Retribution getting threat reduction talent...Follow

i would not consider rolling with RF and a 2Her tanking, even though i've done it countless times. truth is, pre-60 almost any class can tank if they are a few levels above the mobs. a Ret pally can only hold aggro with a 2H, switch to a shield for dmg reduction and you might as well be *****-slapping the mobs.

Blizz seems to have hardwired a gift for us, saying "If you want dps we wont let you tank, now choose"



We did Maulgar with 7 pallies last night. even mages had Might!

However, for a Holy Paladin to get that 3% crit, they can't spec deep enough into Protection for Improved Concentration Aura. Gone, then, will be the days of a one-spec-fits-all Holy Paladin that can PvP and raid without respeccing. Are you willing to forfeit that convenience? I sure as hell wouldn't. Especially when you consider that in order to judge Crusader, that Holy Pally is not judging either Light or Wisdom, so I say leave the judging of Crusader up to the Retribution Paladins.

No, as it will come to stand, if I was going to take more than two Paladins to a raid I would prefer the third one be Retribution. Crusader Strike will remove the need for constant judgement jousting, keeping the Holy Pallies safer and less preoccupied, plus three judgements up far more reliably than possible before. They can provide a basic blessing so one of the Holies can use BoK. And they're providing a 2% damage increase on top of all that.

You guys can all keep complaining if you want, but in my opinion, this fixes Retribution Paladins sufficiently enough to make them raid-worthy providing there are at least two other Paladins whose judgements they can serve to refresh. Maybe even without if they're good enough.

EDIT:


Nine classes and you want to spend 5, 1/5, or 20% of your total raid slots on one class just for blessings which are largely superfluous after the second blessing and completely unnoticeable after the third?

Well, to each his own, I guess, but that's not a raid I want to be in...

Edited, Oct 22nd 2007 9:30pm by Gaudion

Nah, the choice comes from whether to use CC or not :) I did near 30% DPS in Heroic Sethekk AOE tanking everything. Wish I got a SS of that ...

Well every instance I've tanked so far I've come either first or second on the damage meter, second only behind the aggro-magnet Mage or Hunter who refuses to control his DPS at all and then screams "TAUNT OMG" when the mobs smear him across the wall.

I think you know the ones I mean.

With a bit of spelldmg gear, Holy Shield is basically a turbocharged damage reflector, every time something hits you they get a substantial smack in the face from the Shield; add in a Felsteel spike (you do have a Felsteel spike...?) and BoSanc and you can cause a few hundred DPS *per mob*. The only exception is casters, but Blood Elves are even sorted there because you can use Arcane Torrent to pull them into melee range so you can Consecrate.

~sins

Man, I remember there was some other Retribution change that wasn't too deep in the tree and everyone complained the problem was that other builds could use it so its not a ret buff. People were also complaining that damage buffs are worthless for ret paladins because the real problem was too much threat capping their damage potential.

So what does Blizzard do? They make a talent that does EXACTLY what everyone was asking for, pretty much to the letter.

Now everyone is convinced that retribution paladins don't need a reduced threat ability and its too far into the tree.

If I was blizzard, I'd just take away all paldin's magic abilities about now and change the class name to 'Namby pamby warrior-wannabes' since people are going to complain no matter what they do.

Quit'cher'********

Edited, Oct 24th 2007 1:24pm by digitalcraft

This just in, according to worldofraids.com, in the latest PTR patch, fanaticism's tooltip now shows that the threat reduction won't apply if RF is up. Yay for bringing back more hybridization.
Looks like we're still getting the best of both worlds, after all (if this makes it to live, of course).

It begs the questions, why are you DPSing in a stance that increases your threat rather than one that decreases it? There is nothing saying a ret pally HAS to have RF up, so why would giving them the option be so bad of an idea?

QFT

people can theorycraft and try to debunk the need for Ret pallies but the fact is after 2.3: we're here, we're *****, and gonna get some gear. now live with it.

ok first off, pull the hostility because there's no reason for it.



This is what you said, you talked about taking aggro, not OTing. Those are two completely different things, so you don't need to jump all over Loki for "ignoring" your post.

To clarify:

Taking Aggro: Pushing past the threat that the tank has and therefore provoking the mob to attack you instead.

Off Tanking: Purposefully gearing up and tanking a specific mob or mobs where you may not be the most suitable to main tank, however can get the job done for the time being.


Secondly, non-tanking specs of any class should not be tanking at all once you hit outlands. Before that, a ret or holy or whatever can fill those rolls, but after that it gets harder and harder. I wouldn't let an Arms warrior tank a 70 instance or a Ret Paladin or whatever, it's just not worth it.

Edited, Oct 26th 2007 12:29pm by CapJack