Well it's another Monday Boo Hoo story about a horrible run over the weekend.
The Steamvaults....
Get in there. It was just like my Manatombs "horror story" I wrote awhile back.
Everything starts out fine. 2 mobs to welcome us. Sap'd one, killed other, then killed sap'd one. Big Boglord to the right, we kill him. We kill another Boglord sneaking around a bunch of mobs.
Then the fun starts. A going out of business Fear sale, and I'm the only one buying! Once Feared I dump all threat. Our Priest died 3 out of 5 pulls before I just log'd off. I have no idea how. I was using my T. Claps, Sundering the main DPS mob... trying to advoid the CC'd mobs, and T. Clapping everytime the CD is back up.
Every single time... the Priest went down. I noticed that it had to be the Fears. I was new there, so after the 1st time, I asked "Anyone know what mob is Fearing me? It's getting our healer killed". No one knew. So I tried to mark yet another mob to sheep the next pull... still no dice.
I just can't understand what happened... everytime I looked around she had EVERY mob on her.
Now I've sucessfully tanked Mech, Bot, and Arc. All one shotted. The only deaths on those runs were in Bot when our Mage decided to AoE the flower groups by the last boss. I Challenging Shouted the 1st time.. .but the 2nd he died.
Anyone got any suggestions on SV that might help? That's the worst that I've tanked ever... and I honestly did not do anything different than all the other, harder instances I've cleared with ZERO deaths.
*I don't know if the Priest was Fade'ing or not*. The only thing I can think is maybe we ALL get feared lol. Blizzard really stuck it to us on the tanking department when they clear all the threat you work hard to gather, with the cast of one stupid spell.
Also, if anyone wants to take a peek at the armory and tell me if my gear is just to shoddy for these (non-heroic) runs, that would be great.
Gyfford'sOx
Edited, Nov 5th 2007 9:42am by GYFFORD
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your gear is more than ok for SV. However, where you wiped is a tricky place. The best way to do it is to bring a hunter, mage and a rogue. That way you can trap, sheep and sap. Instead of T.clapping alot, try tab spamming sunders.
Be sure to have "Enemy Cast Bar" turned on in the game interface menu. Figure out which mob is doing the fear and kill it first. Keep an eye on the mobs health bar and keep a little rage built up in reserve to shield slam when you see him casting fear. When the cast bar comes up under the mobs health bar it will tell you what spell they are casting. If it is NOT fear then DON'T slam it away. Keep it for the fears only incase they cast faster than your timer on SS. This might help get past those few annoying pulls in the first part of the run.
If there are more than one "fear" casting mobs in the pull then be sure to take one of them out of the picture right away with either mage sheep, lock seduce or a hunter trap. Then get them at the end the same way you took out the first.
Edited, Nov 5th 2007 12:23pm by Scolariman
If there are more than one "fear" casting mobs in the pull then be sure to take one of them out of the picture right away with either mage sheep, lock seduce or a hunter trap. Then get them at the end the same way you took out the first.
Edited, Nov 5th 2007 12:23pm by Scolariman
Scholar
19 posts
it's the sirens that fear
target the coilfang sirens to go down first, as they cast fear. then coilfang oracles (healer), then coilfang sorceress (mage), then coilfang engineer (snare effect and bomb), myrmidon (prot warrior?), coilfang warrior.
if your priest is a draenei or a dwarf, fear ward works wonders.
interrupting the fear cast can be very tricky as it is quicker than a 2s cast, but it can be done, you have to be right on top of it though.
imp tclap is absolutely enough to keep aggro off the healer no matter what the case. i tanked heroic UB and it kept the secondary mobs on me at all times.
sometimes you have to look at what the healer is doing also. i remember running heroic mech with a druid tank, and the priest who was decked out in epics left after two wipes because he was getting aggro with every heal. then i noticed that he was using big heals to keep the tank up. i've heard that overhealing doesn't cause additional threat, but all i know is that every other priest that has healed me without grabbing aggro uses prayer of mending (or whichever one it is that they shoot at you and stacks to 5, restores 800 health each time you're hit) and renew for primary healing, and doesn't use bigger heals unless i get really low on health (this also tends to save the priest some mana).
your dps should also be more aggressive and be right on your *** in threat, not the healer...
other than that, just make sure you bring enough CC, as SV and sethekk halls are some of those places where good CC is very important.
statwise, your stam is in the right place but you could use more avoidance and block, though i think this must not be your entire tanking set.
Edited, Nov 5th 2007 12:37pm by fromanthebarbarian
if your priest is a draenei or a dwarf, fear ward works wonders.
interrupting the fear cast can be very tricky as it is quicker than a 2s cast, but it can be done, you have to be right on top of it though.
imp tclap is absolutely enough to keep aggro off the healer no matter what the case. i tanked heroic UB and it kept the secondary mobs on me at all times.
sometimes you have to look at what the healer is doing also. i remember running heroic mech with a druid tank, and the priest who was decked out in epics left after two wipes because he was getting aggro with every heal. then i noticed that he was using big heals to keep the tank up. i've heard that overhealing doesn't cause additional threat, but all i know is that every other priest that has healed me without grabbing aggro uses prayer of mending (or whichever one it is that they shoot at you and stacks to 5, restores 800 health each time you're hit) and renew for primary healing, and doesn't use bigger heals unless i get really low on health (this also tends to save the priest some mana).
your dps should also be more aggressive and be right on your *** in threat, not the healer...
other than that, just make sure you bring enough CC, as SV and sethekk halls are some of those places where good CC is very important.
statwise, your stam is in the right place but you could use more avoidance and block, though i think this must not be your entire tanking set.
Edited, Nov 5th 2007 12:37pm by fromanthebarbarian
If there's one thing I've found beyond helpful when I'm tanking a new instance, it's to keep WoWwiki open on that particular instance (Wowwiki-SV in this case), as it gives you a nice list of all the mobs and what they do. For instance, the fearing mobs in SV are the Sirens, so you'd want to sheep/sap them first.
Also, try and make a 'Zerker rage macro so that you can avoid getting feared (I'll give it at the end of the post). Thus far I've found it invaluable in my random tanking with fearing mobs (Mana tombs in particular :P).
Also, you should watch out for the oracles as they heal and have an AE silence. So either kill them first, CC them, or keep them interrupted.
Fear macro:
That'll toss you into 'Zerker stance, pop 'Zerker rage, then pop you back into Defencive stance (you have to spam it a little).
Also, sorry for the incoherence of this post... I'm taking a break from writting an essay and I'm on my third coffee within 4 hours. :P
Also, try and make a 'Zerker rage macro so that you can avoid getting feared (I'll give it at the end of the post). Thus far I've found it invaluable in my random tanking with fearing mobs (Mana tombs in particular :P).
Also, you should watch out for the oracles as they heal and have an AE silence. So either kill them first, CC them, or keep them interrupted.
Fear macro:
Quote:
#show Berserker Rage
/cast [stance:3] Berserker Rage; Berserker Stance
/cast [noequipped:shields] Battle Stance; Defensive Stance
/cast [stance:3] Berserker Rage; Berserker Stance
/cast [noequipped:shields] Battle Stance; Defensive Stance
That'll toss you into 'Zerker stance, pop 'Zerker rage, then pop you back into Defencive stance (you have to spam it a little).
Also, sorry for the incoherence of this post... I'm taking a break from writting an essay and I'm on my third coffee within 4 hours. :P
Quote:
interrupting the fear cast can be very tricky as it is quicker than a 2s cast, but it can be done, you have to be right on top of it though.
God ain't that the truth. Usually durning that 1.5 seconds I just Sundered and have to wait on the little CD refresh thing it does? before I get to push Shield bash.
My hindsight is 20/20... I should have just concus blow the mob, have him burned down 1st, then went on our buisness.
Quote:
statwise, your stam is in the right place but you could use more avoidance and block, though i think this must not be your entire tanking set.
I also have:
[wowitem=27891]Adamantine Figurine[/wowitem] in place of my crop..it helps a bit.
GYFFORD, Pie Eating Champion wrote:
I just can't understand what happened... everytime I looked around she had EVERY mob on her.
Currently (and this is getting changed in 2.3), mobs preferentially attack unfeared targets. You get feared, mobs peel off to the highest threat person that's not feared. While you're feared, the priest has more time to generate threat (and they'll probably be healing like a **** while the tank is feared), and you have to get back to 110% of their threat to peel the mobs off them.
Personally I'm really not a fan of macros. The multi-spamming and multiple functions for one button really make them unfriendly for my playstyle.
As an alternative (up to you though, use whichever you feel more comfortable with), I simply put my stances on my mouse buttons. The button on the left side of my mouse is Battle Stance (hit with my thumb). For Berserker Stance I use WheelDown, and for Defensive Stance I use Wheel Up. This makes it extremely easy to hit wheel down then just start spamming whichever button is berserker rage. Same thing goes for things like Pummel. I can just wheel down then spam B.
As for Berserker Rage, if you're fighting a mob that you know uses Fear, when is the best time to use Berserker Rage? Do you pop it instantly ever time it's ready, or is there a strategically advantageous time to pop it? If Fear is "casted" by the mobs you could use it when you see the casting bar, but I'm not too familiar with higher end instances so I haven't dealt with too many fearing mobs yet.
Edited, Nov 5th 2007 3:57pm by duvar
As an alternative (up to you though, use whichever you feel more comfortable with), I simply put my stances on my mouse buttons. The button on the left side of my mouse is Battle Stance (hit with my thumb). For Berserker Stance I use WheelDown, and for Defensive Stance I use Wheel Up. This makes it extremely easy to hit wheel down then just start spamming whichever button is berserker rage. Same thing goes for things like Pummel. I can just wheel down then spam B.
As for Berserker Rage, if you're fighting a mob that you know uses Fear, when is the best time to use Berserker Rage? Do you pop it instantly ever time it's ready, or is there a strategically advantageous time to pop it? If Fear is "casted" by the mobs you could use it when you see the casting bar, but I'm not too familiar with higher end instances so I haven't dealt with too many fearing mobs yet.
Edited, Nov 5th 2007 3:57pm by duvar
I used to be much the same, and I actually try and play with as few macros as possible. In fact, that fear macro is thus far the only one I use, and I only made it after a few runs of MT, so that I could focus more on threat-gen.
For the 'Zerker rage, though, I usually get my initial threat out (T. Clap in groups -> SS -> revenge), then I pop it. From my experience, the mobs tend to pop their fear about 5-10 seconds in, which is enough time for initial aggro. From there on I pop it every time it's up.
For the 'Zerker rage, though, I usually get my initial threat out (T. Clap in groups -> SS -> revenge), then I pop it. From my experience, the mobs tend to pop their fear about 5-10 seconds in, which is enough time for initial aggro. From there on I pop it every time it's up.
If you can't find the mob who is aoe fearing (or is it a normal fear? hm can't remember), there is another way to make sure the priest will not get attacked.
This is kinda the same idea u use when fighting the first mob in sl. Let him stay close. That way everybody will get feared, and thus they will get back to the one highest on the threatmeter.
You could also consider buying the PVP Trinket which removes all lbalbla you know which one i mean :p. Although it has a 5 min cd it saved my group a thousand times. Just equip it when you are gonna face fear mobs.
This is kinda the same idea u use when fighting the first mob in sl. Let him stay close. That way everybody will get feared, and thus they will get back to the one highest on the threatmeter.
You could also consider buying the PVP Trinket which removes all lbalbla you know which one i mean :p. Although it has a 5 min cd it saved my group a thousand times. Just equip it when you are gonna face fear mobs.
Scholar
42 posts
Not so much the fear thing, but I tried tanking Scholomance tonight and it wasn't working well. Casters + wtf knockback + getting hit for 250-300 dmg sucks. Oh yeah, no CC lol. 67 PLD, 58PLD, 60 Warlock, 56 Warlock, and me. What's SOP when you've got casters, nothing to run behind, and can't run up to em to shield bash cause you'll aggro everything?
Quote:
What's SOP when you've got casters, nothing to run behind, and can't run up to em to shield bash cause you'll aggro everything?
I know of two options.
1) You use your ranged weapon. Then run behind a wall. They'll stop casting, and turn the corner where you're hiding.
OR
2) Have a DPS with ranged weapons hit the mob, then run a gooooooood distance away. When I was Fury Warrior, I'd pull the caster mobs for the tank. When they stroll by our tank he eats them up with T. clap (much more threat than my ranged throw).
I always look for a wall, or small room to the side to hide behind tho since I like to pull (to get inital aggro on all the mobs coming my way, then let the CC do their thing on the single mob.
As it has been said in earlier posts, the SIREN's cast fear, so take them out first. Next, make sure you have good party composition for that instance (now you know what you need). Rogues, Locks, Hunters, Mages all work nicely...just take your pick.
So I have read this thread and I haven't seen anything about Shield Slam or Revenge. I understand T.C. but heck, sunders threat generation are complete crap compared to a nice shield slam or revenge. Use your ranged weapon, then bloodrage, and by the time your mob gets there use T.C. to grab all mobs, save the cc'd one. Then after that you should have been hit a few times and therefore you are able to use Shield Slam on a target, and with the other mobs on you I'm sure you can use Shield Block and proc a revenge (which I would tab then hit revenge) by that time either T.C. should be up or Shield Slam should be off the CD and just rince and repeat.
If you're the tank (which I'm not anymore) just tell your priest/druid to give you a HoT or the shaman/paly to give you smaller heals until you establish threat. You are the Tank, you have to make sure your group knows what is going on and what you're going to as well as what you want to happen. Sunders are the rule of thumb "Don't dps until you see 2/3 sunders" Well, it doesnt work that way anymore imo. I rarely use sunders as it is a waste of rage when you can use something with more threat produciton.
I'm pretty sure that since you know what happened and went wrong, the next time you step into SV you'll be more prepared and have a better understanding and idea of what is going to happen. We learn from our mistakes, and now you have the chance to change what happened in the wipefest and make it a more smooth run. Just remember your threat generating attacks; and they are not sunder (well they are but its too miniscule to matter) Use what works bro and you'll be fine.
So I have read this thread and I haven't seen anything about Shield Slam or Revenge. I understand T.C. but heck, sunders threat generation are complete crap compared to a nice shield slam or revenge. Use your ranged weapon, then bloodrage, and by the time your mob gets there use T.C. to grab all mobs, save the cc'd one. Then after that you should have been hit a few times and therefore you are able to use Shield Slam on a target, and with the other mobs on you I'm sure you can use Shield Block and proc a revenge (which I would tab then hit revenge) by that time either T.C. should be up or Shield Slam should be off the CD and just rince and repeat.
If you're the tank (which I'm not anymore) just tell your priest/druid to give you a HoT or the shaman/paly to give you smaller heals until you establish threat. You are the Tank, you have to make sure your group knows what is going on and what you're going to as well as what you want to happen. Sunders are the rule of thumb "Don't dps until you see 2/3 sunders" Well, it doesnt work that way anymore imo. I rarely use sunders as it is a waste of rage when you can use something with more threat produciton.
I'm pretty sure that since you know what happened and went wrong, the next time you step into SV you'll be more prepared and have a better understanding and idea of what is going to happen. We learn from our mistakes, and now you have the chance to change what happened in the wipefest and make it a more smooth run. Just remember your threat generating attacks; and they are not sunder (well they are but its too miniscule to matter) Use what works bro and you'll be fine.
poopfish wrote:
Not so much the fear thing, but I tried tanking Scholomance tonight and it wasn't working well. Casters + wtf knockback + getting hit for 250-300 dmg sucks. Oh yeah, no CC lol. 67 PLD, 58PLD, 60 Warlock, 56 Warlock, and me. What's SOP when you've got casters, nothing to run behind, and can't run up to em to shield bash cause you'll aggro everything?
I have no idea what you just said.
PLD? SOP?
PLD would have to be a way to abbreviate palladin, while SOP...
Honestly, my best guess is "So overpowered" or "Stupid overpowered" or something along those lines. Really, I have no idea. :/
Honestly, my best guess is "So overpowered" or "Stupid overpowered" or something along those lines. Really, I have no idea. :/
Taeraq wrote:
PLD would have to be a way to abbreviate palladin, while SOP...
Honestly, my best guess is "So overpowered" or "Stupid overpowered" or something along those lines. Really, I have no idea. :/
Honestly, my best guess is "So overpowered" or "Stupid overpowered" or something along those lines. Really, I have no idea. :/
Standard Operating Procedure
Well, I was way off wasn't I? Reading it... that makes a lot more sense.
/facepalm
Thanks
/facepalm
Thanks
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