bother with SS, and stick with Mutilate (which is really the only viable PvP dagger build). Plus, you'll get more mileage from Initiative and Dirty Tricks than you will from Camo (in PvP).

Now, on to the really confusing part...

Quote:
I'm a well-experienced, veteran rogue who's been playing since release

Quote:
Now, I've reached 70 and got some decent gear

It took you four years to hit 70? Dayum!
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#3 Nov 19 2007 at 9:54 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:
It took you four years to hit 70? Dayum!



No.. I've been 70 for many months now. I hit it around April, I think. I spread my time over a bunch of different alts as well, but I level pretty fast considering i have 4 or 5 alts above 50 that I play regularly. Anyway, thanks for the input on my build. I've found that with being slowed in arena (ice shield, poison and what not) I tend to use SS occasionally when I'm trying to catch up to someone backing away (I.E, a hunter, or one of those mages) when it's not worth it to burn CoS, or I already have.

So, is the 41/20 cookie cutter mutilate best for PvP daggers, or what?

Edited, Nov 20th 2007 12:58am by morgorg
#4 Nov 19 2007 at 9:58 PM Rating: Excellent
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morgorg wrote:
I've found that with being slowed in arena (ice shield, poison and what not) I tend to use SS occasionally when I'm trying to catch up to someone backing away (I.E, a hunter, or one of those mages) when it's not worth it to burn CoS, or I already have.

Here's a better idea: Gouge. Not only will it stop them dead in their tracks, but it means you can put those two points somewhere useful (like DW Spec or Dirty Tricks).

I'm still amazed at how many rogues simply don't use Gouge.
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#5 Nov 19 2007 at 10:01 PM Rating: Excellent
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Quote:
So, is the 41/20 cookie cutter mutilate best for PvP daggers, or what?

Pretty much. All of the other dagger builds lack the CP generation to be very effective, although that might have changed with the new Shadowstep change. Honestly, I don't know much about ShS daggers since most ShS rogues take Hemo and use swords or maces.

Still, you won't see too many ShS dagger rogues (except for Willow, but he's a scrub).
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#6 Nov 19 2007 at 10:05 PM Rating: Good
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Oh... lol. I forgot about gouge... It's actually number 3 on my old fashioned, non EonSprinter- updated key bindings. That's a very good point, and I do use it occasionally... It tends to be on cooldown as a gimp blind-type for the melee DPS, as the hunters and casters' DPS tends not to change at all, whereas if you get 30 yards away from a rogue who's burned sprint and vanish, you should be able to kite them with ease.
#7 Nov 19 2007 at 10:09 PM Rating: Excellent
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Also, super-huge-mad-crazy-brownie-points for the Firefly line in your sig.

Why can't we get more new posters like this one?
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#8 Nov 20 2007 at 12:39 PM Rating: Decent
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haha, I was wondering if anyone would recognize that... I was debating over something from House, but Theo seems to be a House-mimic, and I wouldn't want to cramp his style.
#9 Nov 20 2007 at 2:36 PM Rating: Decent
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Simple answer to the question of why you don't get more new posters like this.

We're all terrified of being told we're completely stupid. So we don't bother. I wait for someone else to ask the question (the main hand/off hand post being one example) as I don't want to come back to a load of 'you're a noob'/'read the stickies', etc, when I have read the stickies but there's something in there that I don't fully understand.
#10 Nov 20 2007 at 2:39 PM Rating: Decent
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rinnuald wrote:
Simple answer to the question of why you don't get more new posters like this.

We're all terrified of being told we're completely stupid. So we don't bother. I wait for someone else to ask the question (the main hand/off hand post being one example) as I don't want to come back to a load of 'you're a noob'/'read the stickies', etc, when I have read the stickies but there's something in there that I don't fully understand.


We don't flame for that. We flame when you come in here like a bumbling idiot with the grammer capacity of a 7th grader.
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#11 Nov 20 2007 at 2:40 PM Rating: Decent
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Grow a pair. It's only the interwebz.
#12 Nov 20 2007 at 2:45 PM Rating: Excellent
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Teddy. Druid. Nao.
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#13 Nov 20 2007 at 2:53 PM Rating: Decent
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The Demea of Doom wrote:
Teddy. Druid. Nao.



SOME OF US HAVE RESPONSIBILITIES LIKE WORK DEMEA



I should be on tonight though.
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#14 Nov 20 2007 at 3:18 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
We don't flame for that. We flame when you come in here like a bumbling idiot with the grammer capacity of a 7th grader.


Erm, its spelt grammar.. :o)

I understand why you get frustrated with people who don't write in proper English, as I happen to also hate text/leet speak.

What particularly puts me off contributing to these forums however is when someone posts a perfectly sensible reply to a post and which happens to be their humble opinion, and is then told they're an idiot. Please, do debate the best builds, for example. Surely that's what this forum is for and the advice on it is hugely useful to the more casual player. But don't tell someone they're an idiot just because they disagree with you.



Edited, Nov 20th 2007 6:21pm by rinnuald
#15 Nov 20 2007 at 3:32 PM Rating: Good
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rinnuald wrote:
Quote:
We don't flame for that. We flame when you come in here like a bumbling idiot with the grammer capacity of a 7th grader.


Erm, its spelt grammar.. :o)

I understand why you get frustrated with people who don't write in proper English, as I happen to also hate text/leet speak.

What particularly puts me off contributing to these forums however is when someone posts a perfectly sensible reply to a post and which happens to be their humble opinion, and is then told they're an idiot. Please, do debate the best builds, for example. Surely that's what this forum is for and the advice on it is hugely useful to the more casual player. But don't tell someone they're an idiot just because they disagree with you.



Edited, Nov 20th 2007 6:21pm by rinnuald


I know there are some flames on the board that aren't due, but a lot are.

People come in with build ideas. The good ones, we help.

Thing is, for the most part, we know what works and what doesn't. On this board alone we have people PVE'ing through TK and Hyjal, and we have a few of us who have played in 2000+ arena in multiple brackets. So we know what happens when, and what we thought would work, but doesn't. When someone comes and argues the validity of X, and we know it won't work, but the poster persists, it's easy to get aggravated.

Now multiply these same combination of events a few times a day for years. So we finally just start coming down with the hammer. Funny thing is, I feel it makes better players; at the same time weeding out *********

There is no reason to care bear people. If you are a moron on X, you need to know that. And it is really only in severe cases where we don't help. I know myself, have called people stupid, idiotic, what have you, but usually, we will tell why. Tell you what to fix.

This game isn't Rocket Surgery Smiley: wink, so it really isn't to hard to figure out why things work and don't.
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#16 Nov 20 2007 at 3:48 PM Rating: Decent
Quote:
Rocket Surgery?
#17 Nov 20 2007 at 3:54 PM Rating: Decent
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ZANGzadam wrote:
Quote:
Rocket Surgery?


MYteddy wrote:
Smiley: wink
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Alla's Arena/PVP Forum

SO I PLAY WoW COOL EH!?

Let that beat build.

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