I am holy and sick of it. My realm is filled with better healers than I, and almost no tanks. I'm also sick of healing fury warriors with a shield. So I'm making the switch after I gather up some decent instance blues. However, I have questions.
1) Is prot as heavily looked down upon as ret? I'm trying to do a service, not be a hindrance.
2) What should be the order of importance in which I look for gear stats?
3) What problems am I most likely to run into?
4) Is all of this answered in the F.A.Q? I read it, but should probably read it again.
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The 2 and 3 are answered in the FAQ mostly if you read between the lines. The first one isn't. Prot is not looked down upon nearly as much as ret, any kind of tank is usually praised.
8 posts
Go figure, not reading between the lines was one of the many reasons I missed out on girlfriends. Thanks, I'll go see what I can find.
Remember with all girls "no" means "yes, do it right now!" ;)
For gear:
http://www.wowwiki.com/Righteous_Armor
Definitely see about picking up these pieces save the helmet, Felsteel helm is better.
http://www.wowwiki.com/Burnoose_of_Shifting_Ages is really nice and easy to get.
And this http://www.wowwiki.com/Dabiri's_Enigma is from a very quick chain quest in Netherstorm, the boss at the end is fairly hard but I managed to trio it with a holy priest, a MM hunter, and myself.
For a nice combo, try using the effect of the above trinket with this little gem I picked up last night: http://www.wowwiki.com/Figurine_of_the_Colossus
Being a healer you should be able to go through a few of these instances and pick up the gear before doing your respec.
I struggled a lot tanking as pallie in OL because I was going for spell damage over Def rating, that was my mistake but I learned quickly enough and picked up a lot of defense gear.
I didn't face much trouble tanking as a pallie, my instance groups prefer me over our warrior tank simply because they like my ability to hold hate on multiple mobs with consecration and the like. And my hunter says I'm the only tank where he can go all out on monsters in instances, that makes me feel good. :D
Edited, Nov 7th 2007 2:04am by DrkMateo
http://www.wowwiki.com/Righteous_Armor
Definitely see about picking up these pieces save the helmet, Felsteel helm is better.
http://www.wowwiki.com/Burnoose_of_Shifting_Ages is really nice and easy to get.
And this http://www.wowwiki.com/Dabiri's_Enigma is from a very quick chain quest in Netherstorm, the boss at the end is fairly hard but I managed to trio it with a holy priest, a MM hunter, and myself.
For a nice combo, try using the effect of the above trinket with this little gem I picked up last night: http://www.wowwiki.com/Figurine_of_the_Colossus
Being a healer you should be able to go through a few of these instances and pick up the gear before doing your respec.
I struggled a lot tanking as pallie in OL because I was going for spell damage over Def rating, that was my mistake but I learned quickly enough and picked up a lot of defense gear.
I didn't face much trouble tanking as a pallie, my instance groups prefer me over our warrior tank simply because they like my ability to hold hate on multiple mobs with consecration and the like. And my hunter says I'm the only tank where he can go all out on monsters in instances, that makes me feel good. :D
Edited, Nov 7th 2007 2:04am by DrkMateo
I would actually use http://www.wowhead.com/?item=27804 over the thing from black morass. PUG BM is really a pain =/. Plus it does offer more mitigation
Ok now that someone gave actual advice, I'm now going to have to weigh in with my opinions.
Ok first off, don't get the Righteous Armor, there is better pieces for every single one of those. The spelldamage, while nice, is not really necessary and I only used my Righteous Armor to "downgrade" myself for instances where I wasn't taking enough damage and I had to drink after almost every fight.
What pieces are better than Righteous? Let's go step by step.
1. [wowitem=28285]Helm of the Righteous[/wowitem]
Better Item: [wowitem=23519]Felsteel Helm[/wowitem]
Why it's better: More armor, more potential stamina, and more defense rating, this is a no-brainer.
2. [wowitem=28203]Breastplate of the Righteous[/wowitem]
Better Item: [wowitem=28262]Jade-Skull Breastplate[/wowitem]
Why it's better: More defense, a TON of avoidance ~3% block chance.
-You take a bit of a potential stamina hit here, but this much avoidance on one piece is too good to pass up. Also, more defense rating which is always nice.
3. [wowitem=27839]Legplates of the Righteous[/wowitem]
Better Item: [wowitem=29184]Timewarden's Leggings[/wowitem]
Why it's better: Way more potential stamina, and more avoidance.
-The defense rating takes a bit of a hit here, but unlike in the previous example, you can get about 100 more stamina by grabbing these pants over the other ones. This is worth the defense hit, which honestly is made up for if you take the two above.
4. [wowitem=27739]Spaulders of the Righteous[/wowitem]
Better Item: [wowitem=27847]Fanblade Pauldrons[/wowitem]
Why it's better: Same amount of stamina, same amount of defense. However, that Parry rating blows the other shoulders out of the water. Parry is the best full avoidance stat and if you can pick it up go for it.
5. [wowitem=27535]Gauntlets of the Righteous[/wowitem]
Better Item: [wowitem=27475]Gauntlets of the Bold[/wowitem]
Why it's better: Much much higher potential stamina. The defense will take a hit, but it can be revovered in other stats.
As for trinkets, Figurine of the Colossus is awesome. Dabiri's Enigma is alright, just don't use that as your source of block rating. An on use ability is far inferior to having that block rating anyway. An alternate you can pick up in SLabs is [wowitem=27891]Adamantine Figurine[/wowitem]
You may be asking yourself, but isn't spelldamage necessary? Those peices will give me a ton of spelldamage which will increase my threat output.
I've said time and time again, that stacking spelldamage is not very necessary for a Paladin tank. Once you get to around 200 spelldamage you shouldn't have to worry about it anymore. Putting a spelldamage enchant on a spell sword and your gloves is enough to get you by. Stacking defense, avoidance stats, stamina, and armor is all more important than stacking spelldamage beyond the 200 mark.
Ok first off, don't get the Righteous Armor, there is better pieces for every single one of those. The spelldamage, while nice, is not really necessary and I only used my Righteous Armor to "downgrade" myself for instances where I wasn't taking enough damage and I had to drink after almost every fight.
What pieces are better than Righteous? Let's go step by step.
1. [wowitem=28285]Helm of the Righteous[/wowitem]
Better Item: [wowitem=23519]Felsteel Helm[/wowitem]
Why it's better: More armor, more potential stamina, and more defense rating, this is a no-brainer.
2. [wowitem=28203]Breastplate of the Righteous[/wowitem]
Better Item: [wowitem=28262]Jade-Skull Breastplate[/wowitem]
Why it's better: More defense, a TON of avoidance ~3% block chance.
-You take a bit of a potential stamina hit here, but this much avoidance on one piece is too good to pass up. Also, more defense rating which is always nice.
3. [wowitem=27839]Legplates of the Righteous[/wowitem]
Better Item: [wowitem=29184]Timewarden's Leggings[/wowitem]
Why it's better: Way more potential stamina, and more avoidance.
-The defense rating takes a bit of a hit here, but unlike in the previous example, you can get about 100 more stamina by grabbing these pants over the other ones. This is worth the defense hit, which honestly is made up for if you take the two above.
4. [wowitem=27739]Spaulders of the Righteous[/wowitem]
Better Item: [wowitem=27847]Fanblade Pauldrons[/wowitem]
Why it's better: Same amount of stamina, same amount of defense. However, that Parry rating blows the other shoulders out of the water. Parry is the best full avoidance stat and if you can pick it up go for it.
5. [wowitem=27535]Gauntlets of the Righteous[/wowitem]
Better Item: [wowitem=27475]Gauntlets of the Bold[/wowitem]
Why it's better: Much much higher potential stamina. The defense will take a hit, but it can be revovered in other stats.
As for trinkets, Figurine of the Colossus is awesome. Dabiri's Enigma is alright, just don't use that as your source of block rating. An on use ability is far inferior to having that block rating anyway. An alternate you can pick up in SLabs is [wowitem=27891]Adamantine Figurine[/wowitem]
You may be asking yourself, but isn't spelldamage necessary? Those peices will give me a ton of spelldamage which will increase my threat output.
I've said time and time again, that stacking spelldamage is not very necessary for a Paladin tank. Once you get to around 200 spelldamage you shouldn't have to worry about it anymore. Putting a spelldamage enchant on a spell sword and your gloves is enough to get you by. Stacking defense, avoidance stats, stamina, and armor is all more important than stacking spelldamage beyond the 200 mark.
8 posts
Thank you everyone for your advice. All of this gear is easy to get, and if the drop rates go my way I should have in a matter of days. I also was told that your main hand would be the one place that paladins can slack off on the tank stats- this should be your only source for spell damage. Please give your comments, whether they be yay's or nay's on that as well.
Thanks for your input :).
Thanks for your input :).
Once season 3 arena rewards come in, you can buy Gladiator's Gavel with honour =)
Quote:
Ok first off, don't get the Righteous Armor, there is better pieces for every single one of those. The spelldamage, while nice, is not really necessary and I only used my Righteous Armor to "downgrade" myself for instances where I wasn't taking enough damage and I had to drink after almost every fight.
I didn't use the helm, took your advice prior to this post and got the felsteel. I have been trying to get the items below, but they have yet to drop for me and the righteous armor has been dropping and since I was in need of an upgrade immediately (I was still in quested greens mind you and lower level blues) I did it for the short time solution. They will get replaced at some point, once luck goes my way. The timewarden leggings I can get now, but someone gave me that +30 stam +10 agi armor kit thingie as a gift earlier tonight and I am loathe to get rid of that.
I love my colossus figurine, but I really like seeing it when I stack the two. When redoubt procs and I have holy shield and hit my Dabiri, my block rate goes up to 90ish%, not that often but I love seeing that happen. Plus with the SLabs trinket same issue, ******* won't drop it despite my runs, I am -0 out of 5 or 6 times now I think.
I am listening though, assuming those drop for me, I will pick them up for sure, in the meantime though I did have a question.
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Azuremyst&n=Khalith
It's slightly behind at this moment but that's the idea for my other gear, I got the righteous breastplate and here is my Def stats as it stands right now:
Armor: 13491 with Dev aura for 56.1% reduction.
Defense: 512
Dodge: 11.75%
Parry: 16.82%
Block: 18.58%
My guild and an allied guild tried Kara the other night, tanking it wasn't really that hard, however our DPS were not geared for it and the stuff just wasn't dying fast enough so it ended up taking forever to get past the stables. By the time we killed the last horses near midnight, the ones at the beginning already started respawning, it was awful.
But that's not what my question is, I been looking at that libram that buffs holy shield, geared as I am, would I be able to start heroics, as in the slightly easier ones, and start picking up that gear and Badges of Justice?
Here's the thing about block percentages, after a while they become useless. Even though you occasionally have 90% block, you are only using about 64% of it because the rest of the block chance is getting pushed off the table. Since you already have 18% in your block chance, your block chance from abilities/trinkets can only bring you up another 46%. Holy Shield accounts for 30% of that which puts you at 16%. After that, redoubt will cover the rest of that.
I suggest you read this: http://www.wowwiki.com/Attack_table
That will explain in further detail what I'm talking about.
As for the pants, I dunno if you realize that the Timewarden's Leggings have the exact same stamina as your pants have right now 27+30 from the enchant = 57. After putting on the 40 stamina enchant, the TL will have 97 stamina, and after 3 12 stamina gems, the TL will have 97 + 36 = 133 stamina! Thats an extra 760 hp.
Once you get the pants and enchant it with what I said I think you will be ready for heroics because that will push your health over the 10k mark unbuffed.
Here's what I think are good guidelines to start tanking heroics:
>10k hp
>=490 defense
~87-88% avoidance
around 200 spelldamage
I suggest you read this: http://www.wowwiki.com/Attack_table
That will explain in further detail what I'm talking about.
As for the pants, I dunno if you realize that the Timewarden's Leggings have the exact same stamina as your pants have right now 27+30 from the enchant = 57. After putting on the 40 stamina enchant, the TL will have 97 stamina, and after 3 12 stamina gems, the TL will have 97 + 36 = 133 stamina! Thats an extra 760 hp.
Once you get the pants and enchant it with what I said I think you will be ready for heroics because that will push your health over the 10k mark unbuffed.
Here's what I think are good guidelines to start tanking heroics:
>10k hp
>=490 defense
~87-88% avoidance
around 200 spelldamage
At the stage you're probably at, the things Capn Jack is talking about is more or less on point.
However, after you've started raiding and you're dealing with DPS classes who do a great deal more damage than what you saw in regular 5 mans, stating you don't need anymore than 200 spell damage is simply incorrect.
You need the threat boost (which you will attain with tier pieces and other various pieces of armor) that the extra spell damage will give you. Unbuffed I sport a little under 400, with Wizard Oil it puts me over 400, which is great for DPS race fights.
So, don't fall completely in line with "more than 200 spell damage is useless," because it's not.
Also, pick up a good avoidance weapon as well, such as Sun Eater from Heroic Mech or King's Defender once you're in Karazhan. Enchant them with Mongoose.
These are great weapons for avoidance fights, especially those where you are alone with the boss for a while or where the boss enters a stage where you REALLY don't want to get hit, after a solid threat lead.
However, after you've started raiding and you're dealing with DPS classes who do a great deal more damage than what you saw in regular 5 mans, stating you don't need anymore than 200 spell damage is simply incorrect.
You need the threat boost (which you will attain with tier pieces and other various pieces of armor) that the extra spell damage will give you. Unbuffed I sport a little under 400, with Wizard Oil it puts me over 400, which is great for DPS race fights.
So, don't fall completely in line with "more than 200 spell damage is useless," because it's not.
Also, pick up a good avoidance weapon as well, such as Sun Eater from Heroic Mech or King's Defender once you're in Karazhan. Enchant them with Mongoose.
These are great weapons for avoidance fights, especially those where you are alone with the boss for a while or where the boss enters a stage where you REALLY don't want to get hit, after a solid threat lead.
DrkMateo, with those avoidance stats, you are currently extremely crushable.
You currently have about a 14% chance to be crushed. There are a lot of pieces to start trading out.
Most of the ones Capn Jack mentioned are ones you want to get and should fix a lot of avoidance issues you are currently having.
Get the Jade Skull Breastplate, Devilshark Cape, Timewarden's Leggings, and get Revered with Cenarion Expedition to get the neckpiece, Strength of the Untamed.
Also, it's a good idea to ignore socket bonuses for the most part and socket solely for stamina... drop Solid Stars of Elune in all those slots because the socket bonuses aren't worth the extra HP you are going to gain.
Edited, Nov 8th 2007 10:47am by weran
You currently have about a 14% chance to be crushed. There are a lot of pieces to start trading out.
Most of the ones Capn Jack mentioned are ones you want to get and should fix a lot of avoidance issues you are currently having.
Get the Jade Skull Breastplate, Devilshark Cape, Timewarden's Leggings, and get Revered with Cenarion Expedition to get the neckpiece, Strength of the Untamed.
Also, it's a good idea to ignore socket bonuses for the most part and socket solely for stamina... drop Solid Stars of Elune in all those slots because the socket bonuses aren't worth the extra HP you are going to gain.
Edited, Nov 8th 2007 10:47am by weran
By raiding I assume you mean 25-mans, in which I agree. However, kara really doesn't need a huge amount and spelldamage stats ultimately take away from avoidance stats which is really more needed at this point in the game, and gear that has spelldamage mixed in with good avoidance stats dont really start coming in until kara and the tier pieces that come with it.
Correct, just keep in mind that 200 isn't the cap, it's only the starting point.
Grab an avoidance weapon as soon as you can as well. Should always have one in your bag ready to swap in when the situation calls for it.
Grab an avoidance weapon as soon as you can as well. Should always have one in your bag ready to swap in when the situation calls for it.
Quote:
I suggest you read this: http://www.wowwiki.com/Attack_table
That will explain in further detail what I'm talking about.
That will explain in further detail what I'm talking about.
I've read it... I honestly don't understand it, I've never been able to figure out these formulas so I just look for ways to simplify them, from what I've read of avoidance it's basically:
5% miss rate + parry% + block% + dodge% and you are aiming for 102.4% total, that's the only way I can really understand it for myself and that's what I shoot for. I'll aim for the timewarden's, just feel bad that after putting all that stuff in the righteous and it won't be so easy to come by again. =/
Basically, what you just said is spot on.
Shoot for 102.4%.
What you need to know is that any extra Block % after 102.4% will fall off the table, in other words, it will be ignored.
So, if you get yourself where you are TOO block heavy... then focus more on Stamina/Armor/Dodge/Parry, but first and foremost, I'd shoot for stamina.
Shoot for 102.4%.
What you need to know is that any extra Block % after 102.4% will fall off the table, in other words, it will be ignored.
So, if you get yourself where you are TOO block heavy... then focus more on Stamina/Armor/Dodge/Parry, but first and foremost, I'd shoot for stamina.
Quote:
As for the pants, I dunno if you realize that the Timewarden's Leggings have the exact same stamina as your pants have right now 27+30 from the enchant = 57. After putting on the 40 stamina enchant, the TL will have 97 stamina, and after 3 12 stamina gems, the TL will have 97 + 36 = 133 stamina! Thats an extra 760 hp.
Once you get the pants and enchant it with what I said I think you will be ready for heroics because that will push your health over the 10k mark unbuffed.
Once you get the pants and enchant it with what I said I think you will be ready for heroics because that will push your health over the 10k mark unbuffed.
Hate to bump, but with the timewarden's would it be worth it for the socket bonus? With that new +10% stam I am over 10k unbuffed and I could put in a def rating gem instead.
you can do what you want with the gems, I just like saying that I have 133 stamina on one piece of gear. If you need the defense, then by all means use the defense gems.
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