I'm sorry, but I seriously loled at those horror stories. I probably would have laughed harder, except for the fact that I've "been there, done that", meaning that they have all happened to me before. The Ret Paly going all out with Righteous Fury active, the Rogue stunning mobs you are trying to pull back because of a pathing mob you want to avoid thus getting that mob too, the Hunter who puts his trap where you say you're gonna tank, the Warrior trying to tank with a 2H in Battle or even BERSERKER Stance (triple fail on that one)!!
The original question was why do people do it? (expanding it to include other issues here) Because they're only interested in themselves is probably the number one reason, followed by people that just flat fail at their class.
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Why do people fight you over threat?Follow
I remember one time I was running Blood Furnace, and there was this retarded-*** hunter who for some reason wouldn't take Taunt off his pet.
From that point on, the only time I'll tank for a hunter is if I'm the group leader, so i can kick their dumb *** if they do crap like that.
- AND
From that point on, the only time I'll tank for a hunter is if I'm the group leader, so i can kick their dumb *** if they do crap like that.
Dude I don’t know what you guys are ******** about…seriously. My warrior is so badass, I dps/tank instances unarmed, yeah I said it...UNARMED. Knuckle to knuckle like our grandfathers used to do. You heard me. I could rip agro off of your prostitute mothers on dollar nights.
UNGH UNGH UNGH… And then be like WHAAAT?!?
UNGH UNGH UNGH… And then be like WHAAAT?!?
You get a time out for that post chood, back in your cage!
In defense of warriors, it is perfectly possible to DPS-tank most of the lower instances, especially given the buffs to Improved Thunderclap. All the way up to Sunken Temple I used my two-hander, and I had an inexperienced healer with me. After that mobs just hit too hard. It depends on group capabilities, though; asking permission and preference is both good etiquette and good for the group.
My worst-ever tanking story takes place in Maraudon. I was running it on my 48 shaman at the time, in a DPS role; the group's tank was a 55 warrior. Level 55 is quite high for Maraudon, so it should have been a breeze. It wasn't. This guy generated ZERO threat on targets other than his primary. He wouldn't Thunderclap. He wouldn't Demo Shout. He wouldn't tab and Sunder. Sweeping Strikes? Cleave? Whirlwind? Nothing. He refused advice, too; just said "That doesn't work" and the like, and went back to what he was doing.
Being responsible, my natural impulse was to cover for him and off-tank the mobs he let escape. However, Inner Maraudon presents two unique obstacles that made this nightmarish for a shaman. First, the four-lizard pulls silence. Seeing as a lot of shaman threat is from spellcasts, this made things rough (especially since it means I also couldn't heal). Second, the worst pulls in the place are the double big rocks that, on death, spawn a bunch of little rocks. All of said rocks are immune to Nature damage, and (pre-TBC) the shaman's main threat moves were all nature based. Plus, our brilliant tank would, upon killing a big rock, target the other big rock. That means a potential EIGHT little rocks smashing our healer to jelly, and me with extremely limited means to help out.
After one particularly harrowing encounter, while everyone was drinking and recovering, our tank said something that will haunt me for a long time.
"You know what? I think I figured it out. The reason I can't hold aggro on these guys is because I'm too high-level."
No one knew what to say. There is no real response to such an astounding lack of comprehension.
My worst-ever tanking story takes place in Maraudon. I was running it on my 48 shaman at the time, in a DPS role; the group's tank was a 55 warrior. Level 55 is quite high for Maraudon, so it should have been a breeze. It wasn't. This guy generated ZERO threat on targets other than his primary. He wouldn't Thunderclap. He wouldn't Demo Shout. He wouldn't tab and Sunder. Sweeping Strikes? Cleave? Whirlwind? Nothing. He refused advice, too; just said "That doesn't work" and the like, and went back to what he was doing.
Being responsible, my natural impulse was to cover for him and off-tank the mobs he let escape. However, Inner Maraudon presents two unique obstacles that made this nightmarish for a shaman. First, the four-lizard pulls silence. Seeing as a lot of shaman threat is from spellcasts, this made things rough (especially since it means I also couldn't heal). Second, the worst pulls in the place are the double big rocks that, on death, spawn a bunch of little rocks. All of said rocks are immune to Nature damage, and (pre-TBC) the shaman's main threat moves were all nature based. Plus, our brilliant tank would, upon killing a big rock, target the other big rock. That means a potential EIGHT little rocks smashing our healer to jelly, and me with extremely limited means to help out.
After one particularly harrowing encounter, while everyone was drinking and recovering, our tank said something that will haunt me for a long time.
"You know what? I think I figured it out. The reason I can't hold aggro on these guys is because I'm too high-level."
No one knew what to say. There is no real response to such an astounding lack of comprehension.
going back to the main topic (and primary post) was he tanking/fighting for treat for a single mob or all of the mobs? if he was doing single mob he might have been thinking about single mob hitting him = more rage for moves. if he was trying for all mobs it's a wash he's an idiot.
ChahDresh wrote:
After one particularly harrowing encounter, while everyone was drinking and recovering, our tank said something that will haunt me for a long time.
"You know what? I think I figured it out. The reason I can't hold aggro on these guys is because I'm too high-level."
"You know what? I think I figured it out. The reason I can't hold aggro on these guys is because I'm too high-level."
...
Wow ... I knew people could say/do some dumb things, but I think that takes the cake.
I had that experience with my pali while running WC.
This warrior... 1 level higher than me. severely undergeared compared to me, was suppose to be dpsing. He decided to taunt the mob every time after I used divine intervention to save my wife (the healer) from random add.
I told him to quit taunting unless he knew he wasn't pulling my mob from me. reguardless he kept doing it. we ended up wiping twice due to it. he taunted a mob that he couldn't tank due to having more than 100 health less than me and a horrible melee weapon. my wife and druid spent all mana trying to keep him alive. I went OOM trying to keep up tanking due to his stupid tard self rushing ahead and pulling while my wife was trying to drink to restore mana.
I didnt have party control so I finished the instance and left.
This warrior... 1 level higher than me. severely undergeared compared to me, was suppose to be dpsing. He decided to taunt the mob every time after I used divine intervention to save my wife (the healer) from random add.
I told him to quit taunting unless he knew he wasn't pulling my mob from me. reguardless he kept doing it. we ended up wiping twice due to it. he taunted a mob that he couldn't tank due to having more than 100 health less than me and a horrible melee weapon. my wife and druid spent all mana trying to keep him alive. I went OOM trying to keep up tanking due to his stupid tard self rushing ahead and pulling while my wife was trying to drink to restore mana.
I didnt have party control so I finished the instance and left.
Quote:
He decided to taunt the mob every time after I used divine intervention to save my wife (the healer) from random add.
I'm confused.... did you have to use DI because he was taunting the mob and thus incurring aggro creating a possible wipe? Also, nice chivalry, hopefully you don't DI too early, because you can do a lot before the wipe comes.
Quote:
I told him to quit taunting unless he knew he wasn't pulling my mob from me.
Every time he taunts its going to pull aggro off you, thats what taunt does.
The rate of idiocy tends to go down as leveling goes up, best thing to do is when he runs up and pull when your healer is drinking and just watch as he gets killed. Hopefully he will get the picture, or leave, either way bonus to you.
Whenever I have a warrior in a pug and they utter even one sentence like "are you sure you can manage?" they are booted without explanation and I get a real dps class.
Quote:
"Many warriors, despite not wanting to tank, have trouble believing anyone other than a warrior can tank. So they pull stupid sh*t like that."
QFT
Edited, Oct 19th 2007 6:36pm by TacticalRage
I, in no way advocate these DPSholes. but look at it this way. if you, as a tank, are battling for aggro but not losing it and no one is dying...you are maximizing your potential and that of the group.
one of the reasons i became a pally tank was to complement the high-threat dps in my guild. coming off of a Retadin i know first hand how frustrating it is dealing dmg with a low-threat tank at the helm. in Kara, mages dont fear the aoe anymore.
i might argue that d!ckwads trying to out-aggro you in 5mans forces you to modify your technique. however, if they roll with RF up or use unnecessary taunts then they can f@ckoff!
one of the reasons i became a pally tank was to complement the high-threat dps in my guild. coming off of a Retadin i know first hand how frustrating it is dealing dmg with a low-threat tank at the helm. in Kara, mages dont fear the aoe anymore.
i might argue that d!ckwads trying to out-aggro you in 5mans forces you to modify your technique. however, if they roll with RF up or use unnecessary taunts then they can f@ckoff!
Quote:
going back to the main topic (and primary post) was he tanking/fighting for treat for a single mob or all of the mobs? if he was doing single mob he might have been thinking about single mob hitting him = more rage for moves. if he was trying for all mobs it's a wash he's an idiot.
It was one mob and to make it worse, the secondary mob. People should have been dpsin 1 at a time, but he'd break off and go grab a random one. More rage may give more moves, but they were taking the hits too hard and overworking the healer. I could AoE and keep several on me/not lose a ton of hp.
9 posts
I get this from a Shadow Priest and a DPS warrior in my guild all the time. They are a couple IRL, so it kinda makes sense.
They REFUSE to cooperate in a group with a paladin tank. Doing SH today to get keys for folks, the priest targets my primary mob, about 2 seconds after I consecrated to get all 7 on me, and lays into it with everything she had. After we rez her, she starts ******** about how paladins cannot hold aggro, how we should CC as many as possible, "cause thats how she and her BF do it" and how he holds aggro off her with no problems.
Everyone in the group goes over it with her, dot em all, spread dps around, they all die faster than CCing 3 of them and burning them all 1 by 1.
We do the next few pulls np, and get to the fun stuff, all the 5 pulls. She starts in again on how we need to CC them, and how Paladins suck at tanking... We end up having to rez her again, and talk to her, and rez, and talk.
Oddly enough, she was the only one to die, and she died about 4 times, in an hour long run.
Her BF actually does the stance dance to sunder and taunt when DPSing since "paladins cannot tank".
My view of folks that will not learn, and will not listen and keep fighting you for aggro when they have been told that it does not work that way is: They are intentionally stupid.
Edited, Oct 20th 2007 1:59am by rowanwolf
Edited, Oct 20th 2007 12:03am by rowanwolf
They REFUSE to cooperate in a group with a paladin tank. Doing SH today to get keys for folks, the priest targets my primary mob, about 2 seconds after I consecrated to get all 7 on me, and lays into it with everything she had. After we rez her, she starts ******** about how paladins cannot hold aggro, how we should CC as many as possible, "cause thats how she and her BF do it" and how he holds aggro off her with no problems.
Everyone in the group goes over it with her, dot em all, spread dps around, they all die faster than CCing 3 of them and burning them all 1 by 1.
We do the next few pulls np, and get to the fun stuff, all the 5 pulls. She starts in again on how we need to CC them, and how Paladins suck at tanking... We end up having to rez her again, and talk to her, and rez, and talk.
Oddly enough, she was the only one to die, and she died about 4 times, in an hour long run.
Her BF actually does the stance dance to sunder and taunt when DPSing since "paladins cannot tank".
My view of folks that will not learn, and will not listen and keep fighting you for aggro when they have been told that it does not work that way is: They are intentionally stupid.
Edited, Oct 20th 2007 1:59am by rowanwolf
Edited, Oct 20th 2007 12:03am by rowanwolf
rowanwolf wrote:
My view of folks that will not learn, and will not listen and keep fighting you for aggro when they have been told that it does not work that way is: They are intentionally stupid.
That and/or they are out to "prove" that Paladins can not tank. I actually had someone once that was mainly there to "prove" I could not hold hate over him (Mage). When he couldn't pull threat off me at all, he got mad. It was kinda funny, and sad at the same time.
I love when a pally is willing to tank. It means I can go Arms/Fury and just dps AND get a few days of decent soloing. No worrying about anyone else's threat level but my own, no marking targets and hoping the CC can do their job, it's quite relaxing. Then I remember how much I enjoy tanking and respec back to Prot. 
4 posts
Warriors run off Rage. If they are not getting hit - they are not gaining the rage they need to fight to their potential and can only do simple hits. If they aren't tanking .. do you suppose they should be healing instead? The Job of a warrior is typically doing DPS or Protecting others from damage as much as possible. Neither can be effectively accomplished without using rage. My main is a Warrior and I've this problem alot particularly with Pally's. I think I got the point accross one day when I suggested I hand out food for healing.
Tamanie wrote:
Warriors run off Rage. If they are not getting hit - they are not gaining the rage they need to fight to their potential and can only do simple hits. If they aren't tanking .. do you suppose they should be healing instead? The Job of a warrior is typically doing DPS or Protecting others from damage as much as possible. Neither can be effectively accomplished without using rage. My main is a Warrior and I've this problem alot particularly with Pally's. I think I got the point accross one day when I suggested I hand out food for healing.
A well specced DPS warrior can have tons of rage for DPS without taking hits. You gain rage by doing damage as well.
Man, this has been driving me nuts lately, just got my Pally to 59 and the class I hate most at the moment is my own main's class... Shaman's, damn aggro hogs.
Enh shamans think they can apply their solo strategy to their group strategy but they really cant.
you can usually tell how a shammy likes to roll when he drop his 1st set of totems. are they for him or for the group? oO
2 posts
These stories really make me want to cry. I love my enhancement shaman, he does so much damage, but he uses all the right totems to help out a pally tank (mainly so he doesn't have to hold back so much). I really think that people need to learn that pally tanks are a really great asset to a team, I know that the two people I play with most, a holydin and the shaman, absolutely love having me around to tank for them. Most people seem to get batter about it as you progress further, but I just wish that people would let me pull a little more often, I got AS for a reason, you know. Oh well, I just figured that I would give my opinion on the idiots that plague WoW.
Quote:
Enh shamans think they can apply their solo strategy to their group strategy but they really cant.
I guess you could call "kill it before it kills me" a strategy. I agree though, they need to learn not to bring that attitude to groups... I really hope I don't do all the things I have been dealing with other sham's doing in the past few weeks... I'm sure I don't... I hope :-(
9 posts
I played my prot warrior for a long time prior to TBC. I understand how to generate rage, how to apply my skills to hold aggro, and how to yoink it off a tard that gets it by accident. Having said that here is something you should have kept in mind:
If you are not a protection warrior, and are not geared AMAZINGLY better than the Paladin that is tanking, you keep your little fingers clear of the aggro keys unless it is coordinated with the tank. Use the rage you get from hitting the mobs to use your abilities. Goes slower for you, but tough, its about the group, not you.
If you are Protection specced warrior, you could ask "Why is the paladin tanking instead of me?" It could be better gear, the paladin knows the fight, the group needs to do the pulls in a why a palladin does it better, or a tonne of other reasons? Coordinate with the group, if you do not like the answer, find a different group.
If a non prot warrior asks if they should be on heals or handing out food in the back since they cannot tank, I would have to say "Yes, or you could bring a more useful dps class to an instance next time."
If you are not a protection warrior, and are not geared AMAZINGLY better than the Paladin that is tanking, you keep your little fingers clear of the aggro keys unless it is coordinated with the tank. Use the rage you get from hitting the mobs to use your abilities. Goes slower for you, but tough, its about the group, not you.
If you are Protection specced warrior, you could ask "Why is the paladin tanking instead of me?" It could be better gear, the paladin knows the fight, the group needs to do the pulls in a why a palladin does it better, or a tonne of other reasons? Coordinate with the group, if you do not like the answer, find a different group.
If a non prot warrior asks if they should be on heals or handing out food in the back since they cannot tank, I would have to say "Yes, or you could bring a more useful dps class to an instance next time."
Quote:
Most people seem to get batter about it as you progress further, but I just wish that people would let me pull a little more often, I got AS for a reason, you know. Oh well, I just figured that I would give my opinion on the idiots that plague WoW.
I always pull, I don't let anyone else. Don't wait for them to let you, you do it. If they sheep or something before you pull, break it with AS. When they tell you not to, tell them to wait until you pull. The ONLY time I don't pull, is if there is a Rogue sapping and I feel it is a necessary target to sap, like a couple of the mobs in SLabs.
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