I know this has been discussed before but this is always one of my favorite topics, its fun allows for shamans to be a bit creative, I wish list pretty much.
Here are my three ideas for our talent trees I figured you guys would like them ^^
Enhancement
Spirit of the wolf: Turns Shaman into a powerful wolf, much like druids and their Moonkin talent it would be a permanent buff that has a cost, while in this form the shaman can not cast any spells other then Storm Strike and Shamistic Rage (mainly for the damage reduction). In this form shaman would attack faster and would have a chance on hit to stun his enemies for 2 seconds and would also have increased attack power (maybe even gain attack power from agl like rogues?). The shaman will also gain 2 more special ongoing affects, immune to CC and also an aura that gives his party members a buffed WF (since he can't drop totems).
Elemental
Ethereal Form: Gives shaman the powers of ethereal... In WC3 this ability was used by the Spirit Walker unit, in this form he avoided all physical damage but took an increase in magical damage, although in WoW I would assume it would work differently. While in this form shaman would have increased power with damage spells by 20%, the shaman would also take 20% less damage from all types and would be able to resist spell damage push back, I would also give the shaman in this form a new spell of some sort, maybe a longer casting spell similar to star fire or pyroblast, something that would scale better then Lightning Bolt and offer higher burst but would cost allot of mana and take a long time to cast, maybe only trainable at 80? I am not sure how it would need to be balanced out maybe 10% increase damage instead of 20% or possibly make it so that in this form the shaman can not heal I am not sure, this is kind of like the shadow priest and their "Shadow Form" but I think it fits and would work nice.
Restoration
Spirit Link: This is another spell from WC3, it basically targets 2 friendly targets or group/raid members and links their health pools together, Whenever one takes damage the damage is split between both characters, whenever one is healed the healed health is split between both characters. In a perfect world this would be able to be casted on two tanks, making it easier for tanks, if one loses hate to the other tank the heals being spammed on the tank wont make the healers confused since it doesn't matter which tank they heal, and the tank will have basically double the hp and a buddy to taunt if something goes wrong. although due to game mechanics I would assume it would be shared between the tank and the shaman since I can not figure out how this would work any other way, but the affect is still more or less the same, the tank has more health, only down side is that if tank dies his partner will also die. For pvp I can see this being very useful, only thing I can think is that the linked players would need to stay within a certain range of each other and they would need to try to avoid aoe damage or it defeats the purpose.
Any body have any ideas of their own or ideas they have seen please share, and have fun with it ^^
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51 point talentsFollow
you guys are no fun =P
To the enhancement-talent
First of all: Shapeshiftig is for druids imo, yes shamans got ghost wolf, but still..
Second: as enhancement, I would want to attack FASTER, but instead slower, so that the Windfury-dmg would be higher.
By limiting the shamans to only certain abilities would also be a druid-copy IN MY OPINION(!)
Again, you want to give Elemental shamans a form also, I dont like that, its copying druids, imo
Cool idea in Resto though ;)
But a linked health, imagine a 10k+ hp resto shaman with a fury/arms warrior with 12k+ hp giving a total of 22k that the enemies have to chew on, and the resto just being able to heal himself or the warrior... its a good idea, but in pvp, it will be unbalanced, atleast in my head it would, but again, cool idea :)
Edited, Nov 1st 2007 2:22pm by NecareXX
First of all: Shapeshiftig is for druids imo, yes shamans got ghost wolf, but still..
Second: as enhancement, I would want to attack FASTER, but instead slower, so that the Windfury-dmg would be higher.
By limiting the shamans to only certain abilities would also be a druid-copy IN MY OPINION(!)
Again, you want to give Elemental shamans a form also, I dont like that, its copying druids, imo
Cool idea in Resto though ;)
But a linked health, imagine a 10k+ hp resto shaman with a fury/arms warrior with 12k+ hp giving a total of 22k that the enemies have to chew on, and the resto just being able to heal himself or the warrior... its a good idea, but in pvp, it will be unbalanced, atleast in my head it would, but again, cool idea :)
Edited, Nov 1st 2007 2:22pm by NecareXX
Yes these ideas are kind of copy paste, the ethereal from is actually a shaman spell in WC3, and the Spirit of the wolf is druidish I admit. The way I see it shaman needs abilities that offer a better scaling, and slowing down attacks would not make the shaman do more damage over time, as a matter of fact the reason enhancement currently scales better then elemental in BT to my knowledge is because of all the haste gear and how it affects melee better then casters. This means one of 2 things, shaman either gains enough haste to maintain a attack speed of 1.6 with his larger weapons to still be able to wf once ever 2 attacks and basically allow him to put in extra attacks (this is fairly easy with flurry to achieve) Now for scaling purposes your absolute goal I think would be to achieve 1.1 speed as often as possible so that you can get as many attacks in without lowering proc rate of WF. The other affect that would be going on which would also make alot of sense and has been thrown around is that the 3 second cooldown is affected by haste, although I really doubt that is the case.
Ethereal form yes sounds like moonkin, to me sounds more like shadow form to be honest but from what I have read was a shaman type of spell in WC3. It was an ability used to make one of the shaman healing units immune to phisical damage (this would be op) but take even more casted damage (not enough to justify immunity to a damage type IMO). So making it a form to decrease all damage slightly (similar to shadow) would help shaman reclaim their ability to take hits better and if needed of tank for 5 mans easier (enemies in the expansion will only hit harder and we will feel even more squishy then ever), also gaining a flat increase in damage with spells by a % is the best way to help us scale better in raids, from what I have gathered we recently lost dps in the patch by blizzard tagging a damage tax on to our LB making a spec that already scales very poorly even further behind the other classes.
Basically IMO for most of our trees we have received the shaft as far as 51 point talents go, if they aren't strong enough shamans wont bother with them, the only major talent shaman received in BC was earthen shield.
The ideas I have come up with will help shaman scale much better without flipping the game around too much and provide shaman with the necessary tools we need to compete in raid and PvP settings, The Spirit of the Wolf allows shaman to increase his dps, buff his party members with wf, and also save them from the dreaded CC they feel hurt them so much in pvp. The ethereal form helps elemental shaman as far as scaling better and take more damage (which while we are at a range once someone is in our face it is easy to prevent us from casting and lock us out of nature and we are more or less helpless without any oh crap button to save us).
Spirit Link I agree seems OP, but as a healer thats their job is to help maintain the survivability of them self or others, this helps them juggle their abilities better, and is a nice boost for the PvE environment. While restoration tree is quite powerful without earthen shield and enemies kicking and MS them it can become difficult.
Realize this, if shaman doesn't get the love needed to help them scale better in their trees it is going to mean every shaman will still have 21 points as a standard in resto, while their is nothing wrong with wanting NS I think it is ridiculous so many feel we need it or we are gimped for this or that.
So yes 51 points must be OP otherwise you will see specs like this in the expansion always 30/0/41 and 0/40/31, yes we are a hybrid but that doesn't mean we should be forced into resto to work properly in PvP and PvE, it is great to have the options their for us, but I don't think we should ever NEED them to work.
Anyhow thanks for the input more curious as to what other ppl may want to see for 51 point talents, maybe some scaling abilities that would give the scaling needed to compete with the other classes but in a more original method?
Edited, Nov 1st 2007 7:40pm by jmfmb
Ethereal form yes sounds like moonkin, to me sounds more like shadow form to be honest but from what I have read was a shaman type of spell in WC3. It was an ability used to make one of the shaman healing units immune to phisical damage (this would be op) but take even more casted damage (not enough to justify immunity to a damage type IMO). So making it a form to decrease all damage slightly (similar to shadow) would help shaman reclaim their ability to take hits better and if needed of tank for 5 mans easier (enemies in the expansion will only hit harder and we will feel even more squishy then ever), also gaining a flat increase in damage with spells by a % is the best way to help us scale better in raids, from what I have gathered we recently lost dps in the patch by blizzard tagging a damage tax on to our LB making a spec that already scales very poorly even further behind the other classes.
Basically IMO for most of our trees we have received the shaft as far as 51 point talents go, if they aren't strong enough shamans wont bother with them, the only major talent shaman received in BC was earthen shield.
The ideas I have come up with will help shaman scale much better without flipping the game around too much and provide shaman with the necessary tools we need to compete in raid and PvP settings, The Spirit of the Wolf allows shaman to increase his dps, buff his party members with wf, and also save them from the dreaded CC they feel hurt them so much in pvp. The ethereal form helps elemental shaman as far as scaling better and take more damage (which while we are at a range once someone is in our face it is easy to prevent us from casting and lock us out of nature and we are more or less helpless without any oh crap button to save us).
Spirit Link I agree seems OP, but as a healer thats their job is to help maintain the survivability of them self or others, this helps them juggle their abilities better, and is a nice boost for the PvE environment. While restoration tree is quite powerful without earthen shield and enemies kicking and MS them it can become difficult.
Realize this, if shaman doesn't get the love needed to help them scale better in their trees it is going to mean every shaman will still have 21 points as a standard in resto, while their is nothing wrong with wanting NS I think it is ridiculous so many feel we need it or we are gimped for this or that.
So yes 51 points must be OP otherwise you will see specs like this in the expansion always 30/0/41 and 0/40/31, yes we are a hybrid but that doesn't mean we should be forced into resto to work properly in PvP and PvE, it is great to have the options their for us, but I don't think we should ever NEED them to work.
Anyhow thanks for the input more curious as to what other ppl may want to see for 51 point talents, maybe some scaling abilities that would give the scaling needed to compete with the other classes but in a more original method?
Edited, Nov 1st 2007 7:40pm by jmfmb
Ok, I'll play hypothetical-craft for a bit...
Actually don't mind the "transforming" ideas, though I always had a "different" way to pull it off. Obviously without being "cookie" cutter and make it a "form" like other classes. I always thought it should be something akin to the embodiment of elemental "shields". I already concider our current shield system and effects broken (not in our favor). While I do think Earth shield is spot on for what it does, our other shields are greatly lacking in comparison. But I had a few ideas floating in my head as fixes.
First of all, take Imp. Lightning shield outta Enh (shocked? I'll get to that later) and give it to Elem. Now, revamp Imp. LS, into 2 talent specific forms, and give it some spiffy name like Embodiment of Wind/Lightning (something like that). While lightning form is active (yes its "form-like", special fx's optional, but prefered :D...tho not some cookie cutter form like the already present "elementals"), the Elem sham has a "constant" shield, but with charges. But, How can you have a constant shield, but have charges? Glad you asked! Now I mentioned in the suggested name, there was 2 forms optional to just elem. Embodiment of Wind form/aspect (whatever you wanna call it) places 3 wind shields on the user. The wind shields swallow 3 physical attacks regardless interval between effects ( so no proc CD unlike the current shield setup). Once the 3 charges are used, it will reapply free of cost! Overpowered you might ask? Well the reapplication HAS a CD, I figuer something like 20sec-1min. Thats one form! The other elem specific option that they could use is Embodiment of Lightning, which is basically a beefed up version of LS. Beefed up in the sense that it scales perportionally with LB/CL, thus when it procs its the same dmg as if they casted a LB/CL! Similar to Emb. of Wind, it will reapply automatically on a CD. Also, while in Emb of Lightning, a persistant effect similar/= to that of Tot. of Wrath. Yes, I intended to consolidate that ability into that form. I never thought it was fair that Boomkin's get the same % crit increase, just for staying in a form, without a MP maintanence, unlike ours that has a upkeep!
Now the strategy that the Elem has to ask themselves is, which form to use, and they better decide well because, while you can switch back and forth, it will have something like a 5min CD between changes. Have more mobility/Surivability? or more unfriendly to the touch? Choices...
Now, for Enh...Embodiment of Flame or Embodiment of Stone, keeping with the "Nature" shield/armor/form(whatever) theme are the Enh choices. I haven't thought a "charge" system like the other shield options I mentioned, but the switching CD applies. The differences of the forms are Emb of Flame, gives a increase to run speed (something on par with a lv 40 mount), and increase to melee speed, and a Chance on hit to effect party members also (haven't thought up a value of increase). Emb. of Stone is a base increase of 30% of armor and immune to snare effects. As you might have noticed, these have similar aspects to Bloodlust, UL rage and Sham. Rage (2.3ver). I intended to consolidate the skills, giving more choices to Enh. Also, Shock dmg associated with the Emb. Shield active is increased/ or increased effect.
Enh are "ok+" blitz fighters, or thats at least how I have seen its playstyle and feel whats best suited to the spec/class after a few years of playing. The Embodiment of the "blitz" is high dmg and fast attack. We got the "high dmg" part down right! But we suck at the mobility dept! Thus I give Enh the option of either "blitzing" speed and power, but still subject to all the current CC abilities we currently still get pwned by, OR Be immune to the CC's but your stuck walking at the same slow **** speed we currently do, but hopefully live longer when kitted :p More importantly, since hate management is nearly non-existant as a Enh, the Emb of Stone can server as a "OS" move for if/when we grab hate. The extra armor should put us on par with plate at least, but at a dps loss compared to Emb of Fire, not to mention the lack of the AOE dps buff that Emb of Fire provides. Granted the 5 min CD between switches is similar to a mages Ice block or a locks soul shatter, thus it should be used accordingly.
Now, regarding Resto Shaman's. Frankly, there isn't much I can think of that they already do great (Did I mention I hate the spec and hated playing it for as long as I did? :P). The only "tweak", I might suggest and also in keeping with my "shield" ideas. Emb. of Earth or Water. Basically, Emb of Earth is Earth Shield, but with my idea of a persistant reapplication, and Emb of Water is water shield (with the persistant effect when active). Now, a BIG difference between Resto Shields would have that the other 2 specs couldn't do, is the ability of talent down the CD of the reapplication and the CD of the switching between "shields". Also, the Emb of Earth's reapplication ONLY applies to the shaman themself, not if the shield is "shared" with another person. Same rules apply for shared Earth shield.
I never thought it was "fair" that our shields blow a Global CD, for "minimal" returns, granted I liked the "theme" of the shields, granted I think Blizzard lacked depth in explioting the concept for the class. Other ideas that Im on the fence about incorperating regarding my Emb concept are;
Are the purgable?
Spell stealable?
# of initial charges/effect amount from charges.
The Depth on where these abilities are located in the talent tree. My guess is that it should be pretty deep, something like 21-31 and maybe even 41 spec skills. My intention is that these abilities should be "exclusive" to that class. Perhaps even if the "shield" is ONLY associated with THAT spec (like how earth is JUST associated to Resto). Granted even if the Emb effects are exclusive to the related spec, keeping the current Shield effects usable to specs not associated with the Emb feature (namely WS and LS) I don't believe would "break" the class dynamics, as a whole. Ex; Enh using LS, like how it is now, but obviously without the Emb.
Im obviously not content with the the current standing of our shields (w/ exception of Earth), but a change is needed. Granted the root of my idea for the most part "fixes" the Global CD problem and MP consumption for reapplication. The rest of the ideas are more "style" or at least what I see as relevant "style" of the class. Much of it is adjustments of abilities existing abilities, thus it wasn't my intent to completely "break" game play, but obviously from experiance...I see "areas of NEED".
As any hypothetical idea this isnt something set in stone, or for that matter anywhere NEAR the edit board @ Blizzard! At current I'm just a gamer like you, and hope that by some small whim of a chance that someone likes my ideas! If you dont like it....read my sig :P
Even better if someone by word of mouth tells their friend that has a friend that works in the mail room @ Blizzard, that tells a programmer about this genius poster on Alla, that has exceptional Autodesk Maya 2008, Story Board writer, Animator, extensive understanding in Lighting and Rendering, and runs a successful web-design company for 10 years (-_-)b, and has resumes ready to send to a willing blizzard staff...hypothetically speaking :-|
Edited, Nov 2nd 2007 6:20am by gpyfb
Actually don't mind the "transforming" ideas, though I always had a "different" way to pull it off. Obviously without being "cookie" cutter and make it a "form" like other classes. I always thought it should be something akin to the embodiment of elemental "shields". I already concider our current shield system and effects broken (not in our favor). While I do think Earth shield is spot on for what it does, our other shields are greatly lacking in comparison. But I had a few ideas floating in my head as fixes.
First of all, take Imp. Lightning shield outta Enh (shocked? I'll get to that later) and give it to Elem. Now, revamp Imp. LS, into 2 talent specific forms, and give it some spiffy name like Embodiment of Wind/Lightning (something like that). While lightning form is active (yes its "form-like", special fx's optional, but prefered :D...tho not some cookie cutter form like the already present "elementals"), the Elem sham has a "constant" shield, but with charges. But, How can you have a constant shield, but have charges? Glad you asked! Now I mentioned in the suggested name, there was 2 forms optional to just elem. Embodiment of Wind form/aspect (whatever you wanna call it) places 3 wind shields on the user. The wind shields swallow 3 physical attacks regardless interval between effects ( so no proc CD unlike the current shield setup). Once the 3 charges are used, it will reapply free of cost! Overpowered you might ask? Well the reapplication HAS a CD, I figuer something like 20sec-1min. Thats one form! The other elem specific option that they could use is Embodiment of Lightning, which is basically a beefed up version of LS. Beefed up in the sense that it scales perportionally with LB/CL, thus when it procs its the same dmg as if they casted a LB/CL! Similar to Emb. of Wind, it will reapply automatically on a CD. Also, while in Emb of Lightning, a persistant effect similar/= to that of Tot. of Wrath. Yes, I intended to consolidate that ability into that form. I never thought it was fair that Boomkin's get the same % crit increase, just for staying in a form, without a MP maintanence, unlike ours that has a upkeep!
Now the strategy that the Elem has to ask themselves is, which form to use, and they better decide well because, while you can switch back and forth, it will have something like a 5min CD between changes. Have more mobility/Surivability? or more unfriendly to the touch? Choices...
Now, for Enh...Embodiment of Flame or Embodiment of Stone, keeping with the "Nature" shield/armor/form(whatever) theme are the Enh choices. I haven't thought a "charge" system like the other shield options I mentioned, but the switching CD applies. The differences of the forms are Emb of Flame, gives a increase to run speed (something on par with a lv 40 mount), and increase to melee speed, and a Chance on hit to effect party members also (haven't thought up a value of increase). Emb. of Stone is a base increase of 30% of armor and immune to snare effects. As you might have noticed, these have similar aspects to Bloodlust, UL rage and Sham. Rage (2.3ver). I intended to consolidate the skills, giving more choices to Enh. Also, Shock dmg associated with the Emb. Shield active is increased/ or increased effect.
Enh are "ok+" blitz fighters, or thats at least how I have seen its playstyle and feel whats best suited to the spec/class after a few years of playing. The Embodiment of the "blitz" is high dmg and fast attack. We got the "high dmg" part down right! But we suck at the mobility dept! Thus I give Enh the option of either "blitzing" speed and power, but still subject to all the current CC abilities we currently still get pwned by, OR Be immune to the CC's but your stuck walking at the same slow **** speed we currently do, but hopefully live longer when kitted :p More importantly, since hate management is nearly non-existant as a Enh, the Emb of Stone can server as a "OS" move for if/when we grab hate. The extra armor should put us on par with plate at least, but at a dps loss compared to Emb of Fire, not to mention the lack of the AOE dps buff that Emb of Fire provides. Granted the 5 min CD between switches is similar to a mages Ice block or a locks soul shatter, thus it should be used accordingly.
Now, regarding Resto Shaman's. Frankly, there isn't much I can think of that they already do great (Did I mention I hate the spec and hated playing it for as long as I did? :P). The only "tweak", I might suggest and also in keeping with my "shield" ideas. Emb. of Earth or Water. Basically, Emb of Earth is Earth Shield, but with my idea of a persistant reapplication, and Emb of Water is water shield (with the persistant effect when active). Now, a BIG difference between Resto Shields would have that the other 2 specs couldn't do, is the ability of talent down the CD of the reapplication and the CD of the switching between "shields". Also, the Emb of Earth's reapplication ONLY applies to the shaman themself, not if the shield is "shared" with another person. Same rules apply for shared Earth shield.
I never thought it was "fair" that our shields blow a Global CD, for "minimal" returns, granted I liked the "theme" of the shields, granted I think Blizzard lacked depth in explioting the concept for the class. Other ideas that Im on the fence about incorperating regarding my Emb concept are;
Are the purgable?
Spell stealable?
# of initial charges/effect amount from charges.
The Depth on where these abilities are located in the talent tree. My guess is that it should be pretty deep, something like 21-31 and maybe even 41 spec skills. My intention is that these abilities should be "exclusive" to that class. Perhaps even if the "shield" is ONLY associated with THAT spec (like how earth is JUST associated to Resto). Granted even if the Emb effects are exclusive to the related spec, keeping the current Shield effects usable to specs not associated with the Emb feature (namely WS and LS) I don't believe would "break" the class dynamics, as a whole. Ex; Enh using LS, like how it is now, but obviously without the Emb.
Im obviously not content with the the current standing of our shields (w/ exception of Earth), but a change is needed. Granted the root of my idea for the most part "fixes" the Global CD problem and MP consumption for reapplication. The rest of the ideas are more "style" or at least what I see as relevant "style" of the class. Much of it is adjustments of abilities existing abilities, thus it wasn't my intent to completely "break" game play, but obviously from experiance...I see "areas of NEED".
As any hypothetical idea this isnt something set in stone, or for that matter anywhere NEAR the edit board @ Blizzard! At current I'm just a gamer like you, and hope that by some small whim of a chance that someone likes my ideas! If you dont like it....read my sig :P
Even better if someone by word of mouth tells their friend that has a friend that works in the mail room @ Blizzard, that tells a programmer about this genius poster on Alla, that has exceptional Autodesk Maya 2008, Story Board writer, Animator, extensive understanding in Lighting and Rendering, and runs a successful web-design company for 10 years (-_-)b, and has resumes ready to send to a willing blizzard staff...hypothetically speaking :-|
Edited, Nov 2nd 2007 6:20am by gpyfb
okay, I see you both used Can O´ Text Wall, so ill reply in chunks :)
First, yes shamans need to attack faster, so with your enhancement-idea give them a passive haste? (not too much, it would be too imba :S)
The spirit link with double hp in pvp would be OP imo, so change it abit in some kind, maybe only 50% extra hp, or give it a SHORT duration (I dont know, 10 sec maybe? 10 sec is ALOT in pvp/arena)
Else I agree on the rest you write, which is actually a sum up :)
To gpyfb
Like the idea of the shield swallowing physical attacks is COOL! :D
But, uhm, on a rogue (example) or any other fast-hitting one (Feral Druid, fury warrior, DW shaman(?)) it wouldnt do much, but a slow hitting (arms warrior, ret-pala?) you would completly negate them (which is imba :D) I dont know, just wanted to tell you this :)
I like the DC, id vote for like 30 sec, maybe 40, and then talent points to lower it by 10 sec
About the improved LS, here is a scenario:
You stand in the arena, you see a warrior coming up to you, you can see you can fire off a LB/CL before he is close enough, he charge.
Your improved LS hits him as hard as LB/CL (as you stated it would)
Your shaman has the Lightning Overload Talent it procs, firefing off a "second" LB/CL
Your have Natures Swiftness and use it to fire a "third" instant LB/CL
Coped with Elemental MAstery, one will be free and 100% critchance
yes its a long shot, but that would be DEVASTATING! :O
Think you could kill someone without them getting to you, lol, @#%^ that guy who did 25k hit with 10+ Stormstirkes on a target and then CL, ha! :D
Merging the totem with the shaman would give the shaman a passive +5% crit yes, but it would be copying druids again, shamans use their totems, its part of _THE_ shaman, make it stay that way with Totem of Wrath, instead, do something else ;)
I might "defend" druids a lot on this topic (my main is a druid, that maybe why ) :)
Shamans can now tank? :S
OS = Oh sh*t? if thats the case, you want a 30% armor increasement when we grab aggro so we can stay alive? xD nice idea ;D
Edited, Nov 2nd 2007 11:06am by NecareXX
First, yes shamans need to attack faster, so with your enhancement-idea give them a passive haste? (not too much, it would be too imba :S)
The spirit link with double hp in pvp would be OP imo, so change it abit in some kind, maybe only 50% extra hp, or give it a SHORT duration (I dont know, 10 sec maybe? 10 sec is ALOT in pvp/arena)
Else I agree on the rest you write, which is actually a sum up :)
To gpyfb
Like the idea of the shield swallowing physical attacks is COOL! :D
But, uhm, on a rogue (example) or any other fast-hitting one (Feral Druid, fury warrior, DW shaman(?)) it wouldnt do much, but a slow hitting (arms warrior, ret-pala?) you would completly negate them (which is imba :D) I dont know, just wanted to tell you this :)
I like the DC, id vote for like 30 sec, maybe 40, and then talent points to lower it by 10 sec
About the improved LS, here is a scenario:
You stand in the arena, you see a warrior coming up to you, you can see you can fire off a LB/CL before he is close enough, he charge.
Your improved LS hits him as hard as LB/CL (as you stated it would)
Your shaman has the Lightning Overload Talent it procs, firefing off a "second" LB/CL
Your have Natures Swiftness and use it to fire a "third" instant LB/CL
Coped with Elemental MAstery, one will be free and 100% critchance
yes its a long shot, but that would be DEVASTATING! :O
Think you could kill someone without them getting to you, lol, @#%^ that guy who did 25k hit with 10+ Stormstirkes on a target and then CL, ha! :D
Merging the totem with the shaman would give the shaman a passive +5% crit yes, but it would be copying druids again, shamans use their totems, its part of _THE_ shaman, make it stay that way with Totem of Wrath, instead, do something else ;)
I might "defend" druids a lot on this topic (my main is a druid, that maybe why ) :)
Quote:
Emb. of Stone is a base increase of 30% of armor and immune to snare effects.
Shamans can now tank? :S
Quote:
the Emb of Stone can server as a "OS" move for if/when we grab hate.
OS = Oh sh*t? if thats the case, you want a 30% armor increasement when we grab aggro so we can stay alive? xD nice idea ;D
Edited, Nov 2nd 2007 11:06am by NecareXX
Quote:
Even better if someone by word of mouth tells their friend that has a friend that works in the mail room @ Blizzard, that tells a programmer about this genius poster on Alla, that has exceptional Autodesk Maya 2008, Story Board writer, Animator, extensive understanding in Lighting and Rendering, and runs a successful web-design company for 10 years (-_-)b, and has resumes ready to send to a willing blizzard staff...hypothetically speaking :-|
Neo, you live in a dream world xD
Quote:
Shamans can now tank? :S
There was a time when we would :)
And situationally we still do (more like OT than MT...but it happens, especially at a Enh)!
Granted since we lack reliable threat keeping tools, other than straight up dmg and FS, so I don't see us being a "threat" to the other true 3 tanking classes.
Mainly, the armor increase would be used as a OS button when we grab hate (specifically Enh). 2.3 is adjusting our Sham rage to incorperate that exact Dmg% dampen effect, so really its not too far fetched :)
Quote:
But, uhm, on a rogue (example) or any other fast-hitting one (Feral Druid, fury warrior, DW shaman(?)) it wouldnt do much, but a slow hitting (arms warrior, ret-pala?) you would completly negate them (which is imba :D) I dont know, just wanted to tell you this :)
Exactly! Thats the choice I want a elem shaman to ask themself. Am I about to get ganked by a rogue? Or is that warrior going to charge me? Choices...
In which case Emb of lightning might be better since their little stun lock gimick is going to cost them a butt load of dmg! Currently ALL classes (inclueding a inposing shaman attack), gives a rats **** if a shaman has a shield up or not (except Earth shield, that causes "complications" :D)! Frankly due to the current CD on charges, the ratio of dmg recieved to the 1500ish given (full proc over 10sec-ish) is moot to the attacker. This might even the odds, especially since its more than likely a rogue can take a shaman from 0-near dead (if not full dead) in a stunlock currently. Emb of lght will make that rogue gamble...and the shaman too. Adds more depth to stragey.
Obviously the Emb of wind would be good for slower melee hitters, which currently Arm's wars are the bane of shaman's of any spec...generally. Since charge and LB's share the same range, LB's become negateable to a 1v1 confrontation, not to mention charge is instant, LB's at best are 1.5s cast. Emb of wind would hopefully swallow the charge+hamsting+MS that followed it. Allowing the sham some time to react and hopefully get "some" distance to counter. Yes, it forces a war to blow 2 SHORT CD's, but currently thoughs 2 CD's are enough to KILL, and frankly thats really not the end of other toys war's can throw at something. Basically, Emb of wind would force a war to gamble and try to blow their wad like how they currently do, or perhaps charge, Spam hamsting or rend til it connects (in order to remove the Emb effect), THEN start MSing. Granted it MS would probably not be up yet, since they are forced to blow some rage to get the charges off, but I think thats a fair trade off.
If anything, its not a arm war that would be hit hard by Emb of wind...it would be a 2h Enh shaman, since we only have one instant attack.
I think rather then making LS work better through a 51 talent it should just be buffed anyway =P
LS doesn't put out as good of damage in comparison to a Lightning Bolt, and with the new improved WS around the corner it seems like there is no point in useing it ever again =P
I think regardless of what they do with shaman LS needs to have the ability to crit and the ability to proc LO to make it a worthwhile tool for elemental in pvp when dealing with melee. Remember before BC, I use to kill rogues with LS alone and it worked because even though I was stun locked they where hurting themselves more then they hurt me, a bit over powered yes but it has definitely suffered major scaling issues.
LS doesn't put out as good of damage in comparison to a Lightning Bolt, and with the new improved WS around the corner it seems like there is no point in useing it ever again =P
I think regardless of what they do with shaman LS needs to have the ability to crit and the ability to proc LO to make it a worthwhile tool for elemental in pvp when dealing with melee. Remember before BC, I use to kill rogues with LS alone and it worked because even though I was stun locked they where hurting themselves more then they hurt me, a bit over powered yes but it has definitely suffered major scaling issues.
gpyfb wrote:
Exactly! Thats the choice I want a elem shaman to ask themself. Am I about to get ganked by a rogue? Or is that warrior going to charge me? Choices...
Yeah choices pwn! (like when playing on my druid, ive got a ******** of different stuff up my sleeve! :D
but, as you said yourself, they could be spamming stuff like hamstring, until that Emb og Wind is gone :S
i wonder what you guys have against lightning shield it´s a gem, especially if we talk about dmg per mana. i got it on the mousewheel button an refresh as soon as it´s down an my manapool allows it, especially in combat.
Quote:
i wonder what you guys have against lightning shield it´s a gem, especially if we talk about dmg per mana. i got it on the mousewheel button an refresh as soon as it´s down an my manapool allows it, especially in combat.
At low levels LS is awesome, it's decent damage at low cost. Unfortunately it scales with spellpower so it's essentially useless to the high end Enh Shaman (be interesting to see if that changes with the new talents).
What really kills LS at high levels though is that we get Water Shield, which returns mana to us when we get hit (and next patch will return more and cost 0 to cast). So we have a choice... negligible damage or considerably increased sustainability... I know what I'd choose.
Oakenwrath wrote:
i wonder what you guys have against lightning shield it´s a gem, especially if we talk about dmg per mana. i got it on the mousewheel button an refresh as soon as it´s down an my manapool allows it, especially in combat.
I cant look at the real numbers, since im at school, but my LS costs like 350 mana, and does a total of like 450, and thats WAY too expensive for me and my 2300 mana at lvl 48 as an enhancement shaman, I dont ever use it, never.
Ah.. One of my pet subjects.
Don't write off LS so easily, don't forget you can cast it before a fight and regenerate all the mana before you start. It also scales up nicely with Improved LS talent (obviously) and Stormstrike.
For Info.
Previous Thread.
Give it a whirl, see what happens.
Don't write off LS so easily, don't forget you can cast it before a fight and regenerate all the mana before you start. It also scales up nicely with Improved LS talent (obviously) and Stormstrike.
For Info.
Previous Thread.
Give it a whirl, see what happens.
Quote:
Ah.. One of my pet subjects.
Don't write off LS so easily, don't forget you can cast it before a fight and regenerate all the mana before you start. It also scales up nicely with Improved LS talent (obviously) and Stormstrike.
For Info.
Previous Thread.
Give it a whirl, see what happens.
Don't write off LS so easily, don't forget you can cast it before a fight and regenerate all the mana before you start. It also scales up nicely with Improved LS talent (obviously) and Stormstrike.
For Info.
Previous Thread.
Give it a whirl, see what happens.
How odd that a thread that referances key information on why LS IS NOT a good ability (actually shields in general), and usually turns out to be lack luster at BEST, is used to "support" LS use?
I already pointed out, which is basically a reflection of most endgame shaman's thoughts on the matter, why our shields generally need help. I won't bother rewriting it, since its already stated in the link :)
I'm not sure what your intent was to quote that thread, since its contradictory to your point your trying to state! But thank you for referancing it for truths sake. :)
Edited, Nov 8th 2007 10:44am by gpyfb
Apologies for any confusion, I was replying to the previous poster and not to the Thread Heading.
dreddz wrote:
Ah.. One of my pet subjects.
Don't write off LS so easily, don't forget you can cast it before a fight and regenerate all the mana before you start. It also scales up nicely with Improved LS talent (obviously) and Stormstrike.
For Info.
Previous Thread.
Give it a whirl, see what happens.
Don't write off LS so easily, don't forget you can cast it before a fight and regenerate all the mana before you start. It also scales up nicely with Improved LS talent (obviously) and Stormstrike.
For Info.
Previous Thread.
Give it a whirl, see what happens.
true true, but, I dont want to waste 350+ mana, then stand still to regenerate it, and THEN enter combat, thats a waste of time for me, since my goal is to lvl atm ;)
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