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I'm a rogue. I'm running into war/resto druid setups TONS now in the 1700's and I lose 99% of the time. No point in catching the druid with the warrior intercepting and hamstringin' me. The druid cyclone's the priest and basically can outlast my priest mana wise (he has 10.9k hp and 436 resil). Bottom Line Question - How do I kill you guys in arena while getting my *** pounded off by a war? I'm in ruin battle group. So you can give me advice and be sure I won't use it on you if you're not in my battlegroup :D Very much appreciated guys.
there aint much you CAN do. you pretty much have it figured out. the war keeps you snared so you cant get to the druid while they run your priest oom.
your best bet is to probably chain blind and mind control to allow you to get some time on the warrior. just start burning the warrior while your priest LoS's the druid (to avoid cyclone). the warrior can only focus on one of you at a time, so if hes on your priest, KS him and have your priest MC him and run him away (he may trinket this, but itll give you at least another second or two of time to act). if he does trinket, MC again. this is reliant on being able to avoid the feral charge and the cyclone, not to mention creating a situation where the warrior cant interrupt it.
with the war MCed, the druid is forced to do something about it (assuming war trinket is down). this means he brings himself into the open, so you take the chance to re-stealth (since youre hopefully out of combat by now). your priest then lets the warrior go, drops a fear, and proceeds to MC the druid while you lock down the warrior again. if the druid or warrior interrupts MC in some way, you blind the druid.
basically, just create a situation where the druid is forced to heal the warrior but cant because of good use of consecutive CC. use your dispel in order to gain a healing advantage too, by forcing the druid to rely on lifebloom blooms and healing touches.
this is an instance where having a mut build is better than a combat build, thanks to the increased resistance against abolish as well as the resistance to root and stronger heals.
your best bet is to probably chain blind and mind control to allow you to get some time on the warrior. just start burning the warrior while your priest LoS's the druid (to avoid cyclone). the warrior can only focus on one of you at a time, so if hes on your priest, KS him and have your priest MC him and run him away (he may trinket this, but itll give you at least another second or two of time to act). if he does trinket, MC again. this is reliant on being able to avoid the feral charge and the cyclone, not to mention creating a situation where the warrior cant interrupt it.
with the war MCed, the druid is forced to do something about it (assuming war trinket is down). this means he brings himself into the open, so you take the chance to re-stealth (since youre hopefully out of combat by now). your priest then lets the warrior go, drops a fear, and proceeds to MC the druid while you lock down the warrior again. if the druid or warrior interrupts MC in some way, you blind the druid.
basically, just create a situation where the druid is forced to heal the warrior but cant because of good use of consecutive CC. use your dispel in order to gain a healing advantage too, by forcing the druid to rely on lifebloom blooms and healing touches.
this is an instance where having a mut build is better than a combat build, thanks to the increased resistance against abolish as well as the resistance to root and stronger heals.
Wow. Thoughtful and effective strategy. Rate up, I'll try practicing that w/ my priest. Arena is just like chess. And I suck at chess.
EDIT: double post.
Edited, Sep 30th 2007 1:49pm by EliminatorX
Edited, Sep 30th 2007 1:49pm by EliminatorX
With a priest druids aren't TOO hard (this strategy works better on paladins). Basically the priest mana burns the druid dry. You (the rogue) can go on either, it doesn't matter too much, just keep the warrior off the priest. It might actually help to be on the warrior so the druid has to worry not only about his mana but also about saving his or her warrior. Druids are annoying with cheeta, innervate, lifebloom, and everything else, but if your priest and you can outlast the warrior long enough to manaburn the druid dry, you should be good. Imo feral druid + warrior are harder to kill with a priest/rogue than resto, because the druid has +healing and can just go bear or cat to avoid mana burn (not 100% sure if this works, but I'm pretty sure).
If it's possible, sap the warrior and stunlock the druid. You can keep him that way for 9 seconds (a little more with good timing / lag), and the priest can get about 3 mana burns off, which I think is 3000 mana? The druid will probably have 9-10k (keep in mind these aren't exact numbers, just basing it off of what I remember from the top of my head), so the druid now has 6-7k. Then you can vanish, resap the warrior, and stunlock all over again (assuming the warrior doesn't trinket and the druid doesn't cyclone).
If it's possible, sap the warrior and stunlock the druid. You can keep him that way for 9 seconds (a little more with good timing / lag), and the priest can get about 3 mana burns off, which I think is 3000 mana? The druid will probably have 9-10k (keep in mind these aren't exact numbers, just basing it off of what I remember from the top of my head), so the druid now has 6-7k. Then you can vanish, resap the warrior, and stunlock all over again (assuming the warrior doesn't trinket and the druid doesn't cyclone).
Scholar
46 posts
In bear or cat form you still have mana considering you regenerate it while in form. Therefore you can still get mana burned in those forms - just doesn't show on screen how bad it is until you change out again.
An example of this is the Netherspite fight in Karazhan, where I usually tank in bearform, but also intercepts the green beam, which drains mana. It will drain you dry very quickly.
An example of this is the Netherspite fight in Karazhan, where I usually tank in bearform, but also intercepts the green beam, which drains mana. It will drain you dry very quickly.
gnoster wrote:
In bear or cat form you still have mana considering you regenerate it while in form. Therefore you can still get mana burned in those forms - just doesn't show on screen how bad it is until you change out again.
An example of this is the Netherspite fight in Karazhan, where I usually tank in bearform, but also intercepts the green beam, which drains mana. It will drain you dry very quickly.
An example of this is the Netherspite fight in Karazhan, where I usually tank in bearform, but also intercepts the green beam, which drains mana. It will drain you dry very quickly.
I believe that this is FALSE. I'm pretty sure I've read in other threads that a druid can't be mana burned in cat/bear form. Their mana bar is replaced with an energy/rage bar. It's true that they still regen their mana, but they can't be burned. This makes it much more difficult to use the mana burn strategy. I believe the Netherspite thing is totally different.
If this is incorrect, please let me know.
CamelToad wrote:
gnoster wrote:
In bear or cat form you still have mana considering you regenerate it while in form. Therefore you can still get mana burned in those forms - just doesn't show on screen how bad it is until you change out again.
An example of this is the Netherspite fight in Karazhan, where I usually tank in bearform, but also intercepts the green beam, which drains mana. It will drain you dry very quickly.
An example of this is the Netherspite fight in Karazhan, where I usually tank in bearform, but also intercepts the green beam, which drains mana. It will drain you dry very quickly.
I believe that this is FALSE. I'm pretty sure I've read in other threads that a druid can't be mana burned in cat/bear form. Their mana bar is replaced with an energy/rage bar. It's true that they still regen their mana, but they can't be burned. This makes it much more difficult to use the mana burn strategy. I believe the Netherspite thing is totally different.
If this is incorrect, please let me know.
Nope, mana bar exists, and it can be burned.
I realize this isn't a very good testimony, but it's not hard to find mobs that can use mana burn and get one to use it on you a few times =P
Edited, Oct 4th 2007 4:03pm by Norellicus
Strangely, though, the Blood Elves' Mana Tap ability does not work on Feral shapeshifted Druids.
...no. mana burn/drain and viper sting dont work on druids in bear/cat. at least not in pvp.
pve? maybe. i dont remember ever being burned/drained in a pve situation. in fact, i remember using bear/cat to avoid losing mana from the ignite mana debuff that baron geddon would use, and it operates under the same principle as mana burn. maybe something in BC content does, but im not personally aware of any.
best way to test it? duel a priest/hunter/warlock and have them use their respective burn/drain on you while youre in cat or bear form. youll find that the priest and warlock get errors (something along the lines of "target has no mana") and the hunter, while able to apply viper sting, will see no use from it.
pve? maybe. i dont remember ever being burned/drained in a pve situation. in fact, i remember using bear/cat to avoid losing mana from the ignite mana debuff that baron geddon would use, and it operates under the same principle as mana burn. maybe something in BC content does, but im not personally aware of any.
best way to test it? duel a priest/hunter/warlock and have them use their respective burn/drain on you while youre in cat or bear form. youll find that the priest and warlock get errors (something along the lines of "target has no mana") and the hunter, while able to apply viper sting, will see no use from it.
Maybe a bug then, or pve only; because I definitely remember just last night being in BEM and fighting *something* (can't remember what for the life of me though >.<) and getting hit by Mana Burn after shifting into form...as soon as he finished casting, I got my SCT low mana warning (and I was already well into shifted form).
Thanks for backing me up on that Quor. I was pretty sure about that.
Eliminator,
Quor is right, in that there isn't much that we can do. A well played resto druid is one of the toughest opponents in the arenas. Combine them with a rogues worst enemy, and it makes a pretty tough combo to beat.
I don't have much experience in that level, so take everything I say with a grain of salt. The druid is only going to show himself when absolutely necessary. So getting a sap off on the warrior really isn't going to help you win unless you can find some way to expose the druid.
With that said, I think your best bet is to CC the druid. There's no way you're going to get a sap off, so blind is really your only option. You're not going to be able to chain blind (3 min CD unless you've got Prep LOL), so you need to make sure it sticks. You need to save it until after they've trinketed. Have your priest try to get into scream range to bait the druid into trinketing out. He's likely to get cycloned, which he'll have to trinket out of to get the scream off. You're not going to be able to stand toe to toe with a warrior for long, so your priest needs to keep you up and keep the HoTs off the warrior while staying out of LoS of the druid, while you try to rush the warrior down. Peel off the warrior to blind the druid if he trinkets out of the scream. If not, you've got 8 seconds to get the warrior down.
Seems like your best shot to me.
Good luck
-Camel
Eliminator,
Quor is right, in that there isn't much that we can do. A well played resto druid is one of the toughest opponents in the arenas. Combine them with a rogues worst enemy, and it makes a pretty tough combo to beat.
I don't have much experience in that level, so take everything I say with a grain of salt. The druid is only going to show himself when absolutely necessary. So getting a sap off on the warrior really isn't going to help you win unless you can find some way to expose the druid.
With that said, I think your best bet is to CC the druid. There's no way you're going to get a sap off, so blind is really your only option. You're not going to be able to chain blind (3 min CD unless you've got Prep LOL), so you need to make sure it sticks. You need to save it until after they've trinketed. Have your priest try to get into scream range to bait the druid into trinketing out. He's likely to get cycloned, which he'll have to trinket out of to get the scream off. You're not going to be able to stand toe to toe with a warrior for long, so your priest needs to keep you up and keep the HoTs off the warrior while staying out of LoS of the druid, while you try to rush the warrior down. Peel off the warrior to blind the druid if he trinkets out of the scream. If not, you've got 8 seconds to get the warrior down.
Seems like your best shot to me.
Good luck
-Camel
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