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Kalgan on some mage changes - Iceblock Trainable!Follow

#1 Nov 07 2007 at 9:27 PM Rating: Good
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http://www.curse.com/articles/details/3629/


Kalgan, talking about Iceblock/Hypothermia wrote:
It's a deliberate change. We initially felt like it was too quick at 30s and decided to test it out at 45s, but after playing with it for a while we felt like it opened mages to focus fire a little too much so we decided to keep it at 30s. It's worth pointing out that making changes like this and later un-doing them is not at all uncommon, it's just most of you generally don't see that process in action since it often happens before the patch even gets to the PTR.

Since I'm here, I'll also make a small pre-emptive strike against the incoming "what about other mage concerns!" replies I'm about to get and say the following.

Two things we'll be making improvements to in the near future (although these aren't likely to make it in on time for 2.3) are having iceblock be trainable (to make sure all mages have it as a tool for pve encounters and to open up other trees as being more viable options for pvp), and to-be-finalized improvements to mana issues in longer fights


Quote:
We do plan to buff mana gems, although I don't see that as a "fix", just an improvement that needs to be made regardless.



Gonna be a huge improvement to viability in arenas for non-frost specs. And I can't complain about buffs to mana gems either. Smiley: grin

Curse figures it'll be around 2.4 or so.

#2 Nov 08 2007 at 2:04 AM Rating: Good
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Go Go FIRE SPECC!!!! or elemental - soo many options, can't decide.
#3 Nov 08 2007 at 4:41 AM Rating: Good
I think blizz have done it for me, I for one have nothing more to ask for my mage. Nothing.

-Food/water ritual
-Improved fireball nerf removed
-Iceblock
-Improved managems
Alone are amazing

All I can hope for is another instant spell similar to ice lance in either fire or arcane.

Edited, Nov 8th 2007 7:42am by anticipated
#4 Nov 08 2007 at 4:54 AM Rating: Excellent
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What makes me wonder is what they put in the 21st frost talent slot after vanishing Ice Block from there. It's quite a big question because they're neither changing a side talent nor adding a new end-tier talent, but they'll have to think of a completely new 1-point mid-tree talent that would fit into the couple years' of testing and balancing. Ice Block made sense there... it won't be easy to invent something as useful, as balanced and at the same time different and 'fresh'.

Hmmm...
#5 Nov 08 2007 at 5:22 AM Rating: Good
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ZOMFG... That probably means that there will be some kind of mage nerf to reduce our damage by half in the future... or that the Cubs will win the World Series... not sure which.
#6 Nov 08 2007 at 6:38 AM Rating: Good
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Why, hello Mr. 1700 Bracket.

Edited, Nov 8th 2007 9:38am by AynLoD
#7 Nov 08 2007 at 7:04 AM Rating: Good
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Suddenly my frost mage doesn't feel so special any more.../cry

However as pointed out before that leaves a space for a brand new talent ... :D

Edit: can't spell for my life today

Edited, Nov 8th 2007 10:05am by kizzahunt
#8 Nov 08 2007 at 8:05 AM Rating: Good
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A buff is always welcome, even if I am a frost mage and my utility in PVE has gone down even more.

The speculation now will come from knowing if the new talent to replace ice block will be worth while. If it is, I can see myself staying with frost as I like it very much. If not, then fire or arcane will have to be the way.


But what kind of talent could be helpfull? Surely unlimited snowballs is useless.

However, I thought of two things that could help.

1- A talent to help increase our crit % by 3-5 percent on unfrozen targets. There are already talents that do this but none that help the frost mage only.

2- Snowball Barrage - a dot spell that would scale with levels similar to how pyro scales. The dot spell would increase the DPS of the frost mage to make it closer to fire mages. It would also balance out losing a strong talent as iceblock.

I really would like my second option. What about you? any spells you would like to see? What do you think of my suggestions?

Sorry to highjack thread a bit, but it's related and it doesn't take away from the great news.
#9 Nov 08 2007 at 8:53 AM Rating: Excellent
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Laroche wrote:
The speculation now will come from knowing if the new talent to replace ice block will be worth while. If it is, I can see myself staying with frost as I like it very much. If not, then fire or arcane will have to be the way.




Not to scare you, but this is the talent they gave us last time they made a spec defining talent trainable.
#10 Nov 08 2007 at 9:23 AM Rating: Good
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I hope that doesn't happen pol. That is the most worthless talent in the world besides wand spec.
#11 Nov 08 2007 at 10:54 AM Rating: Excellent
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Ice Block for all trees will bump our survivability a lot on PVE/Raid with Arcane and Fire. However, I don´t think Frost will be affected as the best PvP spec...at least on the high rating Arena. It´s not just about the weak spot from Arcane/Fire being low survivability, it´s about the strong spot of this builds being the burst dmg, the 3 min combo, the high crits and stuff, with high resilience the crist aren´t even 150% from the non-crits and at high rating Arenas, on my point of view, Ice Block for Arcane/Fire will just make them live 10 seconds longer. To realy make Arcane/Fire viable on high end Arena...we need something (effect, talent, whatever) that negates resilience.

Frostbite, Water Elemental, Novas with lesser CD, Cold Snap, 2 Blocks, Ice Barrier will still make Frost shine on PvP.

The Talent replacing Ice Block could be pushback resist on Frost spells, will help Frost on both ways (PvE/Raid and PvP) or a dmg bumping (but I doubht that, since they buffed Artic Winds with dmg).

I hope the Mana eficiency buff comes reducing some spells cost or some new spell providing us a recovery, only buffing the gems will not help the PvP Mage´s much.

[ ]'s
#12 Nov 08 2007 at 11:20 AM Rating: Good
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The One and Only Poldaran wrote:
Laroche wrote:
The speculation now will come from knowing if the new talent to replace ice block will be worth while. If it is, I can see myself staying with frost as I like it very much. If not, then fire or arcane will have to be the way.




Not to scare you, but this is the talent they gave us last time they made a spec defining talent trainable.



If you were trying to scare me, you succeded. Some similar talent as a 21 point option would not work. I am not disagreeing with you, just hoping for something much better. I am campaining for a dot spell.

Another option could be a blinding wind. (similar effect to rogue blind)

Of course a fear would be great but not a mage talent.

Mages to the barricades! Vote for snowball barrage!
#13 Nov 08 2007 at 12:52 PM Rating: Decent
Sweet. All i want is 1 more spell:


Sunflare. Deals 248-483 damage (Normal instant spell +damage bonus) , 1 minute cooldown. If ignite is on a target, it will consume the ignite, deal it's remaining damage to the target, and also the final damage will be trippled.

It would be a final, extreme damage fire mage talent (Which fire mages revolve around).
#14 Nov 08 2007 at 1:07 PM Rating: Good
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My bet would be that the ice block that is trained has a long cool down and less actual ice block time, and the talent shortens the cool down and extends the amount of time you're inside the ice block.
#15 Nov 08 2007 at 1:30 PM Rating: Decent
ktangent wrote:
My bet would be that the ice block that is trained has a long cool down and less actual ice block time, and the talent shortens the cool down and extends the amount of time you're inside the ice block.


That'd be a cool idea. I wouldn't mind a talent like, Colder Ice (lame name, but oh well, that's Blizzard's job hehe). It increases Ice Block time, and the time your Water Elemental is out. (i.e you're water elemental is out for a full minute). Might be a bit unfair, but would greatly help a Frost Mage's DPS.
#16 Nov 08 2007 at 2:31 PM Rating: Decent
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355 posts
Discussing this in our guild forum today, one idea that came out that I liked was a one point talent to reduce the chance of FN breaking on damage by 20-30%. Probably would never fly, though.
#17 Nov 08 2007 at 3:08 PM Rating: Decent
I bet the 21-point talent replacement to Ice Block is called "Hypothermia Immunity". Smiley: lol Now, that would be funny.
#18 Nov 08 2007 at 7:06 PM Rating: Default
LOL NOW I WONT BE UNIQUE ANY MORE AS ARCANE PVP

BUT NOW I WILL PWN STUFF MORE LOL
#19 Nov 08 2007 at 7:28 PM Rating: Good
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My roommate had a thought on a talent I just had to share.

Cloud of Icy Mist(or some similar name)
Creates a thick cloud of mist around the mage for 15 seconds. When stealthed or invisible enemies walk through the mists, they become revealed. Also reduces damage from ranged and magic attacks to the mage by 15%.
#20 Nov 08 2007 at 9:41 PM Rating: Decent
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the improved ice block sounds like the most logical idea, I doubt that blizzard will go and create a completely new spell... mind you we can all be happy as long as it's not as bad as arcane fort.
#21 Nov 08 2007 at 11:46 PM Rating: Decent
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Hmmm...
How about a talent "Icy Tomb" which would place and iceblock like spell on the enemy target stopping it from moving,casting spells or attacking, and doing periodic DMG over 10 seconds (making the target immune to all other dmg), this wuld either have trainable ranks or scale with lvl, also would scale with frost spell dmg.

I dont know how this will go, maybe they could replace ice barrier with it and move ice barrier to where ice block used to be...Or maybe it will just be too OP

P.S- As always i blame it on being morning if i misspelled something.
p.P.S- Sorry if this idea was descussed else where , i think i heard of it but its cool ;)
#22 Nov 09 2007 at 6:26 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
Frostbite, Water Elemental, Novas with lesser CD, Cold Snap, 2 Blocks, Ice Barrier will still make Frost shine on PvP.

/agree

This change will certainly not shove you frosties off your Arena pedestal. It does make us glass cannon, 3min types slightly more viable, particularly in anything other than 5v5. I see two primary uses:

1) Well before death, perhaps 1/2 health, pop IB if you're being focus-fired. The hope is that, rather than wait out the 10secs, your opponents will be forced to switch targets, even if only momentarily. A few seconds count for alot in 2v2.
2) If it's down to 1v1 and you're both DoT'd up, pop it and watch your opponent die. My teammate is an SL/SL lock so it's very common for me to be left with little health, facing an opponent covered with DoTs.
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