2.3 Warrior ChangesFollow

The ONLY change is that it simply scales better now, at already scaled with +dmg (since all +dmg is also +heal). But, with the amount of +dmg a shadow priest will have, it'll probably be a nerf due to change in base absorption. This is only a buff to make it so shield isn't quite the POS it is for healing right now.

Ok, I've just logged on now to check on an progress on the proposed 2.3 changes, and found out that the Weapon Mastery Nerf that I (and a few others) was so upset about is now a little less of an issue. It appears that ALL disarm immunity effects have been nerfed (that includes Weapon Chain) to be 50% duration instead of immunity.

That makes me a little happier .. I now just need to make sure I get my disarm macro close at hand and use it as often as possible against rogues and warriors (The only classes who can disarm me, and who would have either WM or a weapon chain).

ofc, if I see the fancy enchant glow on a rogues dagger, it just means that he'll be without his weapon for a full 10 seconds, not 5 secs (if he had a weapon chain)

Feeling a lot better now, at least it isn't a total warrior nerf ... other melee classes get affected as well.

Yup, don't get me wrong ... I don't like it one bit. I was livid yesterday when I thought that I would be in a situation where the rogue I tried to disarm had a chance to be immune, while he could disarm me (unless I had a weapon chain, in so doing giving up 70 ap). Now that that's not the case, I feel mildly better about the whole thing ... still far from happy, but a bit better.

And yeah, I agree, Thunder had 55 Sta, so a disarm is like a 550 hit right there (You get the Sta back when you get your weapon back, but not the HP that you originally lost). Another disarm would be another 550 hit ... that's gonna hurt !

Edited, Sep 28th 2007 11:13am by robertlofthouse

the talent point is a good one to a degree, but you'll be hard pressed to find a rogue that doesnt think riposte is at least decent. you get SS-level damage (if not a bit better) for a fraction of the energy cost, as well as 5% more melee mitigation + an attack speed increase on your main hand (parry serves as a haste effect to your MH attack; thus parrying an attack immeidately after swinging with your MH will result in your MH swinging again at a rate of about 40-60% faster, depending on a few factors).

so in other words, yes, rogues need to "use up" talents for riposte/parry that could be used elsewhere, but most will agree that the reward is well worth the cost.

Almost all end-game arena PvP Rogues--which is pretty much like saying "all PvP Rogues" since that really seems to be the only kind of PvP that matters anymore--are Combat. So that point is kind of moot.

because weapon skill is overpowered.



eh, as long as there's a mortal strike in the arms tree and an imp execute in the fury tree, warriors will have a role in pvp and raids that does not include tanking.

Hey, I agree with you both ... but in my experience - that opinion is waaay in the minority. Most players you talk to will look down on you for not being a prot spec warrior. I have NEVER received an invite to a group as a warrior where I was not expected to be the tank. That's just the cold hard truth.

I had myself spec'd Fury with quest rewards / world drops / BS crafted items. My AP (unbuffed) was 1650, crit chance in Battle was 25%, and hit rating was 155. I could constantly ouput 700-800 dps against big targets (targets that lasted longer than a few seconds).

I only ever ran 1 SL and 1 SV (non heroic) and topped the damage charts both times, ahead of a mage and rogue in the one and a mage and lock in the other. These are the only 2 runs I've been accepted into as a DPS warrior, hence the reason for running only these, and with my non-instance gear - I kicked ***. (Besides, I can't really say that I enjoy instances ... maybe I'll enjoy them more with my Mage, but I doubt it)

My point is that the majority of the community seems to see us as a Tank only, even though we can do (more than) our fair share of the damage. Now it appears that Blizz seems to be pushing (very subtly) that same Point of View.

Anyway, my opinion, so take it which ever way you see fit ;)

i think it will be jim.

it had better be anyway. if it doesnt outpace the threat gen from imp Tclap (for arms anyway) and revenge...then theres really no purpose. if youve got enough rage to use revenge, Tclap and keep sunder up as well as using MS, then you're probably going to die soon.

Don't have a problem with warlocks when I am playing my warrior. Once you know how to deal with their fears, they are chopped to pieces before they can do much draining. It's a different story if you are busy with somebody else and they (the locks) are standing in the back and drain. In that case though, you wouldn't have a MS debuff on that player...

What I don't understand about the MS/drain change: Why would you let a lock in MS (melee) range drain you?

I'm looking at this as something that needed fixed for logical reasons, but it's probably not gonna be something that'll have a major impact - if any.

I really don't understand why you refer to the whole change of disarm immunity as a Warrior nerf. Blizzard has changed the entire way disarm works with the change. Not only Warriors got "nerfed" EVERY melee class got nerfed. I think that when you think deeply about it, you might see that Warriors actually got the upper hand.
Now, everyone can be disarmed as weapon chains no longer makes you immune, therefore Warriors, Paladins(retribution mostly), Shamans(enhancement mostly), Hunters and Rogues can be disarmed as well, I'm refering of course only to the classes that might melee you(the ones that actually care, feral druids don't really care about that I guess).
So, who can disarm? ONLY Warriors and Rogues, who can be disarmed? Everyone! NO one is immune anymore. Why is that a nerf?! You'll be disarmed as a Warrior and be ineffective for X seconds? So what? Warriors are one of the two classes that can disarm. On top of that you can get the ability to have another disarm duration reduction(if they stack, even more fun) and ONLY Warriors gets the extra ability.
You should only expect disarms from Warriors and Rogues.
Warriors are all "nerfed" equally, so it's fair in that aspect.
Rogues have a totally different mechanics of disarm, if you disarm them first, they wouldn't be able to parry for 10/5 seconds and they wouldn't be able to disarm you back(Unless I'm mistaken and you can parry without a weapon, though I doubt it).
Enhancement shamans ARE nerfed against Warriors/Rogues in that aspect. They can still cast, true, but you force them to cast when YOU want them to. Same goes for retribution Paladins. If you are fast enough to disarm that Hunter, he won't be able to wingclip you as well(yes, he has a ton of other abilities to use, but then again, Hunters don't really care for melee much).

Explain to me again, how is it a Warrior nerf when EVERYONE gets affected the same, but Warriors are on of the only 2 classes that can disarm?
The way I see it, Blizzard has returned disarm it's viabilty, and gave Warriors and Rogues some love.
The only way Warriors are truly nerfed by being disarmable, is in PvE, I don't think there are enough disarming mobs for that to matter.

If you want to sacrifice your Savagery/Mongoose/Crusader/+healing/whatever enchant on your weapon for weapon chain(Again, if it stacks with WM) to have lower disarmed periods, that's your call, just know that EVERYONE else will still be disarmable, no matter which enchant did they bring on theirs.

Point taken. And thanks for the info about stacking them. Not as good as I thought/hoped, but still give Warriors more options than other classes.
Thank you.

P.S. It's not a disarm nerf, it's a disarm buff :)

yeah, enh shaman arent really affected by disarm; they can still stormstrike for full damage while its up, they just cant get any WF procs on the MH if disarmed.

a common tactic of giving rogues hell is to sometimes keep a pet on them, thus making it so the rogue has to rely on vanish to gain stealth (which is spotty at best in some cases). this is especially popular with teams that have two pet classes (double lock or hunter + lock). now, anytime a rogue with riposte parries that pet attack they can switch to the warrior and disarm him. three seconds might not sound like a lot, but it can and will make or break some match ups.

but we shall endure. we always do.