Soo... fun situation just arrised last night with my guild.
Just for fun, i respecced 20/41/0 2 handed fury for kara last night, and did amazingly well against the rest of our dps(3rd overall, 1st on aran, curator and maiden).
So anyways, i decided that id stay this spec for our 25 mans seeing as we have 3 other tank, 3 feral druids and even a prot pally. Normally, ive been the 2nd prot warrior for our guild, but i dropped inactive a little due to real life issues and was in the process of being bumped to 3rd.
I tell our GM this, and he tells me that if im not full protection, ill completely lose my 25 man spots. His reasoning were that the guild was lacking sufficient tanking. He told me that i need to respec back or hell see to it that all my credit will be wiped and that i wont even be allowed to go on 25 mans unless they really REALLY need a melee dps.
So, heres my question... What would you guys do in this situation?
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Hearing stuff like this really ticks me off. Not at you OP, but in general. It's a freaking game GM/Officers.
I have not been in a actual raiding guild... maybe reading about stories like this is why. I keep hearing "I'm a pally they told me to change to Holy" or "I'm a Druid and they demanded I change to Resto(?)", etc etc etc.
It always sounds to me like a greedy rich kid with a bunch of kids over, then the rich kid appoints what toys and what the kid can do with that toy he's being loaned.
In other words it really does not sound like that much fun. I came over from ffxi and don't want to resort back to that life style. "You need to log on at this time, and stay log'd on until this time, then you have to be at this zone by this time, and to wrap up you need to stand around camping this guy with us for hours.
I left my 2nd job when I deleted Gyfford (ffxi). I'll choose what spec I'm going to be. Not trying to be cocky, but it is a game after all that I pay the fees for.
Convert if you want OP, but I'd pass. There has to be another class that would not mind changing to w/e they want.
*side note* That being said, I chose Warrior for the straight endgame wanted-ness. Everyone needs a tank for the most part, I constantly see shouts for one. So in that thinking, I knew from day 1 that eventually down the line I'd convert from one of the 6 other DPS classes into a Protect tank. I was cool with that.
Keep in mind there are plenty of other classes that are designed for DPS. Only a select few that can fill the Endgame tanking roll... well, at least. Protect Warrior/Pally. Druid not bad, but no parry or block.
I have not been in a actual raiding guild... maybe reading about stories like this is why. I keep hearing "I'm a pally they told me to change to Holy" or "I'm a Druid and they demanded I change to Resto(?)", etc etc etc.
It always sounds to me like a greedy rich kid with a bunch of kids over, then the rich kid appoints what toys and what the kid can do with that toy he's being loaned.
In other words it really does not sound like that much fun. I came over from ffxi and don't want to resort back to that life style. "You need to log on at this time, and stay log'd on until this time, then you have to be at this zone by this time, and to wrap up you need to stand around camping this guy with us for hours.
I left my 2nd job when I deleted Gyfford (ffxi). I'll choose what spec I'm going to be. Not trying to be cocky, but it is a game after all that I pay the fees for.
Convert if you want OP, but I'd pass. There has to be another class that would not mind changing to w/e they want.
*side note* That being said, I chose Warrior for the straight endgame wanted-ness. Everyone needs a tank for the most part, I constantly see shouts for one. So in that thinking, I knew from day 1 that eventually down the line I'd convert from one of the 6 other DPS classes into a Protect tank. I was cool with that.
Keep in mind there are plenty of other classes that are designed for DPS. Only a select few that can fill the Endgame tanking roll... well, at least. Protect Warrior/Pally. Druid not bad, but no parry or block.
Mongolikescandy wrote:
By credit, do you mean some sort of DKP? If so, I'd respec to prot and within the next few runs, I would bid on whatever you can and cash out. That would be followed up with a nice /gquit.
Quote:
He told me that i need to respec back or hell see to it that all my credit will be wiped and that i wont even be allowed to go on 25 mans unless they really REALLY need a melee dps.
By credit, do you mean some sort of DKP? If so, I'd respec to prot and within the next few runs, I would bid on whatever you can and cash out. That would be followed up with a nice /gquit.
25 posts
Not DKP but we use a cumulative roll bonus for each previous time youve been to the raid were working on, and you can use as much or as little as you want kinda like an auction. He told me if i dont redo prot he was going to wipe my bonus clean for all raids and i wont be able to accumulate until i do go prot.
Im seriously thinking of leaving the guild, but i have a lot of friends there and id hate to leave.
Im seriously thinking of leaving the guild, but i have a lot of friends there and id hate to leave.
DPS is fun, but I'd respec Prot as he asks. From what you say, it sounds as if he thinks another warrior tank is going to be necessary.
On top of this, I wouldn't break out for this reason alone especially since you mention you have friends in the guild.
On top of this, I wouldn't break out for this reason alone especially since you mention you have friends in the guild.
Quote:
He told me if i dont redo prot he was going to wipe my bonus clean for all raids and i wont be able to accumulate until i do go prot.
That's really shoddy. You have already did the work for all those "points", and they're going to take them away from you? I'd leave in a heartbeat now. IMO things you worked towards already should not be touched. If they want to say "Or you won't get anymore of these 'points' until you change" that's a bit better, or BEST WAY might be "Well if you don't change to Protect to main tank, I can't promise how much 'playing' time you'll see, due to over abundance in DPS classes"
Now if they were smart. They'd let everyone stay where they're at. Start monitoring the overall DPS per run. Then cross those with the other canidates for the spec change, that way they keep the better DPS as DPS and change the lesser DPS toons.
I guess I'm just not cut out for the endgame raiding guild dramaSo, your other 3 prot wars and 3 feral druids and prot pali... how geared are they?
Not to sound classist, but prot pali's should not be brought to a 25 man raid. Feral druids have more limited use's than a prot war in most any situation.
If your 2nd MT, that means your probably the 2nd best geared person in your guild. This means your probably a keystone for the guild to progress with.
Sadly (DPS is a nice change from always tanking); warriors best role in a raid is Tank, 2nd best is Off tank DPS (D/w and some prot spec). As a pure dps spec, we don't fill slots as well as a rogue could. From a PURE dps approach. Casters don't pull agro like melee classes, so having a lot of ranged dps can be an easy way to go in terms of DPS, from a raid leaders perspective. It requires 110% of tank agro from a melee class to pull agro, it requires 130% of tank agro for a ranged class to pull agro.
This is why I miss 40 man raids. Their is usually ALWAYS a slot open if your an active player. And losing a player didn't matter as much comparatively. 1/25 or 1/40.
But if your melee dps group is full, spec prot. Keep your spot. Their shouldn't be more than 1 melee dps group in a 25 man raid. And if your a 6th melee dps spec class person, and haven't geared appropriately. Your gonna probably get cut from the list.
So my opinion in what to do. Buck up, spec prot. Do your dailies, save some gold, spec DPS for your farm raids (kara). Spec prot for your progression raids.
Not to sound classist, but prot pali's should not be brought to a 25 man raid. Feral druids have more limited use's than a prot war in most any situation.
If your 2nd MT, that means your probably the 2nd best geared person in your guild. This means your probably a keystone for the guild to progress with.
Sadly (DPS is a nice change from always tanking); warriors best role in a raid is Tank, 2nd best is Off tank DPS (D/w and some prot spec). As a pure dps spec, we don't fill slots as well as a rogue could. From a PURE dps approach. Casters don't pull agro like melee classes, so having a lot of ranged dps can be an easy way to go in terms of DPS, from a raid leaders perspective. It requires 110% of tank agro from a melee class to pull agro, it requires 130% of tank agro for a ranged class to pull agro.
This is why I miss 40 man raids. Their is usually ALWAYS a slot open if your an active player. And losing a player didn't matter as much comparatively. 1/25 or 1/40.
But if your melee dps group is full, spec prot. Keep your spot. Their shouldn't be more than 1 melee dps group in a 25 man raid. And if your a 6th melee dps spec class person, and haven't geared appropriately. Your gonna probably get cut from the list.
So my opinion in what to do. Buck up, spec prot. Do your dailies, save some gold, spec DPS for your farm raids (kara). Spec prot for your progression raids.
GYFFORD, Pie Eating Champion wrote:
Hearing stuff like this really ticks me off. Not at you OP, but in general. It's a freaking game GM/Officers.
I have not been in a actual raiding guild... maybe reading about stories like this is why. I keep hearing "I'm a pally they told me to change to Holy" or "I'm a Druid and they demanded I change to Resto(?)", etc etc etc.
It always sounds to me like a greedy rich kid with a bunch of kids over, then the rich kid appoints what toys and what the kid can do with that toy he's being loaned.
In other words it really does not sound like that much fun. I came over from ffxi and don't want to resort back to that life style. "You need to log on at this time, and stay log'd on until this time, then you have to be at this zone by this time, and to wrap up you need to stand around camping this guy with us for hours.
I left my 2nd job when I deleted Gyfford (ffxi). I'll choose what spec I'm going to be. Not trying to be cocky, but it is a game after all that I pay the fees for.
Convert if you want OP, but I'd pass. There has to be another class that would not mind changing to w/e they want.
*side note* That being said, I chose Warrior for the straight endgame wanted-ness. Everyone needs a tank for the most part, I constantly see shouts for one. So in that thinking, I knew from day 1 that eventually down the line I'd convert from one of the 6 other DPS classes into a Protect tank. I was cool with that.
Keep in mind there are plenty of other classes that are designed for DPS. Only a select few that can fill the Endgame tanking roll... well, at least. Protect Warrior/Pally. Druid not bad, but no parry or block.
I have not been in a actual raiding guild... maybe reading about stories like this is why. I keep hearing "I'm a pally they told me to change to Holy" or "I'm a Druid and they demanded I change to Resto(?)", etc etc etc.
It always sounds to me like a greedy rich kid with a bunch of kids over, then the rich kid appoints what toys and what the kid can do with that toy he's being loaned.
In other words it really does not sound like that much fun. I came over from ffxi and don't want to resort back to that life style. "You need to log on at this time, and stay log'd on until this time, then you have to be at this zone by this time, and to wrap up you need to stand around camping this guy with us for hours.
I left my 2nd job when I deleted Gyfford (ffxi). I'll choose what spec I'm going to be. Not trying to be cocky, but it is a game after all that I pay the fees for.
Convert if you want OP, but I'd pass. There has to be another class that would not mind changing to w/e they want.
*side note* That being said, I chose Warrior for the straight endgame wanted-ness. Everyone needs a tank for the most part, I constantly see shouts for one. So in that thinking, I knew from day 1 that eventually down the line I'd convert from one of the 6 other DPS classes into a Protect tank. I was cool with that.
Keep in mind there are plenty of other classes that are designed for DPS. Only a select few that can fill the Endgame tanking roll... well, at least. Protect Warrior/Pally. Druid not bad, but no parry or block.
That's nice and all but if you've never been in an end-raiding guild you wouldn't understand.
The OP respecced to arms/fury for fun. This means he joined the raiding guild as a prot warrior. Why should the raid allow another dps if they need tanks? If you was doing an instance in a pug and you had dps and a healer would you take another dps or would you find a tank? The OP's guild leader may be a little harsh but it's only fair if he joined the guild to tank. If he didn't intend to tank he should have let the guild know before joining.
If a guild asked me to respec and I didn't want to I'd find a guild that needed my spec. I wouldn't create pointless drama over it though. If a group needs a healer I shouldn't ***** about them not inviting me for dps. The group wouldn't advance at all. Guilds and raids are very similar but on a larger scale. They need to fill slots with healers, tanks and dps. If you lack one but not another there's no reason to invite more of what you already have even if they're a really great player. It's not rude and it shouldn't tick you off. It's just part of the game in having a variety of classes to play with.
If the guild doesn't need you and your spec there's probably a guild somewhere else that does.
my guild is hopefully hitting kara this weekend, so we're not in the same place here, but i sort of feel your pain.
i spec'd and geared for dw fury from the start. i farmed aldor rep, consortium rep, ogrila rep, and god knows how many instances for dw fury gear. out of maybe 20 players level 60+, 7 are warriors, and 4 are 70's (however, one of them is now playing a priest as his main since we have no healers). one, the GM, is spec'd full prot. one is our BG/pvp warlord ^^ but has no clue how to run instances. i, on the other hand, have run tons of instances for my gear and have respec'd to prot/fury/arms and back and forth a few times, and i've been recommended as "a good tank". i would LOVE to spec dw fury for kara, but i'm fully expecting to spec full prot and tank along with the GM.
my point is, buck up and take one for the team. like Devious said, spec prot for progression raids and maybe fury for your farming raids, and if you really just want to dps then cash out and find a guild that will let you dps more often (or even exclusively). but personally? i think that if you aren't willing to spec prot and tank, then you aren't being a good warrior... tanking is our #1 job and we're the best at it, i don't know any numbers off hand but with all the threat we can throw out and all of our damage mitigation (that isn't limited to high armor like druids), we are the best tanks. so do what we're best at, and if you don't like it, roll a rogue ^^
Edited, Oct 11th 2007 5:27pm by fromanthebarbarian
i spec'd and geared for dw fury from the start. i farmed aldor rep, consortium rep, ogrila rep, and god knows how many instances for dw fury gear. out of maybe 20 players level 60+, 7 are warriors, and 4 are 70's (however, one of them is now playing a priest as his main since we have no healers). one, the GM, is spec'd full prot. one is our BG/pvp warlord ^^ but has no clue how to run instances. i, on the other hand, have run tons of instances for my gear and have respec'd to prot/fury/arms and back and forth a few times, and i've been recommended as "a good tank". i would LOVE to spec dw fury for kara, but i'm fully expecting to spec full prot and tank along with the GM.
my point is, buck up and take one for the team. like Devious said, spec prot for progression raids and maybe fury for your farming raids, and if you really just want to dps then cash out and find a guild that will let you dps more often (or even exclusively). but personally? i think that if you aren't willing to spec prot and tank, then you aren't being a good warrior... tanking is our #1 job and we're the best at it, i don't know any numbers off hand but with all the threat we can throw out and all of our damage mitigation (that isn't limited to high armor like druids), we are the best tanks. so do what we're best at, and if you don't like it, roll a rogue ^^
Edited, Oct 11th 2007 5:27pm by fromanthebarbarian
If you're one of the MAIN main tanks then you should stay prot until you have people ready to take your place just for guild progression. HOWEVER if you do that well on DPS charts, you should realize that that DPS isn't really #3, your AP buff is also giving your rogues, hunters, druids and etc. more DPS.
If he's saying sh*t like if you don't spec prot I'll wipe ALL OF YOUR POINTS you really REALLY HAVE TO consider finding a new guild. You have points right now, use them but do not go into negative points [if you have such a thing]
Unless he has mentioned to you before (and you agreed to) being a full time tank no matter what [like the hard core guilds do], you have a full right of being dps. Also, you have put in efforts into these raids and deserve gear. Leaving with still positive "roll points" or whatever you use, still shows that you have put in more than you took out.
But really, having a GM DEMANDING and even BLACKMAILING you to be a spec is outrageous and will only get worse as you go along.
I def. don't agree with the above poster or devious on this one unless the mentioning before thing.
EDIT: fury warriors are still as common as they were in the past, damn near every guild that is progressing has one, may as well tell enh. shamans to go resto because thats "what they're best at". It's called raid utility for a reason. I'd rather have a 2nd warrior that can put on a shield and tank certain encounters and dps others than a warrior who can ONLY tank and when he is not tanking not be able to do over 200 dps. [except for fights where you need more than one mt - like VR/hydross/etc]
Edited, Oct 11th 2007 3:31pm by russki
If he's saying sh*t like if you don't spec prot I'll wipe ALL OF YOUR POINTS you really REALLY HAVE TO consider finding a new guild. You have points right now, use them but do not go into negative points [if you have such a thing]
Unless he has mentioned to you before (and you agreed to) being a full time tank no matter what [like the hard core guilds do], you have a full right of being dps. Also, you have put in efforts into these raids and deserve gear. Leaving with still positive "roll points" or whatever you use, still shows that you have put in more than you took out.
But really, having a GM DEMANDING and even BLACKMAILING you to be a spec is outrageous and will only get worse as you go along.
I def. don't agree with the above poster or devious on this one unless the mentioning before thing.
EDIT: fury warriors are still as common as they were in the past, damn near every guild that is progressing has one, may as well tell enh. shamans to go resto because thats "what they're best at". It's called raid utility for a reason. I'd rather have a 2nd warrior that can put on a shield and tank certain encounters and dps others than a warrior who can ONLY tank and when he is not tanking not be able to do over 200 dps. [except for fights where you need more than one mt - like VR/hydross/etc]
Edited, Oct 11th 2007 3:31pm by russki
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